Killingworth
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Indeed, 3 again today.
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TPE services allocated for Double units
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Indeed, 3 again today.
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Jamesrob637
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Didn't see 06:26 Cleethorpes to Airport as it was a bit late but wouldn't be surprised if it was only 3-car again this morning
Yep. I get it Mon-Thur and the only day it's been 6 car was that first Monday.
Pretty certain even the 0505 Cleethorpes to Airport - which has been booked as 6 car since I started this commute a year ago - was 3 car as the rest of its diagram is 3 car on JourneyCheck.
johnnychips
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^ yes the 0708 from Sheffield was only three coaches despite being announced as six, splitting at Manchester. Same happened yesterday.
OrangeJuice
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Could this be due to the 802's not consistently running and needing the 185's to cover?
Jamesrob637
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Maybe just don't run anything more than what is already scheduled as 6 until next month's timetable change?
Incorrect.
Killingworth
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This is ridiculous. Here on South Pennine we'd become used to 6 cars on the 7.09 from Sheffield most Monday-Thursdays for about 2 years and more recently also on Fridays. Nova trains are filtering into service yet we've fallen back to 3. More trains in service but fewer for us. It doesn't add up.
Of course my friend from York is even less impressed with his frequent journeys to Scarborough. Trains cancelled but fancy new trains sit in the platform and set off bang on time with no passengers. Last 3 journeys, 2 cancelled and 3rd 27 minutes late. What a way to run a railway. Where have all the 185s really gone?
Of course my friend from York is even less impressed with his frequent journeys to Scarborough. Trains cancelled but fancy new trains sit in the platform and set off bang on time with no passengers. Last 3 journeys, 2 cancelled and 3rd 27 minutes late. What a way to run a railway. Where have all the 185s really gone?
As posted above two 185s covering Scottish services for broken 350s.
Killingworth
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Which begs the question why has TPE got so little in reserve? How many Nova units are in regular revenue earning service anywhere?
At best 4 Novas in service. Rest of the 185s being maintained I presume, and much needed too given the number of different faults I've endured over the last few weeks that are increasing.
Jamesrob637
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There are one or two again today. I think the 350s are very stretched to the limit with one having already left for the West Midlands. Certainly TPE cannot run any 8-car 350s at the moment apart from the odd early morning and late night empty stock movement.
Jamesrob637
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06:26 Cleethorpes to Airport was 3 again today. Not sure about the previous hour. Nothing on Journey Check for either.
Here’s an idea - why not take the crew off that “fancy new train” and get them to work a Class 185, which TPE have just sitting around all over the network. Forget the training that they need to have on the new traction, surely with the excessive numbers of Class 185s kicking around it’ll be fine...
Perhaps you should take some time when travelling to speak with the staff, who are usually very accommodating of my questions. Understand things such as autumn - where trains require extra maintenance. Traction training for new drivers on 185's etc
Always amazes me when travelling, when people go 'why not put more carriages on?' - like there's an unlimited resource available. What do you expect TPE to do, cancel another train to make yours 6 car? Be patient.
TPE chose (and TfN / the "Rail North Partnership" [i.e. DfT in practice]) to return one 350 over the summer, continuing the "8 from 9" diagramming that has worked predictably poorly since the unit was lost to the road vehicle collision: that unit was returned after lengthy repairs, and what should have happened was TPE returning to "8 from 10" until the 397s are ready to take over in squadron service. Doing that would have reduced the pressure on the 185 fleet by a small but not insignificant amount, particualrly in the context of 185s no longer being as reliable as they were (itself arguably a product of the fleet being pushed harder).
That TfN did not push for the 350 to be retained has been, let's say, not uncontroversial in the city regions of the North, and not just west of the Hill!
That TfN did not push for the 350 to be retained has been, let's say, not uncontroversial in the city regions of the North, and not just west of the Hill!
I guess not completely inaccurate but still a strange way to describe a horse (two actually)!
Killingworth
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I wonder how many daily travellers (I'm an occasional user towards Manchester or Grimsby from Sheffield) paying £4000 for an annual season ticket and regularly have to stand would share that patience? Amazingly they must because they report each day for more of the same. Patient masochism more like.
