Cologne station safe?

riceuten · 13 Dec 2019

scragend said:
I agree about Gare du Nord. I don't think I've ever used the RER from there, so I can only go off the mainline station. It is potentially a nice station (particularly the frontage), but the fact that you step outside and tend to be immediately accosted by a beggar who, when he asks you to give him money and you say no, follows up with "Why not?" isn't exactly a welcoming first impression of Paris.

I practice my basilisk stare and I have never yet been accosted outside the Gare du Nord. I can understand why people might find it intimidating, but gangs of young men are generally not interested in passing tourists. Just ignore them.

There used to be a real problem at the Gare de L'Est with people hassling you at the entrance to the station, and on the concourse - the Police seem to have addressed that, as I have been there a couple of times recently and they no longer do so. They actually put heaters on the platform when I was there the weekend before last.

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duesselmartin · 13 Dec 2019

Yes Germany is still very much a cash society.
I guess If people stop carrying loose change there might be less beggars at the station, but at the detrament of the poorest.

riceuten · 13 Dec 2019

duesselmartin said:
Yes Germany is still very much a cash society.

One can only hope that changes with time.

Struner · 13 Dec 2019

How do you mean?

duesselmartin · 13 Dec 2019

riceuten said:
One can only hope that changes with time.

It is slowly. 20 years ago, Aldi did not accept cards. Now touch and pay is widely available but not that widely used.

Cricketer8for9 · 14 Dec 2019

My Brussels experience is from 1999 to 2016. In the earlier days things seemed worse around Midi which was reflected in there being fewer people around, for example on the Metro, in the evening. By 2016 there number of “normal” people had increased and so the sense of threat went down.

That said I never had any problems at Midi but I know people who did (robbery as opposed to violence).

ChiefPlanner · 14 Dec 2019

duesselmartin said:
Yes Germany is still very much a cash society.
I guess If people stop carrying loose change there might be less beggars at the station, but at the detrament of the poorest.

I guess the ability to "earn" money by collecting beer empties etc and recycling them for cash at shops in Germany assists the low income earners away from begging. Is this true ? - seen some mobile collectors on S-Bahn routes in Berlin.

Anyway - sketchiest area around a German station I have come across is Frankfurt. Berlin can be "interesting" on certain U-Bahn lines - never seen anything more than a very drunken woman being arrested at Koln - and this was very early am , having come off the sleeper from Poland. She must have had a long evening / night.

ChiefPlanner · 14 Dec 2019

Cricketer8for9 said:
My Brussels experience is from 1999 to 2016. In the earlier days things seemed worse around Midi which was reflected in there being fewer people around, for example on the Metro, in the evening. By 2016 there number of “normal” people had increased and so the sense of threat went down.

That said I never had any problems at Midi but I know people who did (robbery as opposed to violence).

Hugely improved by the very visible (military) security around , but still not a place to hang around for long. IMHO.

duesselmartin · 14 Dec 2019

Yes, Brussels has improved a lot but its far from ideal.
There used to be gangs of children in Midi pick pocketing.

Spoorslag '70 · 14 Dec 2019

ChiefPlanner said:
I guess the ability to "earn" money by collecting beer empties etc and recycling them for cash at shops in Germany assists the low income earners away from begging. Is this true ? - seen some mobile collectors on S-Bahn routes in Berlin.

Well, you get anything between 8ct (glass bottles) to 25ct (single-use bottles/cans) per bottle. Especially during events (e.g. football or the Munich Oktoberfest), one should be able to make quite some money from it.

It's quite normal to have a couple of folks walk through trains between Duisburg and Essen during the weekends. On one trip I have counted about 10 of them between Recklinghausen and Duisburg...

Cricketer8for9 · 14 Dec 2019

It was always a sign of a failing station (in terms of passenger numbers) if the area stayed “posh”. Compare Marylebone to King’s Cross. Victoria was perhaps the exception in London as the Belgrave estate owned so much of the area and policed use pretty tightly.

tasky · 14 Dec 2019

WestCoast said:
Agreed, Midi and Nord in Brussels don't seem to be the most pleasant for hanging around, although in my experience Central is alright (and where I'd recommend people deposit luggage etc).

