LNR RRBs not entered in planner etc

Bletchleyite · 27 Dec 2019

Now, I appreciate the answer to this could well be, or probably is, "because they are grossly incompetent", but let's have a go anyway.

LNR were, as usual, running buses on the Marston Vale this afternoon, the excuse for their incompetence this time being inability to manage their staff rosters properly (or somesuch).

The trains were shown as cancelled in the relevant systems, but no bus was added to the STP (short-term plan) so you had to know they were operating it (it wasn't even added as a note on the cancelled train so you'd see it on the PIS against the cancellation). I only had a feeling they would be (and Tweeted to confirm) because I saw a coach at Bletchley this morning and remembered which company it was. It slotted in between the large-scale RRB operation on the MML at Bedford, and there was no information whatsoever about it. I bet lots of people didn't travel as a result.

Why is even this too hard for them?

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DarloRich · 27 Dec 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Now, I appreciate the answer to this could well be, or probably is, "because they are grossly incompetent", but let's have a go anyway.

LNR were, as usual, running buses on the Marston Vale this afternoon, the excuse for their incompetence this time being inability to manage their staff rosters properly (or somesuch).

The trains were shown as cancelled in the relevant systems, but no bus was added to the STP (short-term plan) so you had to know they were operating it (it wasn't even added as a note on the cancelled train so you'd see it on the PIS against the cancellation). I only had a feeling they would be (and Tweeted to confirm) because I saw a coach at Bletchley this morning and remembered which company it was. It slotted in between the large-scale RRB operation on the MML at Bedford, and there was no information whatsoever about it. I bet lots of people didn't travel as a result.

Why is even this too hard for them?

It is a fairly regular occurrence. We are used to it

Dren Ahmeti · 28 Dec 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Now, I appreciate the answer to this could well be, or probably is, "because they are grossly incompetent", but let's have a go anyway.

LNR were, as usual, running buses on the Marston Vale this afternoon, the excuse for their incompetence this time being inability to manage their staff rosters properly (or somesuch).

The trains were shown as cancelled in the relevant systems, but no bus was added to the STP (short-term plan) so you had to know they were operating it (it wasn't even added as a note on the cancelled train so you'd see it on the PIS against the cancellation). I only had a feeling they would be (and Tweeted to confirm) because I saw a coach at Bletchley this morning and remembered which company it was. It slotted in between the large-scale RRB operation on the MML at Bedford, and there was no information whatsoever about it. I bet lots of people didn't travel as a result.

Why is even this too hard for them?

If the buses were arranged outside of the STP window, then VSTP 0B00 schedules would be somewhere to be found.
If there are no schedules whatsoever, then that is a planning issue that NR at Milton Keynes should pick up on.

Bletchleyite · 28 Dec 2019

Dren Ahmeti said:
If the buses were arranged outside of the STP window, then VSTP 0B00 schedules would be somewhere to be found.
If there are no schedules whatsoever, then that is a planning issue that NR at Milton Keynes should pick up on.

Sorry, I did mean VSTP. I couldn't see any evidence of anything anywhere.

It was an "on-spec-ish" RRB, but the coach had been on standby all day.

87015 · 28 Dec 2019

Throw a few quid on the info controller desk(s) being vacant yet again.

Dren Ahmeti · 28 Dec 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Sorry, I did mean VSTP. I couldn't see any evidence of anything anywhere.

It was an "on-spec-ish" RRB, but the coach had been on standby all day.

If it was a bus/coach on standby, rather than connecting onto a service, then it would be ad-hoc, and a schedule wouldn’t be created.
I know that this is annoying for you and customers, but the majority of Marston Vale cancellations have been due to very short-notice driver sickness etc.

Dren Ahmeti · 28 Dec 2019

87015 said:
Throw a few quid on the info controller desk(s) being vacant yet again.

That role is rarely vacant in LNR, as there are sufficient staff available to fill that role even during strikes.
However, it could be Control doesn’t have the capability/staff to shove a VSTP request through, or even NR might be struggling for staff.
No-one knows what goes on in the wibbly-wobbly world of The Quadrant...

87015 · 28 Dec 2019

Dren Ahmeti said:
That role is rarely vacant in LNR, as there are sufficient staff available to fill that role even during strikes.
However, it could be Control doesn’t have the capability/staff to shove a VSTP request through, or even NR might be struggling for staff.
No-one knows what goes on in the wibbly-wobbly world of The Quadrant...

They LNR show it vacant often enough in their messaging. Don’t need to VSTP buses they can be directly input to CIS. No idea why you are mentioning the quadrant, the booked trains were planned but cancelled on the day due to lack of LNR staff/interest.

Dren Ahmeti · 28 Dec 2019

87015 said:
They LNR show it vacant often enough in their messaging. Don’t need to VSTP buses they can be directly input to CIS. No idea why you are mentioning the quadrant, the booked trains were planned but cancelled on the day due to lack of LNR staff/interest.

