Caledonian Sleeper

Was on the sleeper on Tuesday night. Coach K Cabin 10, right above the wheels, next to a noisy toilet at the end of the coach and heard the door alarms go at every station.
Very uncomfortable night, very bumpy and a totally miserable experience compared to the old stock.
Won’t be travelling with them ever again.

Southbound Highlander from FW cancelled tonight due to flooding between there & Crianlarich .......

Are the sleepers running tonight with the wires down around Lockerbie?

Elecman said:

Are the sleepers running tonight with the wires down around Lockerbie?

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The Highlander has set off - I doubt they would have done this if they thought there were going to be problems. They would have cancelled it throughout instead.

EDIT: 20mph ESR between Carlisle and Glasgow/Edinburgh. Potential of up to 60 minutes delay.

glenbogle said:

Was on the sleeper on Tuesday night. Coach K Cabin 10, right above the wheels, next to a noisy toilet at the end of the coach and heard the door alarms go at every station.
Very uncomfortable night, very bumpy and a totally miserable experience compared to the old stock.
Won’t be travelling with them ever again.

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That's sad to hear.

I guess it's still early days, and maybe CS are only interested in one off tourist experiences than repeat business, but it seems to be constanyky fully booked except sometimes some seats available.

I tried for last two days to get on a NB High or Lowlander for tonight and all sold out....

glenbogle said:

Was on the sleeper on Tuesday night. Coach K Cabin 10, right above the wheels, next to a noisy toilet at the end of the coach and heard the door alarms go at every station.
Very uncomfortable night, very bumpy and a totally miserable experience compared to the old stock.
Won’t be travelling with them ever again.

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On a recent trip I was moved to B1 which was the PRM berth with the double bed. The doors beeping was audible but to be honest that didn't bother me that much. What did bother me was Susan Calman continually yelping that the toilet doors were opening, closing and locked.

Bletchleyite said:

Though a Premier Inn (which is not a premium hotel) has generally far higher standards than CS (which allegedly is). I think other than a bit of wood effect sticky backed plastic that makes it look a bit posh, the only thing on CS that's premium is, seats aside, the price.

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I do find the Mk5s to be an improvement in comfort and facilities over the Mk3s/Mk2s, but I don’t think that they will ever be comparable to a luxury hotel. As I’ve often said, I think that this is CS getting carried away with their marketing- at the end of the day it’s very difficult to provide luxury hotel standards of comfort on a train whose height and width restricted by the UK loading gauge, which runs on often curvaceous track alignments at up to 80mph. Especially given that most passengers will not sleep particularly well. The on-train food is great, but obviously not comparable with anything you’d get in a supposedly ’luxury’ hotel.

Another obstacle to the ’luxury hotel’ marketing is the inconsistency of customer service provided by the on-train staff and staff at the station lounges. Sometimes (I would say probably more often than not) it is absolutely first class, with obliging, helpful staff, who cannot do enough for their passengers and who keep them well informed and well looked after even when there are severe delays/disruption. Some of CS’ very best staff rank among the very best railway staff in the country, are an absolute joy to travel with and make it a truly great railway experience. At other times, it feels as though the on-train staff are entirely ill-suited to a supposedly ’luxury’ operation and don’t really want to be there; in the most extreme cases they seem preoccupied with ejecting seated passengers (in a rude and OTT manner) who’ve dared to enter the lounge car, rather than actually serving any food or drink. This varying attitude is perhaps understandable given the level of customer dissatisfaction and the problems with the operation this year, and perhaps they will pick up when they are more used to the operation and it is working more reliably. Sometimes, I find that the same crew will have some excellent and some poor members. While all TOCs have on-train staff of varying quality and varying enthusiasm, I do find that CS staff tend towards the extremes of ’excellent’ and ’poor’, with very few in between who are merely ’average’. A Premier Inn or Travelodge, in contrast, has a lot of good, consistent staff (with few outstanding/shocking performances). I think that staff consistency is something which CS need to strive after, as surly/unhelpful staff are not conducive to a ’luxury’ experience. I’m not a stickler for protocol, and I understand that railway staff have at times stressful and demanding jobs, but I do find that simply greeting passengers with a curt ’yes’ when they check in (as two somewhat surly crew members did last time I was on) does not exactly set the right tone for the service. I have taken this up with CS as I feel that this is a staff training issue. It’s a shame, as many other CS staff I’ve met over the years (and who I’ve made friends with) seem very capable of giving a warm welcome to, and having friendly conversations with, all their passengers.

