• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Most powerfully hauled passenger trains

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
22 Aug 2019
Messages
12
Location
Naestved Denmark
having just watched catchup of worlds most scenic rail journies - New Zealand where the train goes through Arthur’s Pass using 4x their fruit salad locos at 3300hp each, total 13,200hp....... having been on it - it’s very impressive.

I wondered what the UKs most powerfully booked passenger service in modern traction times has been (excursions aside), my guess would be in the early 70s when Euston - Glasgow services had a pair of 50’s booked north of Preston = 5400hp

Is the NZ combo the worlds best ? Or should that be asked on a different forum ?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Darandio

Established Member
Joined
24 Feb 2007
Messages
10,672
Location
Redcar
Presumably the UK would have been during the introduction of the Class 91 when they worked with Mk3's and an HST 'DVT' for a short time, that would have been in excess of 8000hp.

There is plenty of discussion in dozens of threads here about why the HST 'DVT' ended up being powered on these services, i'm not going to expand here.
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
15,162
Presumably the UK would have been during the introduction of the Class 91 when they worked with Mk3's and an HST 'DVT' for a short time, that would have been in excess of 8000hp.

There is plenty of discussion in dozens of threads here about why the HST 'DVT' ended up being powered on these services, i'm not going to expand here.
What about Eurostar sets? The 373s are 12.2MW (over 16,000hp) and the 374s are higher still at 16MW (more than 21,000hp).
 

Jamesrob637

Established Member
Joined
12 Aug 2016
Messages
5,207
What about Eurostar sets? The 373s are 12.2MW (over 16,000hp) and the 374s are higher still at 16MW (more than 21,000hp).

Technically, the old Eurostar as they have power cars.

The new ones are carriages with traction motors under some or all of them.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Joined
22 Aug 2019
Messages
12
Location
Naestved Denmark
Ok I was actually thinking in locomotive power..... but guess I wasn’t very specific - sorry

But the 91”S with an HST on I didn’t know.......
 

Doomotron

Member
Joined
25 Jun 2018
Messages
1,173
Location
Kent
I was thinking either the 373s or, if it counts, the Eurotunnel shuttles that at most have 18,000hp.
 

delticdave

Member
Joined
14 Apr 2017
Messages
449
Technically, the old Eurostar as they have power cars.

The new ones are carriages with traction motors under some or all of them.

Erm... the "old" Eurostars also have traction motors under the carriages, specifically those that are coupled to the power-cars.
They have control equipment mounted above the motor bogies, fed from the adjacent power-car.
 

JohnMcL7

Member
Joined
18 Apr 2018
Messages
861
They've run 68's top and tail with 7200bhp between them although only one actually providing traction I assume.

The Eurotunnel class 9's are just shy of 20,000bhp per train but assume they don't count as it's not carriages they haul?
 

alangla

Member
Joined
11 Apr 2018
Messages
1,178
Location
Glasgow
If it’s power to weight, then the class 90 hauled North Berwick sets must be well up there. The departure from Waverley with the 90 shoving hard from the rear was, er, sparkling...
 

Thatcham Xing

Member
Joined
1 Nov 2016
Messages
173
Having just watched catchup of worlds most scenic rail journeys - New Zealand where the train goes through Arthur’s Pass using 4x their fruit salad locos at 3300hp each, total 13,200hp....... having been on it - it’s very impressive.

I've done the Transalpine in NZ aswell. Some of the loaded coal trains from the west coast have up to 7 loco's (4 or 5 bankers) for the run up through Otira tunnel to Arthur's Pass. The ventilation system for the tunnel is a work of engineering in itself!
 

sprinterguy

Established Member
Joined
4 Mar 2010
Messages
11,048
Location
Macclesfield
They had a pair of 4000hp power cars, so still a little shy of what the class 91+HST formations could produce. Though I'm not sure how much the HST power car lost providing train supply, so it's probably a pretty close run thing.
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
15,162
They had a pair of 4000hp power cars, so still a little shy of what the class 91+HST formations could produce. Though I'm not sure how much the HST power car lost providing train supply, so it's probably a pretty close run thing.
It’s more complex than that as quoted ratings are usually engine output for diesels but power at the wheel for electric traction. For a diesel there are transmission (alternator, electric equipment etc) losses before power gets to the wheels.
 

xotGD

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2017
Messages
6,063
I might be misremembering, but hasn't a preserved railway run triple-headed Deltics? 9,900hp.
 
Joined
22 Aug 2019
Messages
12
Location
Naestved Denmark
I had 3x class 50’s plus 2x class 20’s on a preserved line which was quite something.......

