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London North Eastern Railway (LNER) First Class service

DJCC

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Went on LNER first class a few weeks ago - 1930 EDI-LKX.

Had the Yorkshire pudding and partner had the tart - both were decent although portions felt very small. Also maybe I'm misremembering but I'm sure last time I took first class (about five years ago) that there were plated starters and desserts rather than things from the trolley?

On the positives, the team were great - the train emptied out after Newcastle (probably as not many people fancied getting into London at 0100) so basically had the carriage to ourselves - was a bit like having a personal bar as staff said we could come and take whatever we wanted from the trolley!

It was a HST set and found the way it was setup to be really comfortable and spacious - real shame they are getting rid of them.
 
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ainsworth74

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Also maybe I'm misremembering but I'm sure last time I took first class (about five years ago) that there were plated starters and desserts rather than things from the trolley?

You'd have to go back a long way for that! I don't think they've done plated starters since the days of restaurant cars and at-seat dining (all paid for) which came to an end in May 2011.

Deserts are still plated but only on "Chef's Signature Menu" trains which is served on evening peak northboud services from Kings Cross.
 

DJCC

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Aha - on this service it was a ginger and date slice that came in a packet - was nice but didn't feel super first class to me. Although can't really complain as ticket was only £10 extra (last train to KGX not so popular I guess)
 
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ainsworth74

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Aha - on this service it was a ginger and date slice that came in a packet - was nice but didn't feel super first class to me.

Yes that'd be right. The northbound trains on an evening still have two proper deserts (usually some cheese and biscuits or something a bit sweeter) but the rest of them you'll get offered a slice of cake.

Thinking on it a bit more I think in pre-Virgin Trains East Coast days they did serve the slice on a plate. On a weekday at least you'd get a slice of cake and your sandwiches served on a plate rather than in packaging. It wasn't exactly a big thing but but did lend the experience a bit more of "first class" air.
 

DJCC

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Just read through lots old posts on this thread - agree with consensus that atmosphere and staff are generally decent but constituency is lacking - looks like I was offered way more drink than other posters, but my food portion was tiny - a little tart plus a few leaves and a tiny sliver of dressing! Lucky I was able to fill up on shortbread!
 

TT-ONR-NRN

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Yes that'd be right. The northbound trains on an evening still have two proper deserts (usually some cheese and biscuits or something a bit sweeter) but the rest of them you'll get offered a slice of cake.

Thinking on it a bit more I think in pre-Virgin Trains East Coast days they did serve the slice on a plate. On a weekday at least you'd get a slice of cake and your sandwiches served on a plate rather than in packaging. It wasn't exactly a big thing but but did lend the experience a bit more of "first class" air.
This sums up my experiences to a T. I’ve travelled regularly on long distance journeys in first with LNER - mainly on the 225s, with a few HST journeys and a couple of Azumas - and since they’ve taken over from Virgin Trains East Coast they just don’t seem to try as much… even the sort of thing they offer now seems downgraded. The miniscule beef stew with a frozen yorkshire pudding really wasn’t the same as the Roast Chicken with trimmings that Virgin Trains East Coast used to offer at one point.
 

westv

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is it my imagination or has the evening meal menu become even more limited. The only main meal options are chicken supreme or mushroom wellington. No alternative swap for different weeks.
 

voyagerdude220

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Taken from the LNER website:
Facilities on the 11:00 Edinburgh to London Kings Cross due 15:40.
Will be formed of 5 coaches instead of 10. There are no reservations on this service.

Facilities on the 13:30 Edinburgh to London Kings Cross due 17:51.
Catering is reduced throughout There will be no hot food and limited hot drinks on this service, due to a kitchen fault. .
 

westv

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I think the treacle tart and miniscule scoop of clotted cream is probably the worst of the selections I've had.
 

30907

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is it my imagination or has the evening meal menu become even more limited. The only main meal options are chicken supreme or mushroom wellington. No alternative swap for different weeks.
Yes, plus the dish of the week (which on Monday was a veggie chillie, slightly less substantial). All are IMO reasonable, the chicken was excessively meat-heavy back in the summer, but if I were a regular traveller I might be getting fed up!
I think the treacle tart and miniscule scoop of clotted cream is probably the worst of the selections I've had.
My wife and I thought it was pretty decent for quality and reasonable quantity.