It’s true that you only hear about severe delays , not normal running. Last night it looks like there were very short notice diversions via the West Midlands, but everything (currently) appears to be pretty much on time- https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/se...6/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt&toc=CS

Edit - apart from the Fort William portion

What's the best cabin I should be looking for on the Lowlander with regards to ride and noise?

Now that the Azuma has made the journey to London unbearable and the Pendolino not much better, CS is now the last hope before binning rail off entirely.

GrimShady said:

What's the best cabin I should be looking for on the Lowlander with regards to ride and noise?

Now that the Azuma has made the journey to London unbearable and the Pendolino not much better, CS is now the last hope before binning rail off entirely.

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If I were you, I’d go for one in one of the middle coaches of the train, in the middle of the carriage (or as close to the middle of the carriage as possible). I would choose coach D or E in the Edinburgh portion if possible, and L or M in the Glasgow portion. You should try to get berth 5 or 6 if travelling First (Club), and berth 7 or 8 if travelling Standard (Classic)- these tend to be the furthest from the wheels and therefore the smoothest. The best sleep I’ve had on a Mk5 and on the sleeper ever was in coach L room 5 on the sleeper from Inverness to Euston. I would say that the Mk5s are very smooth and quiet if you’re in a berth in the middle of the carriage, and horrendous (as bad as a Mk1!) if you’re in berths 1 or 10 over the bogies.

Of course, you can’t guarantee that the staff won’t then move you to a berth right over the wheels in a carriage next to the locomotive, as happened to me travelling north to Inverness on 5th November. I’d deliberately booked L5 only to be put in P1. I asked the staff what the reason was for this- apparently there was poor water pressure in the en-suite. To be honest, I’d have preferred a berth in the middle of the carriage to a functioning en-suite- had the staff been more approachable, and had I been less tired, I’d probably have tried to discuss this with them. I will warn you, if you end up in a room at the coach end, like P1 of the Inverness portion, you will not sleep well. Mind you, even room P1 is infinitely preferable to a Pendolino as far as I’m concerned... not tried an Azuma yet but I’m hearing mixed reports.

GrimShady said:

What's the best cabin I should be looking for on the Lowlander with regards to ride and noise?

Now that the Azuma has made the journey to London unbearable and the Pendolino not much better, CS is now the last hope before binning rail off entirely.

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Middle of a coach to be as far away from doors, bogies and toilets as you can and preferably in the coach as far away from the lounge car as possible to minimise the amount of bell-ends walking past your cabin yakking away to their pals at 2am.

Agree with you on the dwindling amount of long distance trains that provide an acceptable level of comfort, Pendo 1st class is about the only remaining option for London - Scotland that I would even consider now, those 8xx seats are an insult in both classes.

I see on the BBC News website that CS have been told to pull their socks up.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50687097

BBC News said:

Operators of the Caledonian Sleeper have admitted its service has been "unsatisfactory" following a "number of issues".

The acknowledgement comes after the service between London and Scotland was hit by strike action, technical faults and the late delivery of new trains.

Serco Caledonian Sleepers Ltd said an improvement plan was now in place.

The improvement plan will attempt to address delays caused by the coupling and decoupling of trains at Carstairs and Edinburgh Waverley.

Trains travelling from Aberdeen, Inverness and Fort William are joined or split at Waverley while those from Glasgow and Edinburgh undergo the same process at Carstairs.

Serco Caledonian Sleepers Ltd (SCSL) said improvements would also be made to the reliability of electric and diesel locomotives, depot and station operations and communication with infrastructure operator Network Rail.

In a letter to Transport Scotland SCSL said that it was "with regret" that they recognised "a number of issues have contributed to a decline in right time arrival performance of the service."

They added that they had "proactively taken a number of steps to identify the key root causes to recent challenges".

The Scottish Transport Secretary Michael Matheson said Caledonian Sleeper's performance had fallen below the levels expected by passengers and ministers alike.

He added: "This has been caused by a number of internal and external factors, which are being addressed by Caledonian Sleeper and its industry partners CAF, GB Railfreight and Network Rail."