The thing with Bruxelles Nord is that it is also the city's main long distance coach station - the favoured way of a lot of refugees and migrants to reach North West Europe. It's not really their fault, but as a result a lot tend to end up there and stay the night. Unfortunately there are not many facilities provided for them, including free toilet facilities, and as a result the place is rather a mess. I don't personally think it's unsafe though, just a bit run-down because people are sleeping and living around it.

stuart100100 · 14 Dec 2019

Never had any issues at Cologne always felt perfectly safe. The only time I have been accosted in German stations was in Berlin by a guy who wanted my empty plastic bottle rather than money. I experienced a 'helper' in Rome Termini this week but just ignored her and used one of the ticket machines where a member of staff was standing

TeaLovingDave · 16 Dec 2019

In my travels on the continent, I have had no problems whatsoever with Koln Hbf or Brussels Midi

despite there being quite a large number of warnings online about the latter station!

Bletchleyite · 16 Dec 2019

TeaLovingDave said:
In my travels on the continent, I have had no problems whatsoever with Koln Hbf or Brussels Midi despite there being quite a large number of warnings online about the latter station!

I've not personally had a problem with Brussel-Zuid, it's just the area it's in is a total and utter dive[1] which can spread to petty crime e.g. pickpocketing and luggage theft inside the station. It's also a pig-ugly dump of a station, but that's a different issue.

[1] I walked to it from the centre once and the walk goes through places which really do feel unsafe.

ainsworth74 · 16 Dec 2019

Bletchleyite said:
[1] I walked to it from the centre once and the walk goes through places which really do feel unsafe.

Yes I thought that. I think the street we walked down to get to/from the centre I wouldn't quite have fancied after dark. During the day and at twilight was fine but there was just a little vibe off the place which put me slightly on edge. I can't recall ever getting a similar vibe from any of the the other places I've visited on the Continent recently.

Beebman · 16 Dec 2019

Bletchleyite said:
I've not personally had a problem with Brussel-Zuid, it's just the area it's in is a total and utter dive[1] which can spread to petty crime e.g. pickpocketing and luggage theft inside the station. It's also a pig-ugly dump of a station, but that's a different issue.

[1] I walked to it from the centre once and the walk goes through places which really do feel unsafe.

The last time I walked from Nord station to the centre of Brussels I passed a couple of 'shops' which each had young ladies sitting in the window in full view to passers by. However that was over 10 years ago so maybe that particular area has been cleaned up since then?

jon0844 · 16 Dec 2019

I always felt safe in and around Cologne, but remember seeing the pictures of the situation when the influx of refugees arrived a few years back. I experienced large groups around Munich and a police force that seemed to want to keep away, making me feel a little uncomfortable.

When I've been to Germany earlier this year it seems that things are back to normal. Germany did a lot of work to educate new arrivals on how to behave, which seems to have made a difference. Without living there, I can't speak for the whole country - but the cities feel safe.

Hamburg is a place that was always a bit rough from my first experience in the 1990s. Mostly limited to the station and surrounds, but not a massive problem if you look and act confident. Worthwhile making the effort to go to Miniatur Wunderland!

Meanwhile, Paris always makes me feel uneasy at night when off the beaten tracks.. and Brussels Midi is the only station where I've repeatedly witnessed crimes taking place (the last one being a handbag snatch in broad daylight within the station, albeit near the exit).

I think London stations are extremely safe in comparison.

alex397 · 16 Dec 2019

ainsworth74 said:
Yes I thought that. I think the street we walked down to get to/from the centre I wouldn't quite have fancied after dark. During the day and at twilight was fine but there was just a little vibe off the place which put me slightly on edge. I can't recall ever getting a similar vibe from any of the the other places I've visited on the Continent recently.

I also walked from Midi/Zuid to the centre and felt similar. I certainly didn't want to hang around looking at my map or phone, that's for sure. It's a shame, as once you have passed a certain point, I seem to recall really enjoying the walk and felt really safe. I ended up in some Bohemian type area, but can't recall where that was.

Still doesn't compare to my experiences in Paris though, where I really thought I was going to get robbed.

I'm spending some time at Midi later this week actually, on my way to Aachen.

Bletchleyite · 16 Dec 2019

jon0844 said:
Hamburg is a place that was always a bit rough from my first experience in the 1990s. Mostly limited to the station and surrounds, but not a massive problem if you look and act confident. Worthwhile making the effort to go to Miniatur Wunderland!

