Southport Chapel Street station

Xenophon PCDGS · 2 Dec 2019

I believe that at its peak, besides its excursion platforms, this station had as many as eleven terminal platforms. Can anyone inform me which of these platforms were dedicated to certain routes (having in mind a similarity to the ten east-facing terminal platforms that once were at Manchester Victoria).

RailUK Forums

AntoniC · 2 Dec 2019

Platforms 1 -3 are for Merseyrail services to Liverpool.
Platforms 4 - 6 are for Northern services to Manchester/Leeds/Todmorden
Platform 7 is out of use (platform edge still exists) and the track bed is used for signalling equipment.
Hope this helps.
(Southport is my local station).

Xenophon PCDGS · 2 Dec 2019

I am aware there was an electric service to Crossens. What platform numbers were used by that service?

Ploughman · 2 Dec 2019

From the Signalling Record Society.
https://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lmsr/M310.gif

Pyreneenguy · 2 Dec 2019

Xenophon PCDGS said:
I am aware there was an electric service to Crossens. What platform numbers were used by that service?

The Crossens shuttle usually used platform 9. Platforms 10 & 11 were also electrified. If I remember correctly, the very short platform 11 also had pits ( as does the storage line adjacent to platform 1). Trains to Preston usually used platform 10.

The track from platforms 7-11 was lifted in 1967 and partially in-filled for parking.

Xenophon PCDGS · 2 Dec 2019

Ploughman said:
From the Signalling Record Society.
https://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lmsr/M310.gif

When I tried to access that link, it said that I did not have permission to access it.

Springs Branch · 2 Dec 2019

Xenophon PCDGS said:
..... Can anyone inform me which of these platforms were dedicated to certain routes.....

The National Library of Scotland's 25-inch-to-the-mile Ordnance Survey maps from the first quarter of the 20th Century suggest that the lines towards Liverpool were only ever served by platforms 1 to 3 on account of the sharp curve away to the south.

It seems like four running tracks went from Chapel St station to St Lukes, which would be used by trains towards Wigan, Ormskirk (via Burscough), Preston (via Hesketh Bank), the electric shuttle to Crossens and - until 1938 - Altcar Bob.

This website:
http://heskethbankcouncil.uk/media-gallery/west-lancashire-railway/
shows a photograph titled "A Preston train leaves Southport platform 7 in 1964 hauled by a ‘Black Five’ engine....."
I hesitate to paste this interesting image here, as I'm unsure about copyright, but the photo is about 2/3 of the way down the page.

In expanded view it shows third rail installed on the northern pair of tracks to St Lukes, in line with @Pyreneenguy's post regarding electrification of platforms 9, 10 & 11.

Also interesting on the left of the picture is one electrified track coming across from platform 3. This would be used by electric trains from the Liverpool platforms to/from the EMU depot at Meols Cop - which closed in 1970, half a dozen years after closure of the Crossens service.

Ploughman · 2 Dec 2019

The doors from Meols Cop works were recovered around 1973 and reused as doors at Steamport until the end.

30907 · 2 Dec 2019

https://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lmsr/M310.gif

Xenophon PCDGS said:
When I tried to access that link, it said that I did not have permission to access it.

I had that problem too, but it worked via the srs homepage, and has just worked for me off here...

Pyreneenguy · 2 Dec 2019

Springs Branch said:
.

Also interesting on the left of the picture is one electrified track coming across from platform 3. This would be used by electric trains from the Liverpool platforms to/from the EMU depot at Meols Cop - which closed in 1970, half a dozen years after closure of the Crossens service.

The Southport triangle, from Southport South Junction to St Lukes allowed movement of stock from the Liverpool direction to the workshops at Meols Cop. The connection at Southport South was severed on 25 May, 1969. The two tracks survived for some time after this as sidings ( as was the case for the Meols Cop triangle from the severed Hawkeshead Junction to Roe lane Junction). After this date a reversal was needed in Chapel Street station, as was also the case at Meols Cop.

Bevan Price · 2 Dec 2019

Pyreneenguy said:
The Southport triangle, from Southport South Junction to St Lukes allowed movement of stock from the Liverpool direction to the workshops at Meols Cop. The connection at Southport South was severed on 25 May, 1969. The two tracks survived for some time after this as sidings ( as was the case for the Meols Cop triangle from the severed Hawkeshead Junction to Roe lane Junction). After this date a reversal was needed in Chapel Street station, as was also the case at Meols Cop.

I went round that part of Southport Triangle on a Scotland/Preston to Liverpool Exchange one Sunday in the 1960s. Diverted due to engineering work, it also used Burscough North Curve, and was hauled by a Black 5.

S&CLER · 20 Jan 2020

Bevan Price said:
I went round that part of Southport Triangle on a Scotland/Preston to Liverpool Exchange one Sunday in the 1960s. Diverted due to engineering work, it also used Burscough North Curve, and was hauled by a Black 5.

I remember a diversion in the early 1960s for bridge redecking at Rufford. But it can't have been the same as yours, as I recall the route we took was Maghull - Ormskirk (change) - Burscough South curve - Meols Cop - Crossens - Preston.