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PG said:

I see on the BBC News website that CS have been told to pull their socks up.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50687097

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About time...

JModulo said:

About time...

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Do we think it'll make a difference?...
Scotrail had an improvement notice and things haven't improved North of the central belt!

PG said:

Do we think it'll make a difference?...
Scotrail had an improvement notice and things haven't improved North of the central belt!

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Knowing CS they'll just bury their head in the sand even further.

PG said:

I see on the BBC News website that CS have been told to pull their socks up.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50687097

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So they're now on the same naughty step as Scotrail's from around a year ago.

To be fair I think that they are starting to get on top of things. I now know of several journeys made when NOTHING went wrong, something that would've been impossible a couple of months ago.

I even know someone who used an ensuite shower the other day and had to turn down the water temperature.

On another point, that of the rattling bogies, it appears that the problem is one caused by a combination of poor or curving track and that the coaches are fitted with wheels that are very much smaller than those on the mk3s, so they shudder at the slightest opportunity. Just something that I've been told...

Interesting timing given CalMac (owned by the Scottish Government) this week sued the Scottish Government over the award of the Northlink ferry contract to Serco. CalMac were apparently cheaper, but Serco won on quality https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-50661548

Quality?
Serco rearranged the timetable of the Hamnavoe for its own convenience, Not for Orcadians.
& the connection with rail transport is a joke. If you don’t want/need/can’t afford to take a car, you fly.

47271 said:

So they're now on the same naughty step as Scotrail's from around a year ago.

To be fair I think that they are starting to get on top of things. I now know of several journeys made when NOTHING went wrong, something that would've been impossible a couple of months ago.

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I wouldn’t say impossible. I’ve made two journeys on the new CS, both bang on time, cabin flawless, crew brilliant, everything worked (showers, loo, air con, etc). Nothing went wrong on either. One was 5 months ago, one was 3 months ago. I refuse to believe I have been extremely lucky, twice.

alangla said:

Interesting timing given CalMac (owned by the Scottish Government) this week sued the Scottish Government over the award of the Northlink ferry contract to Serco. CalMac were apparently cheaper, but Serco won on quality https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-50661548

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I think that the more significant common factor across both stories is that of the oversight of Transport Scotland, rather than the management of Serco. It was TS that wanted the sleeper to become the hotel on wheels, Serco's only carrying out their instructions, albeit shambolically.

Just about everything TS touches turns to chaos: Scotrail, major road schemes, sleeper, ferries. Calmac may be farcically suing over Northlink but their own track record, especially as far as new vessel procurement via CMAL is concerned, is diabolical.

TS seems to lead a charmed life of obscurity while operators on one hand, and Scottish Government on the other, get blamed for every shortcoming. It's high time they get called out.

Bald Rick said:

I wouldn’t say impossible. I’ve made two journeys on the new CS, both bang on time, cabin flawless, crew brilliant, everything worked (showers, loo, air con, etc). Nothing went wrong on either. One was 5 months ago, one was 3 months ago. I refuse to believe I have been extremely lucky, twice.

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I think you got a bit lucky. I know three Highlander regulars who've always had something amiss - late running, dodgy plumbing, flooded lounge, broken door locks, unscheduled emergency stop and resets - until the past fortnight.

47271 said:

I think you got a bit lucky. I know three Highlander regulars who've always had something amiss - late running, dodgy plumbing, flooded lounge, broken door locks, unscheduled emergency stop and resets - until the past fortnight.

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Maybe I was lucky, maybe others have been unlucky. I certainly know plenty of people who have had flawless trips; however it is the nature of things that people don’t shout about experiences that go as they should have.

PG said:

Do we think it'll make a difference?...
Scotrail had an improvement notice and things haven't improved North of the central belt!

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Not one bit I think.

Took my first trip on the new MK5 Sleeper this week. I used to use the service quite often but this was my first trip in over a year so I was looking forward to trying out the new trains, if a little wary given all the bad reports I’d heard.

I went down from Edinburgh to London in a Club Cabin and came back the following night in a Classic Cabin.

I got to Edinburgh early expecting to be able to use the First Class lounge but this had closed at 9pm. I’m sure I’d read somewhere that it was open for Sleeper customers.

