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WM Trains cancelled service...

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exbrel

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hi,
any help most welcomed, my daughter and her partner bought a thru ticket off Trainline between STOKE ON TRENT and EDINBURGH on Nov.8th dep. stoke at 0812 to Crewe, then the 0909 Virgin to Edinburgh. Whilst they waited from 0740 it kept showing as delayed 8mins, to 30mins, as they needed to catch the Crewe train to Edinburgh, at approx. 0820 she asked her sister who had come to see them off, if she could run them to Crewe, which she did, arriving at Crewe at 9ish, and a bit of luck the train was 6mins late. On Realtime Trains UID O56920 9T10, Is shown as cancelled , stating this service was cancelled due to a unknown cause (M1). Would she be able to claim?
 
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Starmill

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In theory a refund of the difference between the ticket price paid and the price of what was used could be claimed. If it were an Advance ticket, that might be next to impossible to calculate, and it may very well be £0.

Some form of compensation could be claimed from West Midlands Trains for the cost of driving from Stoke-on-Trent to Crewe, but they may not agree to make such a payment. In my view they most certainly should do so.

How much were the tickets? What sort of value of compensation do you think might be fair?
 

30907

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If she had waited for the next train, she would of course have been able to claim Delay Repay (2hr) from WMT. She may have had good reasons for not wanting such a delay, but a mail to Customer Relations at WMT might produce a goodwill gesture.
 

yorkie

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hi,
any help most welcomed, my daughter and her partner bought a thru ticket off Trainline between STOKE ON TRENT and EDINBURGH on Nov.8th dep. stoke at 0812 to Crewe, then the 0909 Virgin to Edinburgh. Whilst they waited from 0740 it kept showing as delayed 8mins, to 30mins, as they needed to catch the Crewe train to Edinburgh, at approx. 0820 she asked her sister who had come to see them off, if she could run them to Crewe, which she did, arriving at Crewe at 9ish, and a bit of luck the train was 6mins late. On Realtime Trains UID O56920 9T10, Is shown as cancelled , stating this service was cancelled due to a unknown cause (M1). Would she be able to claim?
If the tickets were used, a refund cannot be claimed. If they were wholly unused, a full refund can be claimed.

If it had been a combination of tickets e.g. from Stoke to Crewe plus Crewe to Edinburgh then the first ticket could have been fully refunded, but that isn't an option as you held a through ticket.

However it may be worth asking for a goodwill gesture from the relevant train company (ie. West Midlands Trains in this case) given that they only avoided delay by starting the journey at Crewe and choosing to use their own means to get there.

If they had not used their own means to get to Crewe, and had instead taken the next available trains, they would have got a 100% refund in delay compensation, so they saved WMT a lot of money by doing that, so you'd hope WMT would appreciate that.

I agree with @Starmill that there is no automatic entitlement to claim compensation in your specific circumstance but it would be pragmatic and the right thing for WMT to do so. It's worth a try!
 

sd0733

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If it was the 8th though there was an EMR service that would get to Crewe in time for the 09:09 off Crewe and even the 08:12 ran albeit 30 late so behind the EMR but still would get there in time
There are 2 headcodes for the WM, one from Northampton (the delayed one) and another from New Street so I presume they planned on restarting it at New Street but in the end sent it through which is the cancelled one.
 

sheff1

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So, the delayed 0812 made the connection at Crewe and, depending on the ticket held, it might have been possible to catch the 0834 operated by East Midlands Railway which also made the connection.

I think you need to be much clearer on why you think "a claim" may be appropriate.
 

exbrel

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thanks for all replies, I,ve checked Realtime Trains and it shows the 0812 was 29mins late at Stoke and left at 0841, arriving in Crewe at 0908. The EMR 0834 to Crewe, departed Stoke at 0838 arriving in Crewe at 0903, that's why I advised her to go on the 0812 as that would give them approx. 35-40mins to find what platform and how to get there with baggage, the EMR would have only give them 6mins. Also why is the 0812 on Realtime Trains down as cancelled? as to claiming, I thought if it was cancelled or as it now shows 35mins late... the ticket was Off Peak Return Stoke to Crewe then Crewe to Edinburgh total £225 for the 2 of them...
 

Starmill

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Oh, well, that's easy. You can apply for a refund of the Stoke-on-Trent to Crewe ticket (unless you used the return portion already?)
 

Hadders

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The thing you have to consider is the overall seat to your journey. My making your own arrangements at the start when there was disruption meant you arrived on time. Therefore you cannot claim for a delay because you weren’t delayed in arriving at your destination.

Had you not made your own arrangements you may well have been delayed in arriving at Edinburgh and could therefore have made a claim.

I would write to the train company, stating what happened, and ask them to consider a goodwill gesture on account of your own arrangements potentially saving them from having to pay a large delay repay claim.
 

AnkleBoots

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It seems a shame to have made an unnecessary trip by road when the railway would got them there. Also,

- Off Peak Return - there was no obligation to take the exact trains shown on Trainline (not sure if there was confusion about this)
- Trainline tends to add charges that Virgin etc would not
- A member of staff might have advised on alternative services
- A TwoTogether railcard might have saved money on part of this trip
 

exbrel

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thanks again all, it was a spur of the moment panic, the 0812 showing late running, the EMR not giving much connection time, and her sister saying she could take them to Crewe, and having reserved seating on the 0909 to Edinburgh. Perhaps a rail card for the future but they don't hardly use trains much. They used the return portion and only had about 10mins to make the connection at Crewe, so the railways are not flavour of the month for them at the moment...
 

Hadders

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A Two Together Railcard often pays for itself in one trip. The break even point is £90 pre-discount.

No need to worry about missing a train, you can get the next one and if your overall journey is delayed as a result submit a delay repay claim!
 

island

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It does not appear the passengers arrived late in this instance so no compensation is payable.

As mentioned above there is little to be lost by writing in asking for something as a goodwill gesture.
 

voyagerdude220

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A Two Together Railcard often pays for itself in one trip. The break even point is £90 pre-discount.

Although the OP wouldn't have been able to use a two together railcard on this particular journey, as you can't use a two together until after 09:30 on weekdays. (off topic, but personally I'd like to see all railcards given the same time restrictions)
 

yorkie

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Although the OP wouldn't have been able to use a two together railcard on this particular journey, as you can't use a two together until after 09:30 on weekdays. (off topic, but personally I'd like to see all railcards given the same time restrictions)
Agreed (on all counts)

However such a journey could utilise a Two Together Railcard for the vast majority of it if the booking was made on an accredited ticket splitting site such as Loco2, Trainsplit etc.

Anyway probably nothing more can be added until @exbrel gets back to us with an update regarding what WMT say. However even then, if WMT refuse compensation I see no way to force them to pay anything as I do not think there is a contractual right to it (just a moral one!) given the particular circumstances.
 

exbrel

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hi,
just to update, I passed onto my daughter the advice etc given, and thanks to all for that, but she says for the first part of the journey Stoke to Crewe its not worth the bother, has they caught the Edinburgh train ok. If that one had been missed then she would have complained... but thanks again for all replies.
 
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