-
Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
ScotRail HST Introduction - Updates & Discussion
- Thread starter Clansman
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
Northhighland
Member
- Joined
- 19 Aug 2016
- Messages
- 606
Assume that GWR power cars are not exactly the same as LNER ones? Understood LNER ones had significant upgrades?
Don’t see then why we can’t get similar reliability to all other HST operators. XC setts seem to leave Wabtec and go straight into service. Castle sets seem to work fine.
Something seems not to add up here.
Agreed - Plenty not adding up.
Are the Scotrail HSTs GEC or Brush Traction motored?
sprinterguy
Established Member
They've got all the GEC traction motor fitted examples, and a few Brush ones.
fgwrich
Established Member
There in lies one of the issues. The GEC motored ones always seem to be the trickiest ones to keep reliable, although Landore (where they were allocated) did manage to get them to settle down quite nicely. I suppose this could in part be history repeating itself as they take some time to settle in with their new operators.
All of the GEC ones were with Angel along with some Brush and didn't Porterbrook have all Brush. If so time for Angel to buy some Brush TMs when they go for scrap...
Speed43125
Member
Today, at least for me on the HML, the proportion of HSTs seemed pretty good, quite a number of services throughout the day with refurbs, and the remaining few operating DMUs. This seems to have been the case since at least Wednesday on the HML, things seem to be getting better... At least compared to the worsening mess earlier this month and in September.
Highland37
Established Member
- Joined
- 29 Jun 2012
- Messages
- 1,259
What were the actual numbers?
What services ran as HST then today cause going by journeycheck not many at all
NewSt
Member
Does anyone happen to know what services are operated by a HST today? Am in Scotland until this afternoon and would love to catch one.
coppercapped
Established Member
Assuming you have remembered correctly, how is that going to work? Will sets due for a power car change work to Haymarket where the exchange takes place or is it intended to work the power cars 'light engine' from Haymarket to Inverness and vice versa? Whose responsibility is it that the whole rake works properly when coupled up? I can see plenty of opportunities for buck passing.
Anyway, it doesn't appear to be a very clever solution whichever way round it is supposed to happen.
jamieintercity
Member
- Joined
- 20 Mar 2012
- Messages
- 707
Seen a STP 1353 Doncaster to haymarket depot move on RTT, scheduled to run on tuesday. Could that be HA19 coming north?
That's a very strange path since it's not coming from the works site it's coming from the platform
47271
Established Member
- Joined
- 28 Apr 2015
- Messages
- 2,983
Booked HSTs so far this morning:
0707 Queen Street-Inverness running as a 170
0735 Aberdeen-Queen Street running as a 170
0707 Queen Street-Inverness running as a 170
0735 Aberdeen-Queen Street running as a 170
Highland37
Established Member
- Joined
- 29 Jun 2012
- Messages
- 1,259
How close to departure do they change stock? Are these 170s waiting in the same area?
Sorry to report but the 0735 is a booked 170 now
About 3/4am they know the formations of stock so whatever is lying around to replace then they use that
Goldromans
Member
- Joined
- 11 Feb 2017
- Messages
- 222
I would imagine (and hope) the idea is that planned maintenance takes place at the designated depot (power cars at Haymarket and coaches at Inverness) but with all depots being able to carry out any unplanned maintenance/repairs.
47271
Established Member
- Joined
- 28 Apr 2015
- Messages
- 2,983
Ah right, well that makes things more straightforward. A planned inadequate service rather than an unplanned one.
I thought that it was a late substitution because there were no seat reservations.
To be fair the train wasn't overcrowded today, but it often can be.
stuart
Member
Well, I finally got to travel on a refurb. Only a short trip, Stirling to Glasgow on Friday (I think it was a service ex Aberdeen), and only in standard class. But still very nice. Looking forward to seeing these (reliably and predictably) in service on the Highland Main Line.
coppercapped
Established Member
I still don't see how that is supposed to work.
Will Inverness also hold some power car spares and Haymarket some coach bits? Can Haymarket accept a four or five coach rake and swap a power car or cars? Is it intended to swap power cars from one rake to another at Inverness?
The issue is that the service interval for the power cars is shorter than that for the coaches - apart from items such as brake pad replacement - so it will be necessary to change power cars at regular intervals. At integrated maintenance depots - Old Oak Common, St Philip's Marsh, Laira and Landore it was easy to plan and execute such swaps as all the necessary parts of the train were at the same place.
It seems to me that forty years of experience has been ignored.
Esker-pades
Established Member
ScotRail don't have that experience though.
47271
Established Member
- Joined
- 28 Apr 2015
- Messages
- 2,983
Did it not occur to them to ask the people who do?
Esker-pades
Established Member
It's going to take a while to learn 40 years worth of experience.
47271
Established Member
- Joined
- 28 Apr 2015
- Messages
- 2,983
Fair enough, but @coppercapped is saying that there may be a fundamental failure in maintenance strategy. That's a bit more than day to day learning.
Given the Scrapheap Challenge scene we see as we pass Haymarket depot every day, and the very patchy service delivered, it's difficult to argue against the point without clear evidence to the contrary.
Esker-pades
Established Member
I don't necessarily disagree. I'm generally willing to give ScotRail the benefit of the doubt, but the more this goes on, the more I can't. Not having the industry knowledge means I can't provide much evidence either way. Not very convincing, I know.
Northhighland
Member
- Joined
- 19 Aug 2016
- Messages
- 606
December looms large the latest date were promised significant improvement. Unless there is a shed at Doncaster bursting with finished stock it isn’t going to happen.
Surely some political heat will be brought this time. At this rate we are looking at another summer of short formed trains
That would be unacceptable.
Surely some political heat will be brought this time. At this rate we are looking at another summer of short formed trains
That would be unacceptable.
Highland37
Established Member
- Joined
- 29 Jun 2012
- Messages
- 1,259
It is already unacceptable. There is no chance they will be in the position they said they would come December. Or maybe all these sets are out of service to make doubly sure they are ready for December? Basically the operator and stock can't provide the service.
The simple fact is come December all hell is going to break loose when scotrail lose the use of classic HST sets watch the amount of two car sets doing central belt to Inverness/Aberdeen services.
Look at today for example to see how unreliable they are 0707 glasgow to Inverness 170/158 combo vice HST
0834 Edinburgh-Inverness is 158 X2 vice HST
2200 Aberdeen to Inverness is a 170 vice HST
And the 1208 glasgow to Inverness got as far as Perth and no crew to take north also meant the 1554 fully cancelled and the 1939 Edinburgh-Inverness tonight starts in Perth
Look at today for example to see how unreliable they are 0707 glasgow to Inverness 170/158 combo vice HST
0834 Edinburgh-Inverness is 158 X2 vice HST
2200 Aberdeen to Inverness is a 170 vice HST
And the 1208 glasgow to Inverness got as far as Perth and no crew to take north also meant the 1554 fully cancelled and the 1939 Edinburgh-Inverness tonight starts in Perth
Highland37
Established Member
- Joined
- 29 Jun 2012
- Messages
- 1,259
Do they have enough non HST stock for that?
- Status