Boarded promptly at 11pm and was impressed with the Club cabin. The design is okay and the bed felt comfy. The shower/toilet was bigger that I was expecting. I filled out the breakfast card, opting to eat in the lounge car as I was vlogging the trip and wanted to record the full experience.

Then off to the lounge car for a glass of wine. There were only 4 of us in the lounge car (until I left at about 11:55pm, so the service was swift and friendly.

Back to the room and I unloaded the pillow spray and settled down to sleep. Happy with the bed and I was away quickly. I agree with previous comments about the light switches being too bright, and lighting up the room too much but I found it didn’t bother me too much.

Being in cabin 6 right the centre of the carriage meant it was a smooth ride. I didn’t get woken up by the coupling at Carstairs.

what did keep me awake later was an awful water sloshing sound which I’ve heard people mention before. Not sure if this is from a tank supplying water for the shower, or from the toilet tank, but it was quite annoying and almost made me feel sea sick.

In the morning I had a shower and found the water immediately scalding hot. Wasn’t expecting that. Once at a decent temperature I had a good refreshing shower.

We arrived in Euston about 6:20 and the host brought my breakfast to my room at 6:45. I said I’d wanted to eat in the lounge but she said it was closed as the air on was faulty. The host was really friendly and was amused by my vlogging camera, she though it was a set of back pipes because of the gorilla pod tripod.

So overall I give the Club experience a thumbs up.

On the way back I arrived at Euston at 10:30 and boarded straight away with the intention of going straight to sleep. Had a laugh with the hosts who were the same team from the night before. I am known as bagpipe man now.

Even though I’d booked a Classic Solo room, it was set up with both beds which was disappointing. I think they should set the rooms up as booked.

I did try climbing up to the top bunk and thought the vertical ladder was horrible, and almost impossible to climb in bare feet. I image many people would struggle with this. At first I thought the ladder was fixed an couldn’t be moved. It’s in a bad position for getting in and out of the bed, but I worked out how to undo the metal clips and soon had it stashed on the top bunk (wasn’t sure whether I was breaking any rules here, so I did put the ladder back in place the following morning).

I slept much better in the Classic room mainly due to the fact there was no water sloshing sounds.

So generally I think the new sleeper is great. It’s definitely not luxury though. I paid £205 for the Club room and £140 for the Classic. I’m not sure the shower is worth the extra £65 to be honest. The shared toilet for the 4 Classic cabins is fine.

I’ve seen a few dates recently where the Club room is £160. I think I’d be more inclined to pay that, but once it creeps above that level I would probably stick with the Classic room I’m just not convinced the shower is worth the extra. You also have to have your shower right at the end as the cubical becomes waterlogged. If you had a shower early and water to use the loo, you’d get wet feet again.

There’s definitely something about the Sleeper, I really like it as a way to travel.

I did try climbing up to the top bunk and thought the vertical ladder was horrible, and almost impossible to climb in bare feet. I image many people would struggle with this. At first I thought the ladder was fixed an couldn’t be moved. It’s in a bad position for getting in and out of the bed, but I worked out how to undo the metal clips and soon had it stashed on the top bunk.

Snap! Very sore on the feet, lasted 5 mins in the top bunk, found it awful with hardly any space to lift my head before it was hitting the roof.
Like you say when you’ve booked it solo it should be set up that way.
The crew used to show you around the cabin, I was just told my key room card was in the cabin when I checked in on the platform and left to get on with it. Would have been nice for the attendant to say you can remove the ladder whilst showing you round the cabin.
It’s not a patch on the Night Riviera which is a lot more comfortable, personal and has a comfy lounge car not a cheap and nasty one.

glenbogle said:

I did try climbing up to the top bunk and thought the vertical ladder was horrible, and almost impossible to climb in bare feet. I image many people would struggle with this. At first I thought the ladder was fixed an couldn’t be moved. It’s in a bad position for getting in and out of the bed, but I worked out how to undo the metal clips and soon had it stashed on the top bunk.

Snap! Very sore on the feet, lasted 5 mins in the top bunk, found it awful with hardly any space to lift my head before it was hitting the roof.
Like you say when you’ve booked it solo it should be set up that way.
The crew used to show you around the cabin, I was just told my key room card was in the cabin when I checked in on the platform and left to get on with it. Would have been nice for the attendant to say you can remove the ladder whilst showing you round the cabin.
It’s not a patch on the Night Riviera which is a lot more comfortable, personal and has a comfy lounge car not a cheap and nasty one.