L+Y · 21 Jan 2020

Pyreneenguy said:
The Southport triangle, from Southport South Junction to St Lukes allowed movement of stock from the Liverpool direction to the workshops at Meols Cop. The connection at Southport South was severed on 25 May, 1969. The two tracks survived for some time after this as sidings ( as was the case for the Meols Cop triangle from the severed Hawkeshead Junction to Roe lane Junction). After this date a reversal was needed in Chapel Street station, as was also the case at Meols Cop.

Was this link reinstated later ? I'm sure the old 1990s club trains used to reverse around this triangle?

Xenophon PCDGS · 21 Jan 2020

Pyreneenguy said:
The Southport triangle, from Southport South Junction to St Lukes allowed movement of stock from the Liverpool direction to the workshops at Meols Cop. The connection at Southport South was severed on 25 May, 1969. The two tracks survived for some time after this as sidings ( as was the case for the Meols Cop triangle from the severed Hawkeshead Junction to Roe lane Junction). After this date a reversal was needed in Chapel Street station, as was also the case at Meols Cop.

Operationally-wise, Southport Chapel Street was an ideal place for such reversals to occur.

Springs Branch · 23 Jan 2020

Speaking of triangular layouts in the vicinity of Southport, whilst Googling the OP's initial question, I stumbled across a few references to the Meols Cop electric car workshops (in the triangle with the West Lancashire line, between St. Luke's and Meols Cop stations, at one time the main maintenance point for Class 502 EMUs).

The Disused Stations website has some comprehensive coverage of this depot at:
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/features/meols_cop_triangle/index.shtml
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/features/meols_cop_triangle/index1.shtml
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/m/meols_cop/

Seeing the collection of photos on these pages was very interesting for me because I must have passed here a number of times on Wigan/Southport trains in the 1960s (when the depot was still open and active) and I had never noticed the quantity of electrified sidings, spare rolling stock and general ironmongery in the area, nor the presence of one electrified track in Meols Cop station itself.

S&CLER · 23 Jan 2020

Springs Branch said:
Speaking of triangular layouts in the vicinity of Southport, whilst Googling the OP's initial question, I stumbled across a few references to the Meols Cop electric car workshops (in the triangle with the West Lancashire line, between St. Luke's and Meols Cop stations, at one time the main maintenance point for Class 502 EMUs).

The Disused Stations website has some comprehensive coverage of this depot at:
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/features/meols_cop_triangle/index.shtml
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/features/meols_cop_triangle/index1.shtml
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/m/meols_cop/

Seeing the collection of photos on these pages was very interesting for me because I must have passed here a number of times on Wigan/Southport trains in the 1960s (when the depot was still open and active) and I had never noticed the quantity of electrified sidings, spare rolling stock and general ironmongery in the area, nor the presence of one electrified track in Meols Cop station itself.

In the 1960s you would probably have travelled most often via the direct route through Blowick. This was closed to eliminate a troublesome skew level crossing (near where the Thatch and Thistle pub is now). Meols Cop car sheds used to operate the unusual practice of hand-waxing emus, which looked good but must have been very labour-intensive.

Pyreneenguy · 23 Jan 2020

S&CLER said:
In the 1960s you would probably have travelled most often via the direct route through Blowick. This was closed to eliminate a troublesome skew level crossing (near where the Thatch and Thistle pub is now). Meols Cop car sheds used to operate the unusual practice of hand-waxing emus, which looked good but must have been very labour-intensive.

I'm sure my nan was a closet rail enthusiast. I remember, as if it were yesterday, going on the bus to Blowick and walking over the level-crossing. This must have been shortly after closure, as everything was in place, just the rails were a little rusty. I could write a book of our adventures on Runabout Rovers ! Highlights of which must be a direct train from Blackpool to Lakeside or a holiday at Butlins, going from Birkenhead Woodside to Pen y Chain via Afon wen !

Springs Branch · 23 Jan 2020

S&CLER said:
In the 1960s you would probably have travelled most often via the direct route through Blowick.......

Certainly likely in the early 1960s, but I was thinking more of the later 1960s (direct route apparently closed in 1965), when I was more aware of the railway scene and spent most of every train trip eagerly peering from the window. So 0/10 for me on observation with this one.

chiltern trev · 11 Jul 2020

Pyreneenguy said:
The Crossens shuttle usually used platform 9. Platforms 10 & 11 were also electrified. If I remember correctly, the very short platform 11 also had pits ( as does the storage line adjacent to platform 1). Trains to Preston usually used platform 10.

The track from platforms 7-11 was lifted in 1967 and partially in-filled for parking.

In the late 1950s/early 1960s, Liverpool electrics were usually platforms 2 (first choice) and 1 (second choice) when the ticket barriers at end of platforms 1 and 2 were in use. Platform 3 was for Liverpool Lime St steam service (and later diesel) with occasional Liverpool electrics. When the ticket barriers on platforms 1 and 2 closed (staff reduction measures) (1960s?) the Liverpool electrics moved to platform 3 (first choice) then platform 2 (second choice) then platform 3 (third choice).

I recall Preston being platform 8. As said the Crossens would be platform 9 (first choice) then platform 10 if platform 9 occupied.

I cannot remember the split for platforms 4-8 but guess Manchesters were 5 and 6 for the longer trains then platform 4.

Southport Chapel Street station

Xenophon PCDGS

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