But this is very subjective.

Meanwhile I was caught out on Monday by the second drinks run (coffee/tea after meal) being the last. The train (1833) wasn't over busy and there were only 2 serving staff, so is this now the norm on the shorter runs?
 

westv

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When did they drop the menu rotation? When rail companies change things it so often seems to be for the worse - and it's often done on the quiet.
 

ScotTrains

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Yes that'd be right. The northbound trains on an evening still have two proper deserts (usually some cheese and biscuits or something a bit sweeter) but the rest of them you'll get offered a slice of cake.
It's a real shame none of the southbound services have proper deserts. The popular 1830 departure from Edinburgh would be an ideal candidate. The lack of desert is one of the main reasons I prefer to travel down the west coast. Both the 1730 and 1840 from Glasgow Central serve deserts/ cheese board.
 

ainsworth74

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It's a real shame none of the southbound services have proper deserts. The popular 1830 departure from Edinburgh would be an ideal candidate. The lack of desert is one of the main reasons I prefer to travel down the west coast. Both the 1730 and 1840 from Glasgow Central serve deserts/ cheese board.

Yes I quite agree. I can see why they don't go to the same extent as they do from London in the evening where the majority of departures have a full meal service but it does seem crackers that a couple of the key southbound departures from Edinburgh don't have the full service.
 

gaillark

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Yes I quite agree. I can see why they don't go to the same extent as they do from London in the evening where the majority of departures have a full meal service but it does seem crackers that a couple of the key southbound departures from Edinburgh don't have the full service.

Totally agree. I have previously written several times to when it was East Coast, Virgin and more recently to LNER all with the same response that your feedback will be passed on.


As a sideline the problem with today's railway is that customer service functions have been centralised and even contact centre staff don't know whom to contact for a detailed response or just can't be bothered. I still think that customers should be able to contact service delivery managers directly like it used to be in BR days.
 

Big Tim

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Report from my most recent LNER First Class Trip

Outbound: York - Dundee, 11.55, 09/01/20

This was my first experience of the new Azuma trains, and my first LNER run of the new decade. Train arrived early, and I got seated in my reserved single seat in coach L. Reasonably well loaded from Kings Cross, but very few passengers joining or leaving at York (or indeed the intermediate stations up to Waverley, where loading dropped to around 25% in my coach).

I know discussion re: rolling stock is covered elsewhere in detail, but I will just touch on it briefly. I did not find the seats themselves particularly uncomfortable, but will certainly admit to preferring the leather upholstery of the HST units which used to serve this run. Being 6'5 though, and "fairly rotund" I did find the biggest issue for me was the large table leg on the single seats was just where my left leg naturally wanted to sit, meaning I had to shift position and get up and walk to the vestibule several times! Plug sockets and WiFi were all in good working order, and seat reservations are certainly much improved when it comes to finding your place, with clear signage and red/green lights to signify vacant seats. The end of carriage luggage racks seemed slightly inadequate, being full on arrival at York. However, seat 01 was out of service, with a sign advising it could be utilised for "luggage overspill".

Service of hot drinks immediately on departure of York, but declined, having enjoyed a pint in York Tap in the half hour I had to kill at the station. Food orders offered shortly afterwards - choosing the Beef / Yorkshire Pudding, and was also handed the dessert option at the same passing (some sort of deconstructed cheesecake in a pot). Cold drinks were next along - I requested a Gin and Tonic - no problem - and also a still water - which unfortunately could not be supplied. For some reason, cold water was on the aforementioned hot drinks trolley, which had now sailed off into "M". This is a bit of an issue with the new trolleys on the Azumas - they are clearly more compact units and everything contained is something of a mystery, as it is all secreted within internal drawers, rather than the traditional "open" trolleys of old.