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I don’t personally have a problem with the top bunk, and find I sleep better on the top than on the bottom, though the vertical ladder is not ideal if you’re in bare feet or have limited mobility. Until I read your post, I had no idea that it was removable, so thanks for that wee heads-up! It seems strange them keeping the top bunk up in first class berths booked for single occupancy, but perhaps it’s easier than constantly having to reconfigure the room after every trip (though I think- someone please correct me if I’m wrong- that unlike on a Mk3, the top bunk of a Mk5 can be stowed with the mattress still in place). I’ve never yet seen a Mk5 cabin with the top bunk stowed (and I’ve booked single occupancy each time) though, so presumably they don’t usually bother doing this?

The host traditionally showed you around the cabin if you were new to the service (obviously if you were a regular user this was pointless; normally they’d ask ’have you travelled with us before’, and if you answered no, they’d show you where everything was in the cabin). This very friendly practice stopped in February 2018, when CS decided on the disastrous (in my view) practice of checking every passenger in at the end of the platform, which resulted in painful queues and an extremely impersonal check-in. Thankfully that hideous practice ended just over a year later, but I don’t think the hosts routinely show people to their berths any more. I also wish that you could just give your breakfast order to the host on check-in (as was done without issue for twenty years or more) rather than filling out one of those cards (these cards must surely be an appalling waste of paper in this environmentally conscious day and age). One or two of the old-school Inverness and Fort William hosts may still show less regular travellers to their rooms, particularly if the passenger has a lot of luggage/is struggling to find their way around, but I don’t think it’s standard policy any more. It’s a shame, as it’s personal elements like this that endear the service to people and get passengers and crew socialising and feeling at ease; this is something I wish CS made more of given their ’luxury service’ marketing.

The new lounge cars are great aesthetically I find, and I do prefer the booths and bar table to the settees (which were useless if you wanted anything more than a drink or a bag of crisps). The problem I have is that they don’t feel cosy at night (the lighting is perhaps too harsh), and the once famous atmosphere is now non-existent. It was, in the past, a place where, perhaps unusually for a train in the UK, all the passengers used to enjoy great conversation with people they’d never previously met, from all walks of life. It was a great place for meeting new people and enjoying interesting conversation; I made a great many friends through impromptu evenings on the sleeper in the past. The lounge last time was full to bursting, yet it still somehow felt like I was at a wake... Passengers don’t seem to mix or socialise how they used to. Of course, this could be because many of the current passengers have no interest in mixing, but I somehow don’t think the layout is very conducive to socialising.

That's sad to hear that the sociable atmosphere of the lounge car has been lost. I wonder if it will find itself a new balance with time though.

It's probably something that could be influenced quite a bit by things like lighting level - if anyone involved with managing the train were to take an interest in such things.

A few things reported elsewhere.

The Fort William portion didn't run on Thursday evening / Friday morning due to flooding on the West Highland Line. It appears that the sleeping coaches went to Aberdeen on Friday morning.

The Fort William portion then ran empty to Edinburgh on Friday night, and then to Polmadie so that
a) the 'day coaches' could go for servicing
b) the sleeping coaches could be coupled back to the Glasgow portion (which ran three coaches short from London on Friday night

I wonder whether some Glasgow passengers were turned away or reaccommodated due to the missing coaches.

Southbound Fort William portion to Edinburgh and Polmadie
5B01 1950 Fort William to Edinburgh
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O66954/2019-12-06/detailed

5B11 0305 Edinburgh to Polmadie Car M.D. (actually ran at 0214)
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/G65087/2019-12-07/detailed

Replacement stock (reported as 15102 and 15006)
5C01 0016 Polmadie Car M.D. to Edinburgh
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/G65093/2019-12-07/detailed

The formations were posted on a gen group again this morning, so here is the latest update

CS01 14-Oct 15004-15101-15201-15308-15307-15303-15304-15206
>>>> 26-Oct 15004-15101-15201-15308-15307-15303-15304-15206
>>>> 23-Nov 15004-15101-15201-15308-15307-15303-15304-15206
>>>> 7-Dec 15004-15101-15201-15308-15307-15303-15304-15206