Hamburg has many parallels (in both layout and what it's like) with its fellow trading city Liverpool. That does include some parts of it being a bit rough - but not all of it, some of it is quite posh! There's not a lot there for a non-railway tourist - but it is a decent city and I enjoyed my 9 months living there.

Jamesrob637 · 16 Dec 2019

Beebman said:
The last time I walked from Nord station to the centre of Brussels I passed a couple of 'shops' which each had young ladies sitting in the window in full view to passers by. However that was over 10 years ago so maybe that particular area has been cleaned up since then?

Nord yes - that's always been the working-class area of the city.
Mods, can you please create a new thread about Brussels as I think there are as many posts about Brussels stations as there are about Köln Hbf?!

TeaLovingDave · 16 Dec 2019

Bletchleyite said:
I've not personally had a problem with Brussel-Zuid, it's just the area it's in is a total and utter dive[1] which can spread to petty crime e.g. pickpocketing and luggage theft inside the station. It's also a pig-ugly dump of a station, but that's a different issue.

[1] I walked to it from the centre once and the walk goes through places which really do feel unsafe.

Yes, that is definitely true - not only was the surrounding area rather unpleasant and unsafe in feel (myself and Helly did the exact same walk on one evening) but we nearly got hit at full speed by a lorry running a red light around a corner just down the road from the station towards the end of said walk.

jon0844 said:
Hamburg is a place that was always a bit rough from my first experience in the 1990s. Mostly limited to the station and surrounds, but not a massive problem if you look and act confident. Worthwhile making the effort to go to Miniatur Wunderland!

Hamburg is a little rough around the immediate environs of the Hbf, but nowhere near as rough as Brussels-Midi

and as you say, confidence and not looking like a target gets you most of the way through that kind of situation. The area perhaps 150 metres to the south onwards is fine.

Serathor · 16 Dec 2019

I have just got back from Cologne (Yesterday) and we used, Cologne airport station, Cologne Central Hbf, Cologne West, and Munster and after getting the wrong train (wrong ticket) another station (the name escapes me) and not once did I feel threatened. Infact it was all a very enjoyable experience. And I for one suffer from anxiety a lot but I was very much at ease here.
Yes there where homeless people, beggers etc but no more than there is here.
My only complaint at Cologne Central is that there is a lack of seating and I did not see a single member of staff anywhere that I could ask for help when I needed it. (later found a central help point desk near the main entrance, but that was only manned by two members of staff)

One way to annoy the wife, when she want's to visit the Christmas Markets.... Take pictures of German Rolling stock

MrBickley · 16 Dec 2019

This looks like a chance to share experiences. Absolutely no problem with Cologne, and I spent nearly a day around the station a few years ago when snow in early December caught out DB before the trains were "winterised". I lived in Brussels for several months and never had any problem - indeed I thought it was a great city to live in. But much of Paris really does seem to be dodgy - in particular I recommend any readers to be careful about walking from the Gare du Nord to the Gare de L'Est. It's no further than Euston to King's Cross but much more threatening IMO.

duesselmartin · 16 Dec 2019

Did just that in Paris during daylight. Creepy.

Bletchleyite · 17 Dec 2019

duesselmartin said:
Did just that in Paris during daylight. Creepy.

Did I mention that Paris is a crime-ridden dump? Done exactly that walk, and no, it's not nice.

AlbertBeale · 17 Dec 2019

MrBickley said:
... But much of Paris really does seem to be dodgy - in particular I recommend any readers to be careful about walking from the Gare du Nord to the Gare de L'Est. It's no further than Euston to King's Cross but much more threatening IMO.

I don't think it's even as far as Euston - Kings Cross (though further than St P - KX!). I must say it's a very convenient quick interchange for onward journeys arriving from London at the Gare du Nord, which I prefer to travelling onward via Gare de Lyon where it's possible. I've only ever done that stretch in daylight in recent years - a minute east from the Nord station, turn right, and down that flight of steps overlooking the Est station, it seems to take no time at all. But after what some of you have said, I'll start getting worried next time I want to go that way ... and maybe see dangers I wouldn't have recognised as such before. Thanks for the nightmares!

(Though presumably the main road route [down the road opposite Gare du Nord that the bus to Gare de Lyon used to leave from, bearing left at the end] - which is not much longer - can't be particularly dodgy, even if the back streets via the steps are?)

Incidentally - someone suggested a Brussels station thread was needed; maybe a Paris one too?!

Cologne station safe?

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