Food appeared north of Darlington, with a further cold drink run, then followed by hot. Food was fine - exactly the same offering of beef as has been reliably served for what seems like many months. (I echo recent comments that a little more variation would be appreciated - while I rarely traveled in first back in the early days of the complimentary offering with the various operators, I believe back in 2011 there was a weekly rotation over a four week menu plan, which under VTEC reduced to a two weekly rotation, but seemingly now the beef has been in residence for many months. There is supposedly a "weekly special", but no mention of this was made when I placed my order, so maybe an announcement / details on the website or on-board menu could serve passengers with this information).

Further hot and cold drinks offered after Newcastle, with a last service of food for those joining there, and then service was wound down until departure from Waverley. On this occasion, I opted for the "Deli Box" which proved a pleasant snack to accompany a final G&T before leaving the train on time at Dundee. Another offer of the dessert pot made, but I passed on that this time around. Decent service, and all staff thoroughly professional, friendly and helpful. I was also able to help myself to a copy of "The Times" from the luggage rack on this journey, which was appreciated.


Return: Dundee - York, 11.08, 15/01/20

Perhaps the most lightly loaded first class journey I have ever made on this route, probably 25% to Waverley, then less than 50% until my departure at York. Once again took the seat I had reserved in "L" - however, on this occasion, no reservations and no WiFi throughout the journey. Luckily, as the train was so quiet, there were no issues with passengers finding a seat.

Coffee accepted on the approach to the Tay Bridge, along with still water. Shortly after came the food offering - all that was available was a somewhat limp (microwaved?) croissant with butter and jam (no porridge, yogurt or bacon roll as has been the usual offering in recent times on this service). Crew member was very apologetic, and on the return to the kitchen did offer a second croissant, but I decided against it. A second pour of coffee post-Leuchars before service was stopped and preparations made for the crew change at Edinburgh.

Once again I went for the Beef option for lunch, which was served around East Fortune (pretty speedy service, with such a light loading), along with a G&T. I think the chefs at LNER must have been sent a load of jars of "Silverskin Onions" in the post-Christmas period, as my meal consisted mostly of those, with two half new potatoes, three pieces of beef and two half mushrooms for company! Declined crisps and pretzels, but had the cheesecake dessert once again. Further G&T south of Newcastle, but nothing offered to Darlington passengers - I assume there would be at least one more "full run" after York as the train continued non-stop to Kings Cross.

Once again, the journey ran absolutely on time, with a friendly and helpful on-board crew.
 

47271

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All I can say is that it's better than this.

https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...ting-first-class-service.198768/#post-4395389

There's no doubt in my mind that, with the exception of the far from essential free booze poured down our necks, you can't rely on any First Class to feed you to an adequate standard any more. LNER and other operators need to consider this because people like me justify especially evening First Class travel on the basis that it readily offsets subsistence claims. If the complimentary offer isn't worth the additional price paid, and you have to go to M&S before boarding anyway, then I'll happily trade down. I did that long ago on GWR and Grand Central to mention but two...
 

ScotTrains

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I've just booked my first trip on an Azuma for my wife and I. I requested a table for two (as I always do) but the booking office said they had all been reserved. When I got home I checked the seating layout and was quite shocked to find that there is only two tables for two on the whole 9 car train! Even a 4 car voyager has more than this!

Is this a design error? We often travel 1st class after work on a Friday and I would say at that time most people onboard are couples with a few single travellers and even fewer groups of 4. I realise that different types of people (business, leisure etc) travel at different times of the week but there seems to be a awful lot of single seats compared to seats at tables for two. Part of the appeal of 1st class is not having to share your table with strangers. I just hope the service isn't busy.

My first experience of Azuma 1st class isn't very good and this is before I even start my journey!
 

ainsworth74

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I've just booked my first trip on an Azuma for my wife and I. I requested a table for two (as I always do) but the booking office said they had all been reserved. When I got home I checked the seating layout and was quite shocked to find that there is only two tables for two on the whole 9 car train! Even a 4 car voyager has more than this!

Is this a design error?

It's a fairly long standing complaint with the first class seating layout! Blame the DfT (though to be fair VTEC, as was, could have chosen to adjust it themselves such as they did when they had a buffet added) for deciding that only a handful of tables for two were required. I assume the DfTs view is that first class business travellers will often be either solo or in groups of three or four so you don't need to worry quite so much about the leisure first class passengers who will often travel in pairs.