Inputting buses directly onto the CIS is not how it works, better still to get a member of staff out there telling people about the cancellations and further connections, but that’s contrary to advice that the higher ups are putting out re Safety.

In the control environment - especially on LNR - some aspects of the INCO role are sometimes absorbed by other people, or doubled up, so Tyrell and the like won’t show someone filling that role.

tsr · 28 Dec 2019

Yes, ad hoc buses can just be created in Darwin (Admin Workstation) and they should feed downstream to CIS and most journey planners, assuming the Darwin connection is working. There’s always a handful of other random flaws (for example, some platform-mounted CIS systems won’t show buses reliably) but it’s not hard to get the information out to at least a few people.

It’s not hard to do it for standby buses either - the station staff need to give a few minutes’ notice to their Control and the bus can be created, assuming there’s a template and it doesn’t need to be invented from scratch.

Dren Ahmeti · 28 Dec 2019

tsr said:
Yes, ad hoc buses can just be created in Darwin (Admin Workstation) and they should feed downstream to CIS and most journey planners, assuming the Darwin connection is working. There’s always a handful of other random flaws (for example, some platform-mounted CIS systems won’t show buses reliably) but it’s not hard to get the information out to at least a few people.

It’s not hard to do it for standby buses either - the station staff need to give a few minutes’ notice to their Control and the bus can be created, assuming there’s a template and it doesn’t need to be invented from scratch.

But, and I do have to agree with @87015 here, when there are staff shortages, the least thing on people’s minds is logging into Darwin and rustling up a template and schedule for bus connections.
As you might be able to tell, I’m a very big supporter of putting people on the ground, relaying information from Control.

tsr · 28 Dec 2019

Dren Ahmeti said:
But, and I do have to agree with @87015 here, when there are staff shortages, the least thing on people’s minds is logging into Darwin and rustling up a template and schedule for bus connections.
As you might be able to tell, I’m a very big supporter of putting people on the ground, relaying information from Control.

Darwin is pretty quick when you use it a lot. It has its frustrating moments and it’s clunky, but the secret is to have all the templates ready and then create a new bus (or train) based on them. Then it takes about 15 seconds to create an “STP Bus” once you know the departure time and locations being served.

I do agree about having staff on the frontline, wherever possible, but I’m very aware that there are quite a few locations where there are no station staff for 10 or 15 miles around, at least off-peak, which is when you have the most unfamiliar passengers often travelling. My preferred option is to instruct staff at the bus’s origin (or the driver, if there aren’t any station staff) to call Control with a bus departure time and calling pattern, and then add it to the CIS and planners for all to see. This is because it works both ways in terms of Control speaking to the front line - I’ve had countless buses disappear off the face of the earth because the station staff didn’t tell anyone where they were going (sometimes neither the bus company nor the train operator know, and as for passengers, well...!).

Bletchleyite · 28 Dec 2019

Dren Ahmeti said:
But, and I do have to agree with @87015 here, when there are staff shortages, the least thing on people’s minds is logging into Darwin and rustling up a template and schedule for bus connections.
As you might be able to tell, I’m a very big supporter of putting people on the ground, relaying information from Control.

Which is all very well, but it doesn't feed online systems and phone apps which if you're not already at the station are important. I only even thought there might be a bus as I saw one on standby earlier.

DarloRich · 28 Dec 2019

I will repeat: this happens to us on the vale all the time. We manage. Regardless of vtsp bookings or tyrel or owt.

Even if loaded the buses run to thier own beat rather than the timetbale!

The biggest problem is the fantastic lady on the ticket desk at Bletchley is left to sort everything out with naff all support

Horizon22 · 28 Dec 2019

Dren Ahmeti said:
But, and I do have to agree with @87015 here, when there are staff shortages, the least thing on people’s minds is logging into Darwin and rustling up a template and schedule for bus connections.
As you might be able to tell, I’m a very big supporter of putting people on the ground, relaying information from Control.

That isn't great on a weekend though (which is when these issues normally arrive) and you've got a load of unstaffed stations and someone wants to check the train (bus) times on their app and there's nobody to talk to.

If there's no CIS special notices and nothing at all on departure screens fed through from Control, people are going to assume the station is closed.

2L70 · 28 Dec 2019

Horizon22 said:
That isn't great on a weekend though (which is when these issues normally arrive) and you've got a load of unstaffed stations and someone wants to check the train (bus) times on their app and there's nobody to talk to.

Sounds like TPE this after when they cancelled a load of Airports from Cleethorpes and no advice to go “where next”...

156420 · 28 Dec 2019

I had this happen a while ago, no RRB’s on CIS or Journey Planner.

I’d never entered them through Tyrell before, and there wasn’t even a template! I had to do everything from scratch. I had to do that rather than through LICC because of a potential effect on the PIDD scores.

The problem is and one of the quirks of Darwin is that even when you put them in through Tyrell or LICC the platforms don’t show up, and you manually have to enter the platform, easy if there’s only 1 or 2 of course!

LNR RRBs not entered in planner etc

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