I didn’t really ask the question properly..... but have found it very interesting none the less thanks....
 

sprinterguy

Established Member
Joined
4 Mar 2010
Messages
11,048
Location
Macclesfield
It’s more complex than that as quoted ratings are usually engine output for diesels but power at the wheel for electric traction. For a diesel there are transmission (alternator, electric equipment etc) losses before power gets to the wheels.
Yeah, agreed. The power at rail for an HST power car is stated to be 1770hp, so a pair of 4000hp APT-P power cars may in fact be slightly more powerful than a class 91+HST lash up.
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
15,162
Yeah, agreed. The power at rail for an HST power car is stated to be 1770hp, so a pair of 4000hp APT-P power cars may in fact be slightly more powerful than a class 91+HST lash up.
I’d agree, but as the thread was about “haulage”, only if you’re in the back half of the APT!
 

ashkeba

Established Member
Joined
13 May 2019
Messages
2,171
What about Eurostar sets? The 373s are 12.2MW (over 16,000hp) and the 374s are higher still at 16MW (more than 21,000hp).
Yes but they are very long trains: 373s (Three Capitals) are 18 coaches long, so that's about 678kW/coach; and the 374s (e320s) are 16 but are EMUs with no power car.

So I suggest the 755/3 (Flirt Regional): on electric, it uses 2.6MW on just three coaches + power car, so 867kW/coach. ;)
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
15,162
Yes but they are very long trains: 373s (Three Capitals) are 18 coaches long, so that's about 678kW/coach; and the 374s (e320s) are 16 but are EMUs with no power car.

So I suggest the 755/3 (Flirt Regional): on electric, it uses 2.6MW on just three coaches + power car, so 867kW/coach. ;)
Not in the UK, but I’ll put forward a pair of Siemens ES64U2 on load four. Rated at 6,400kW each - so something like 1.5MW per coach, taking into account the relative weights of locos and stock.
 

Antman

Established Member
Joined
3 May 2013
Messages
6,842
Double headed 86 or 87s would have been pretty powerful (up to 10,000hp). Presumably they had a regular roster on passenger trains, if only to move locos about ...
 

USRailFan

Member
Joined
2 May 2011
Messages
341
Location
Norway
Not in the UK, but I’ll put forward a pair of Siemens ES64U2 on load four. Rated at 6,400kW each - so something like 1.5MW per coach, taking into account the relative weights of locos and stock.

OK, I'll chime in.
Norway, Flåm line: Six coaches, total of abt 240 metric tons, with top-and-tailed electrics (El18, Norwegian variant of the SBB Re460), that's 2x5400kW (total 14680 hp). Of course, it's a 5.5 percent grade...
 

50039

Member
Joined
8 Mar 2015
Messages
487
Location
Tring
Double headed 86 or 87s would have been pretty powerful (up to 10,000hp). Presumably they had a regular roster on passenger trains, if only to move locos about ...

Agree with the 87s, but seem to recall the 86s were quite a bit less powerful??
 

jopsuk

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2008
Messages
12,771
On foreign railways- the Brightline (Virgin Trains) service in Florida use four passenger cars push-pulled by a pair of Siemens Chargers. They're a downrated version that only produce 4000hp (versus the standard 4400, 3900 at rail)
 

33017

Member
Joined
9 Sep 2017
Messages
273
When first built, DB’s production 103s had a one hour rating of 10,400 kW (13,950 hp), with Wiki suggesting some were 12,000 kW (16,000 hp). They were eventually de-rated (in the late 80s, I think), but still had a ridiculous amount of grunt (9,980 hp continuous rating, one hour 12,000 hp). Remember having them on 3 coach fill-in turns a couple of times in 1989 and the acceleration was like nothing I’ve experienced before or since - one mate was flung across the compartment as he reached up to the luggage rack as the driver took power.
 

gg1

Established Member
Joined
2 Jun 2011
Messages
1,895
Location
Birmingham
Yes but they are very long trains: 373s (Three Capitals) are 18 coaches long, so that's about 678kW/coach; and the 374s (e320s) are 16 but are EMUs with no power car.

So I suggest the 755/3 (Flirt Regional): on electric, it uses 2.6MW on just three coaches + power car, so 867kW/coach. ;)

So about 1160hp per coach then?

Impressive, but the Scottish Region managed that in the early 60s :) :
272804_1000.jpg

https://brdiesels.livejournal.com/1385.html
 

gg1

Established Member
Joined
2 Jun 2011
Messages
1,895
Location
Birmingham
It's annoying me that I can't tell which exact class that is, so 25?

It's a 26 details from the link below the pic:
"Birmingham RCW Type 2 (Class 26) No. D5335 heads the branch train, consisting of a single ex-LNER non-corridor brake composite carriage, at Aberfeldy on 1st May, 1965, the final day of services on the branch."

I first came across the Aberfeldy branch a few years, I think from a thread on RMweb. For it's final 2 years of operation all services were diesel operated, either single coach passenger services like this or mixed trains with a few wagons/vans added, I've seen pictures of 25s on the same line.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top