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New trains for East Midlands Franchise

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Jozhua

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When is Liverpool - Norwich going to another operator? Next year or 2021, doubt they'll put 170s on it...

Will the current 158's stay on the line or will they go with the current fleet? Guess it depends on what operator takes them, hopefully 158's will stay though, I dislike 185s...
 
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VT 390

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When is Liverpool - Norwich going to another operator? Next year or 2021, doubt they'll put 170s on it...

Will the current 158's stay on the line or will they go with the current fleet? Guess it depends on what operator takes them, hopefully 158's will stay though, I dislike 185s...
As that route is being split at Nottingham it is likely that EMR will operate the Nottingham to Norwich part with 170's and the Liverpool to Nottingham will either go to Northern or TPE, if TPE get it then I would have thought they would operate it with 185's.
 

edwin_m

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I would expect ELR to keep some 158s up to the handover date for Liverpool-Nottingham - if this is after the big timetable change they may split the service at that point but not transfer it until later. As I understand it both Northern and TPE are being asked to bid to operate this service. TPE would presumably make arrangements to keep the 185s it planned to return to the owners. The Northern bid would have to define the stock they would use, which might be taking over the 158s, taking over the 185s or something else entirely.
 

TH172341

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What about the Ex Scottish 171s, they are staying with Southern, right?

The ex Scottish units that are owned by Eversholt Rail will be transferring to East Mids Railway and the two centre carriages from the two four carriage versions put back into the two carriage ones to form a standardised operation of three cars.

In regards to the remaining four 171s I would suspect CrossCountry or Chiltern Railways (or their successors should that occur) would be candidates. Likewise the 170/6 centre cars if those are not snapped up by EMR.
 

Jozhua

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As that route is being split at Nottingham it is likely that EMR will operate the Nottingham to Norwich part with 170's and the Liverpool to Nottingham will either go to Northern or TPE, if TPE get it then I would have thought they would operate it with 185's.

I would expect ELR to keep some 158s up to the handover date for Liverpool-Nottingham - if this is after the big timetable change they may split the service at that point but not transfer it until later. As I understand it both Northern and TPE are being asked to bid to operate this service. TPE would presumably make arrangements to keep the 185s it planned to return to the owners. The Northern bid would have to define the stock they would use, which might be taking over the 158s, taking over the 185s or something else entirely.

Thanks, I'll go debate the pros and cons of each in a more relevant thread.
 

Prestige15

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As that route is being split at Nottingham it is likely that EMR will operate the Nottingham to Norwich part with 170's and the Liverpool to Nottingham will either go to Northern or TPE, if TPE get it then I would have thought they would operate it with 185's.


It has been by mention by Modern Rail and TPE that if the Liv - Nott are run by TPE they will use Nova 3 while the Liverpool - Scarborough service will be run by mostly paired 185's (Nova 4 i like to call them)
 

VT 390

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It has been by mention by Modern Rail and TPE that if the Liv - Nott are run by TPE they will use Nova 3 while the Liverpool - Scarborough service will be run by mostly paired 185's (Nova 4 i like to call them)
Is there not a depot or stabling facility for the Nova 3's at Scarborough meaning they will need to operate this route?
 

swt_passenger

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Is there not a depot or stabling facility for the Nova 3's at Scarborough meaning they will need to operate this route?
It’s only a stabling sidings with cleaning, refuelling and CET emptying etc. AIUI. Could probably be used for anything if needed, with only minor modifications. Nothing there that ties any stock to that route..
 

class 9

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It would be a surprise if they used Nova 3s on a LIV-NOT service, as all the traction training for York crews will go to waste.
 

Prestige15

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It would be a surprise if they used Nova 3s on a LIV-NOT service, as all the traction training for York crews will go to waste.
Not necessary as theres been no mention on removing the N3 off the Middlesborough service. The NOTT-LIV service would probably require 6-7 sets.
 

edwin_m

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Would the Nova 3 sets need timings slackening? With a heavy locomotive they will have less acceleration than a 158 (or 185) and unlike a 158 won't be able to exploit Sprinter differential speeds. With virtually none of the route cleared about 90mph their higher top speed won't count for much (although EMR can maintain timings with a 75mph 156 in the formation).
 

LowLevel

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Would the Nova 3 sets need timings slackening? With a heavy locomotive they will have less acceleration than a 158 (or 185) and unlike a 158 won't be able to exploit Sprinter differential speeds. With virtually none of the route cleared about 90mph their higher top speed won't count for much (although EMR can maintain timings with a 75mph 156 in the formation).

I'd be surprised if a 68 on 5 coaches is slower than a 158 on takeoff! They certainly shoot along on the Chiltern sets.
 

ainsworth74

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A gentle reminder that this thread is about new trains for East Midlands Railway so whilst the chat about what may or may not happen with TPEs fleet of trains is interesting it's also very off-topic! Please can we try and focus on the topic of this thread. If anyone wants to carry on about possible changes to TPEs rolling stock strategy they are more than welcome to do so on a new thread :)
 

RealTrains07

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SPADTrap

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Unlesa its 225 then their is no difference between either HST stock. EMR seem to not have a consistent plan when it comes to precuring stock
Except the better toilet in standard and general interior and sockets at seats.
 

swt_passenger

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Unless its 225 then their is no difference between either HST stock. EMR seem to not have a consistent plan when it comes to precuring stock

I presume this wont stop the 180s from being transferred over?
That’s not correct, IIRC. It’s previously been confirmed somewhere in the many discussions in these forums that the ECML HSTs are more compliant with the latest rules than those on the MML.
 

Roast Veg

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Yes, the compliance spreadsheet was distributed in this thread somewhere, and the list of works required on the MML sets was longer than for either the ECML or GWR sets, which were broadly similar.
 

Doomotron

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Yes, the compliance spreadsheet was distributed in this thread somewhere, and the list of works required on the MML sets was longer than for either the ECML or GWR sets, which were broadly similar.
If so, why get LNER sets? They can get the GWR sets right now but the LNER ones are still in service. They could have got rid of the HSTs ages ago.
 

WesternLancer

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I'm now regularly finding myself on DDA compliant EMR DMU stock with in coach screens on displaying utterly incorrect destination and calling pattern information. These are not corrected with announcements, nor switched off despite the scope for confusion - it's confusing for people with no impairment, never mind what it would be like if you needed to rely on them due to hearing loss!

Are we to assume that it's all OK if the stock is fitted with DDA complaint modifications, and no need to worry if that modification does not work / gives completely erroneous information?
 

WesternLancer

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If so, why get LNER sets? They can get the GWR sets right now but the LNER ones are still in service. They could have got rid of the HSTs ages ago.
heaven help anyone with a std class ticket who was asked to travel on an ex GWR HST set...I assume you are familiar with the interiors?
 
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