Users do speak to staff but have been promised 6 cars for well over 2 years and the 7.12 from Sheffield was made up to that all that time ago, on most days Monday - Thursday. Work from home Fridays. We're currently going backwards.
Users sympathise with the train crews and can understand why services last night and this morning have been cancelled due to the very heavy rain and floods. The closure of the line for 5 days at the time of the Whaley Bridge dam crisis may, with hindsight, have been over cautious, but it was understood.
Trying to explain why a different type of train (350403) hitting horses caused difficulty for so many months has been difficult to follow. It's one thing after another. Broken windscreens from bird stikes. Faulty doors. Lack of guards/drivers. Late arrival of an incoming train. The plain fact is there aren't enough trains to fulfil the full diagrams and cover routine maintenance and training with a reasonable reserve.
That's not an issue restricted to TPE, but is the topic here. Patience is wearing thin, you're right. I'm sure the patience of crews and those trying to turn out trouble free trains must be under great stress too.
I've read the Beeching report and well recall the days when there were many thousands of musty old coaches creakily rolled out of sidings for summer specials. I well remember having the choice of many empty compartments on 1950s services. I wouldn't advocate going all the way back to that. However, there was much to be said for more flexible trains. When a 5 car train is normally filled running 4 cars instead isn't too bad. 3 instead of 6, or 2 instead of 4, is seriously bad news. This isn't an issue restricted to TPE or 185s.
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Jozhua
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That's a fair point, doesn't help rolling stock costs so much now either!
I personally wonder wether locos+driving cabs could be a solution to cheaper rolling stock. Definitely things are way overcomplicated now though. The endless computers/electronics would be fair enough if they didn't balloon the cost and contribute to delays. All we want is a box with wheels and some seats!
Jamesrob637
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So Fridays and weekends for now, nothing on South TPE is allocated 6-car because the attitude is that with more people working from home or not working at all, it's not justified?
6 coach trains have been running Monday to Friday for quite some time now.
Weekends will follow when there is more stock available.
Killingworth
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Had been running for quite some time, and prior to that had been running Monday - Thursday for at least a year or two.
The issue for users now is that they have yet to establish regular 6 car workings as standard and to be relied upon.
I know of a surgeon living in Sheffield and working in Manchester. A regular first class commuter, he could accept not getting a seat and space to work once. Before Christmas he had to squat on the floor to use his laptop. Never again and he's still telling anyone who mentions railways the same story. He has a nice comfortable Mercedes and most days uses that. It runs to the timetable he sets, doesn't get cancelled and he always has a seat.
It's the same problem with any business that forgets why customers use the service or commodity, preoccupied with its own internal issues. Having worked for 3 national companies over many decades I've seen it from different perspectives. Some loyal customers will be lost if there's a viable alternative.
Sadly regular travellers are indeed being lost. Thanks to the 3 car Friday provision more are working from home on Fridays, or using the car. The result is that at my station Friday loadings are only a little over half the other 4 days. That's a much greater loss of users than for other trains on Friday compared with the rest of the week, and evidenced by the spaces in the car park at 7.30. Chicken and egg?
Provide the space and users will come back, but only when word gets round that it can be relied on.
Getting the trains to run every day and to time is probably harder than getting the extra coaches into service, but users between Sheffield and Manchester are expressing preference for EMR's 4 car 158s.
Jamesrob637
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12:45 Airport to Middlesbrough must be a double on Saturdays at least... only today it's a single after Victoria due to a fault with the front unit which has now proceeded empty to the depot!
johnnychips
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0708 Sheffield to Airport double set today!
Killingworth
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Back to what it was, now for the 8.08.
Four years after the franchise agreement was signed, it is now a cause for celebration when the peak trains are strengthened.
It would appear that a 185 has been stolen today for the Anglo-Scot services.
Which is usually the first to reverse to a 3 car set in this case?
Sam
Which is usually the first to reverse to a 3 car set in this case?
Sam
Jamesrob637
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Still been on the wrong shifts last week this week and next week: how have things been?
johnnychips
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^Double on 0708 from Sheffield again this morning.
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