Personally I think that that's wrong headed and that the split between solo seats and bays of two was just about right on the Mk4s (the electric trains) that operate the route. There probably is an argument for maybe a handful of extra solo seats in that Mk4 layout but on the whole it was spot on. But we've been given what we've been given certainly when I travel with my mum we often travel first class and usually go for a bay of two. Presumably that option won't be available to us anymore in which case part of the appeal of first class is lost (particularly when an airline bay of two offers arguably more privacy than being at a table for four in first class!).
 

47271

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I've just booked my first trip on an Azuma for my wife and I. I requested a table for two (as I always do) but the booking office said they had all been reserved. When I got home I checked the seating layout and was quite shocked to find that there is only two tables for two on the whole 9 car train! Even a 4 car voyager has more than this!

Is this a design error? We often travel 1st class after work on a Friday and I would say at that time most people onboard are couples with a few single travellers and even fewer groups of 4. I realise that different types of people (business, leisure etc) travel at different times of the week but there seems to be a awful lot of single seats compared to seats at tables for two. Part of the appeal of 1st class is not having to share your table with strangers. I just hope the service isn't busy.

My first experience of Azuma 1st class isn't very good and this is before I even start my journey!
Totally agree, but apparently LNER make more money from solo business travellers paying full price. Or so we're told.

This may be true south of Leeds and York, although I'm far from convinced. It certainly isn't true north of York where First Class business is heavily skewed to older couples on Advances in my experience.

Oh, and I'm a solo business traveller often paying full price who'd rather take my chances with someone sitting opposite me rather than trying to work on one of those tiny shelf tables at single seats.

But what do we know. I suspect that the reality is that it suits both government and operator to cram in as many seats as possible, and this is the way of doing it in First Class.
 
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route101

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As a solo traveller , more single seat bays please ha . The pendos only feature a few.
 

ScotTrains

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As a solo traveller , more single seat bays please ha . The pendos only feature a few.
On a 9 car Azuma train I count 32 single seats compared to just two tables for two!! This ratio seems way off to me.
The leisure market, though not as lucrative as the business market, still provides extra income during off peak periods. The lack of tables for two is very off putting. Many solo travellers also prefer the tables for two as they have much more space.
 

route101

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On a 9 car Azuma train I count 32 single seats compared to just two tables for two!! This ratio seems way off to me.
The leisure market, though not as lucrative as the business market, still provides extra income during off peak periods. The lack of tables for two is very off putting. Many solo travellers also prefer the tables for two as they have much more space.

A bay of two is great until you have a stranger opposite ha.
 

Scotrail314209

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Coach K tends to fill quite easily, with the 12:00 Edinburgh - London being near full in First Class. Most of the passengers in the tables were travelling in a couple, and ended up having to share with another couple. Really think they could do with more tables for 2.
 

Butts

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Whichever seat you get (solo or twin) will be like an ironing board compared to their HST predecessors which were more akin to armchairs.

Do none of the Azumas have more than 2 First Class Carriages ?
 

Scotrail314209

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Whichever seat you get (solo or twin) will be like an ironing board compared to their HST predecessors which were more akin to armchairs.

Do none of the Azumas have more than 2 First Class Carriages ?

9 cars have 2 with an extra half carriage. I really do not see the point in the half carriage
 

47271

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9 cars have 2 with an extra half carriage. I really do not see the point in the half carriage
It's really less than two in total: K is a half, L is full, and M is less than half because of the kitchen. The point of the half I suppose is that it's more than nothing!

More generally, I tend to head for M if I don't like my reservation because it seems to be the last one allocated by the booking system. But then you do have the din and yakking coming from the kitchen, and there can be a tendency for staff belongings to spill into the public area, Pendolino Coach K style.

I always go for K30 if it's available when I'm booking. It's the one backing on to the partition through to Standard and as a result is a single seat at a full width table, great for spreading out work stuff. You might have two strangers opposite you of course, but that doesn't bother me.
 

ainsworth74

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Considering the not inconsiderable reduction in first class I think it become much more obvious why weekend first went up to £35 and cheaper APs (certainly on journey too/from London there are still bargains on other parts of the route) are much harder to come by than in previous years....
 

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