CS02 14-Oct 15005-15103-15202-15311-15312-15313-15322-15306
>>>> 26-Oct 15005-15103-15202-15311-15312-15313-15322-15306
>>>> 23-Nov 15005-15103-15202-15311-15312-15313-15322-15306
>>>> 7-Dec 15005-15103-15202-15311-15312-15313-15306-15214

CS03 14-Oct 15008-15106-15203-15316-15324-15325-15329-15209
>>>> 26-Oct 15008-15106-15203-15316-15324-15325-15329-15209
>>>> 23-Nov 15008-15106-15203-15316-15324-15325-15329-15209
>>>> 7-Dec 15008-15106-15203-15316-15324-15325-15329-15209

CS04 14-Oct 15007-15105-15205-15314-15333-15332-15331-15330
>>>> 26-Oct 15007-15105-15205-15314-15332-15331-15330-15333
>>>> 23-Nov 15006-15105-15205-15314-15332-15331-15330-15333
>>>> 7-Dec 15011-15105-15205-15314-15332-15331-15330-15333

CS05 14-Oct 15009-15108-15204-15318-15328-15320-15319-15309
>>>> 26-Oct 15009-15108-15204-15318-15328-15320-15319-15309
>>>> 23-Nov 15009-15108-15204-15318-15328-15320-15319-15309
>>>> 7-Dec 15007-15108-15204-15318-15328-15320-15319-15309

CS06 14-Oct 15003-15109-15207-15323-15321-15317-15310-15208
>>>> 26-Oct 15003-15109-15207-15323-15321-15317-15310-15208
>>>> 23-Nov 15003-15109-15207-15323-15321-15317-15310-15208
>>>> 7-Dec 15003-15109-15207-15323-15321-15317-15310-15213

CS07 14-Oct 15010-15107-15210-15334-15305-15327-15335-15315
>>>> 26-Oct 15010-15107-15210-15334-15305-15327-15335-15315
>>>> 23-Nov 15010-15107-15210-15334-15305-15327-15335-15315
>>>> 7-Dec 15010-15107-15210-15334-15305-15327-15335-15315

CS08 14-Oct 15011-15102-15212-15339-15338-15340-15326-15211
>>>> 26-Oct 15011-15102-15212-15339-15338-15340-15326-15211
>>>> 23-Nov 15002-15110-15212-15339-15337-15338-15326-15211
>>>> 7-Dec 15002-15110-15212-15339-15337-(15338-15326-15211)

Fort William day coaches
14-Oct 15006-15104
26-Oct 15006-15104
23-Nov 15007-15104
7-Dec 15006-15102

Friday night's sleepers
1M11 CS01+CS04
1M16 CS03+CS05
1S25 CS07+CS06
1S26 CS08+CS02 (15338-15326-15211 missing as they should have been in the Glasgow portion)

Most noticeable is that 15213 and 15214 appear to now be in use instead of 15208 and 15322 so CS02 is misformed with a 152xx vehicle in place of a 153xx vehicle.

I've not really used the lounge car, but it's fair to say that people are less chatty and sociable on most trains and planes than 10 or 20 years ago.

theironroad said:

I've not really used the lounge car, but it's fair to say that people are less chatty and sociable on most trains and planes than 10 or 20 years ago.

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The sleeper lounge car has been quite a notable exception to this though. And I wonder how much that was to do with its physical layout. To some extent perhaps train design has made people less sociable.

I'm not sure that I agree that the new lounges inhibit conversation with strangers. Their layout is more similar to the mk2s with the far superior conventional First Class seats rather than the awful loose chairs and purple sofas, which furniture I suppose was a conversation piece in itself. 'Did you go to nightclubs much in the 1980s?' was one hilarious ice breaker I overheard a few years ago.

Now you can make new friends by saying: 'Watch my whisky slosh up and down so much with the rattles from below that some of it will be on the table in a minute. There it is, look!'

If you're in a booth with others then you'll probably speak to them, unless they're really weird. You can converse between a booth and people on the stools. People on the stools can converse with each other.

Lounge lighting appears to have two states, and I've seen it dropped more than once around half an hour after departure from Euston. Or maybe that was just a technical fault brought on by the earlier emergency stop and reset...