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158s on Clitheroes

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Bovverboy

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I hope this isn't a silly question, but how long have 158s been doing Clitheroes? The recent norm seems to have been Sprinter + 153, or Sprinter on its own.
 
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thealexweb

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There were whispers of Class 158s appearing on the Clitheroe stoppers about 18 months ago and nothing came of it.

In the last week I have seen the following heading up to Clitheroe:

142+153
150
150+153
 

Llama

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Plenty of 158s booked on Clitheroe services next week, I believe a few have been up there this week but not sure if swapped to a specific diagram for training of Blackburn crew or booked traction.

Last time until recently as far as I know that a 158 went up to Clitheroe on a service from Manchester was when I took one up in about 2007.
 

td97

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I hope this isn't a silly question, but how long have 158s been doing Clitheroes? The recent norm seems to have been Sprinter + 153, or Sprinter on its own.
Never have 158s been used on the line that I recall. Pre-2007 would fit with that.
Always have been booked 150+153, 150+150, 150+142 or 142+142. Occasional 156 during distruption.
It certainly makes sense now that both Rochdale and Bolton lines have had enhancements to line speed (Bolton 100/95mph and Rochdale 90mph).
A quirk of the timetable is that up services have always had the 85-90mph 319s chasing them towards Manchester from Bolton, being timed to depart immediately behind. With the 331s actually being able to able to reach the full 100mph, removing the slow 75mph Sprinters is a good move by Northern. But let me guess... these 158s will be coupled up with a 150/156, rendering the 90mph capability useless?
 

Philip

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The 195s seem a better fit for the Clitheroe services than the 158s; have they been cleared for this route? I'd have also thought the 158s used for the Clitheroe would be better on some of the quieter York-Blackpool diagrams.

The 158 to Clitheroe in 2007 must have been a collector's item, as at that time they were (almost!) exclusively used on Yorkshire/North East services.
 

Bletchleyite

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The 195s seem a better fit for the Clitheroe services than the 158s; have they been cleared for this route? I'd have also thought the 158s used for the Clitheroe would be better on some of the quieter York-Blackpool diagrams.

Fundamentally Northern have got a load of 158s - end doored IC/express layout DMUs - and are using them on local stopping services. They've also got a load of 195s - doors at thirds regional layout DMUs with superb acceleration (ideal for stopping services) and high capacity and standbacks (ideal for high volume city commuter services into Manchester and Liverpool) - and are using them on regional express services. They have also got 170s and use those instead of 195s on stopping services, wasting a load of diesel heating and churning up transmission oil instead of making the thing move.

The mind boggles as to what Northern's management were playing at.
 

Mathew S

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This morning the 0825 departure from Clitheroe to Rochdale was a 158+153. That said, there is all sorts of fun and games happening around Bolton/Wigan/Southport this morning with services cancelled, stopped short, and diverted left right and centre, so it may just have been what they happened to have available to operate the diagram.
 

156420

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That is the correct formation. Of the 4 Clitheroe diagrams - 2 are booked 158+153 the other two are 150+142.
 

td97

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That is the correct formation. Of the 4 Clitheroe diagrams - 2 are booked 158+153 the other two are 150+142.
That's useful to know - thanks.
Do you know what is booked for the 1tph Blackburn terminators? TIA
 

skh93

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First one I saw running was Saturday, something I hoped would happen for a while now
 

dave87016

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Plenty of 158s booked on Clitheroe services next week, I believe a few have been up there this week but not sure if swapped to a specific diagram for training of Blackburn crew or booked traction.

Last time until recently as far as I know that a 158 went up to Clitheroe on a service from Manchester was when I took one up in about 2007.

I remember that as they were very rare and I was waiting at Darwen waiting for a train to man vic as I was meeting some drivers and guards from man vic for a few beers round town and was surprised when a 158 turned up
 

Llama

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It was only really possible because there was a 158 which was booked to lay over back then from about 1pm til about midnight in Man Vic reversing siding, very rarely it was used as a spare set if nothing else was available.
 

Ant158

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Only remember seeing 158s at Clitheroe on the Sunday Dalesrail services. Be good to see more 2/2 seating on this route.
 

Wtloild

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Have been to Clitheroe on 2x156 in the past & it was too long for the platforms at Langho, Whalley & Clitheroe.
Presume 2x158 would have same issue.
 

Geeves

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Just for a bit of variety there was a 3 car 158 on the Clitheroe services yesterday
 

30907

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Have been to Clitheroe on 2x156 in the past & it was too long for the platforms at Langho, Whalley & Clitheroe.
Presume 2x158 would have same issue.
Is that still the case? Satellite view shows signs of relatively recent platform lengthening, which confirms my memory.
 

td97

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158+153 on 2J25 etc.
2 diagrams today both single 142s. Hall ith Wood & Kearsley am peak calls skip-stopped this morning. Both stations have a bus shelter and nothing else.
 

Llama

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Is that still the case? Satellite view shows signs of relatively recent platform lengthening, which confirms my memory.
Yes it's still the case. They were lengthened maybe 7-8 years ago if I remember rightly.
 

Wtloild

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Yes it's still the case. They were lengthened maybe 7-8 years ago if I remember rightly.

The instance I referred to of 2x156 overhanging the platform at Clitheroe wasn't very recent, but certainly less that 7-8yrs - probably about 12-18 months ago.
Fairly sure no work has been done since then (my mother lives almost next to the station, so I'm there relatively frequently).
It can cope with 2x150s ok - the shot I've just viewed on Google maps shows a 142+150 just fitting on the southbound platform.
I do know that some stations further south on that line have had their platforms lengthened recently e.g. Hal'ith Wood & Darwen.
There is scope for lengthening at Clitheroe, but I think Whalley would be a struggle with the viaduct beginning right at the south end of the platforms.
 

Llama

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It's quite a few years since Hall I Th Wood was lengthened, Darwen has been fiddled with a bit more recently and they can't seem to make their mind up when to stop messing about with Entwistle.
 

158756

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Fundamentally Northern have got a load of 158s - end doored IC/express layout DMUs - and are using them on local stopping services. They've also got a load of 195s - doors at thirds regional layout DMUs with superb acceleration (ideal for stopping services) and high capacity and standbacks (ideal for high volume city commuter services into Manchester and Liverpool) - and are using them on regional express services. They have also got 170s and use those instead of 195s on stopping services, wasting a load of diesel heating and churning up transmission oil instead of making the thing move.

The mind boggles as to what Northern's management were playing at.

In general the best and newest trains go to the fastest routes. How would you make a business case for new trains on a branch line like this or a suburban route losing money like it's going out of fashion, unless something is designed like a Pacer with minimal costs? The 158s will be, along with the other Sprinters, the oldest (worst) units on rails when the Pacers go, and are thus ideal for Northern.
 

Bletchleyite

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In general the best and newest trains go to the fastest routes. How would you make a business case for new trains on a branch line like this or a suburban route losing money like it's going out of fashion

Well, London Midland made that case, and transformed the Snow Hill lines with the excellent Class 172s. I'd have rathered they got the wires up, but it is a close second. And WMT have done it again (I know their operation is awful) with the CAF DMUs.

So I would say it is entirely feasible. The Birmingham suburban operation really isn't very different from the Manchester one.
 
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