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Southern Region late 1970s - class 73s and 47s

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hexagon789

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Hexagon - Right I had a look through my old book yesterday and I’ve got things wrong somewhat. :oops:
What I was actually remembering was the 11:05 Brighton to Exeter which I covered many times that year and it was booked for a 47/4.
Alongside this Network Southeast had (I think) 47473, 47547 and 47587* on trial in 1987/88 on Waterloo - Exeter services.
I can tell you what 47s I had on that Brighton service that year but unfortunately not the dates as I’ve lost the book with them in.

(*All freshly repainted in large logo)

No worries, I appreciate you having a look anyway :)

I do have an 1986 and 1990 Plat 5 combined somewhere but the latter is just as the 47/7s
were being transferred and 1986 is still 50s territory so my ability to find that sort of information is more limited.

As I said last time though, the area is a bit outside my sphere of interests which is mainly Scotland and recently Ireland, which I have found fascinating to learn more about rail-wise.

Nevertheless I do like my 47s, so any information about them anywhere is always of interest! ;)
 
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randyrippley

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from http://extra.southernelectric.org.uk/features/historical-features/watexdieselops.html

During the 1980s, prior to the reorganisation of BR from a regional production led railway to the business orientated organisation the planned rolling stock cascade for Exeter-Waterloo had always been towards HSTs-either as full 2+8 or 1+5 half units. 125 mph operation would never be realised but line speed increases to 100 mph or 110 mph and the high power to weight ratio of 2+8 the sets would have resulted in significant accelerations.

However, even with the East Coast electrification, changes in the InterCity Sector meant that IC125s would not now be cascaded as these are prime revenue generators, alternative modernisation schemes had to be developed. In the shorter term, Class 50 and Mk IIs could not survive as viable business options much beyond 1992 and alternatives demanded urgent consideration in 1988 to cover the next four to five years.

Double heading by both Class 33 and Class 50 was considered (platform lengths at Waterloo still prevent this) as was push-pull operation with Class 37/4 provided one at each end. Sustained 90 mph running would be on the limits of the traction motors as fitted to Class 37 even though of the same basic EE538 type as in Class 50, while the 85 mph maximum speed of Class 33 would no longer be acceptable.

One obvious solution was the use of Class 47/4s although this would bring in problems if its own. In October 1988 47473/547/587/589 joined the Class 50 pool at Laira. The fuel capacity limitation remained, so only particular duties were diagrammed for Class 47s rather than in a common user pool. No significant increase in availability resulted, and highlighted another difficulty-different braking characteristics showed up in higher brake block wear with the Class 47s needing reblocking during the third day of each three day diagram.

The ideal long fuel range (1295 gallon) Class 47/7 could not all be released from Provincial (Scotland) in May 1989, and increased InterCity Class 47/4 requirement meant that the better examples were converted to extended fuel range Class 47/8 by InterCity-operationally suitable but not available.

Class 47/4s had been diagrammed to certain Waterloo-Exeter line duties already-but never on the high mileage continuous turns. In 1984 0140 SX Waterloo-Exeter and 0643 SX return became the first regular duty on the line. Later, in 1986, 2100 Sun / 2210 SX Waterloo-Salisbury returning next day 0640 SX / 0700 SO Salisbury-Waterloo was diagrammed for a Bescot loco, while in 1988 one Bath Road diagram covered 0547 SO Exeter-Hove and 1105 SO Brighton-Exeter, and a second 0938 SO Plymouth-Brighton returning 1710 SUN Brighton-Plymouth.

Only Class 47/4s requiring major expenditure on F exams were left over-but Class 50s with more recent heavy classified repairs were still in service. The effect was that from May 1989 a pool of twenty Class 50 was created, along with eight 9-car and four 6-car Mk II sets to cover the entire Waterloo-Salisbury-Exeter service. At the same time this theoretically allowed NSE then to withdraw from the support of Class 33, and in the longer term from TC stock.

Locomotive availability continued at a low level in 1990-at times as few as six out of the twenty dedicated Class 50s were available for service. Several were stopped waiting spare parts for very minor faults, while more serious failures increased in frequency high engine hours and mileages run since last classified repairs. During November 1990, 33101/09/16 were restored to 85 mph running under the DM&EE pool and were initially pressed into service with TC sets to cover Mk II vehicles out of service, while into 1991 various Class 47s were loaned, including the first examples of 47/7s from the NSE Thames & Chilterns pool.

Under increasing pressure to meet financial targets NSE imposed service cuts on its allegedly most expensive service in January 1991. The resource base was reduced by two coaching sets and two locomotives, involving withdrawal of several Waterloo-Salisbury short workings, cutting back of the Plymouth-Brighton service to Southampton, and reintroduction of DEMU working between Basingstoke and Salisbury to fill new gaps in the service. As the Civil Engineer withdrew from support of Class 50 the former WR engines passed to NSE pool in February 1991.

By this time projected route modernisation had been decided upon, and the demise of the Railfreight Distribution Speedlink network in July 1991 cascaded sufficient other Class 47/4s allowing NSE to put 47/7s on the regular West of England line duties. By October 1991 47701-03/05- 12/14-17 formed NTWE pool still based at Old Oak Common and working alongside the remaining operational Class 50s.

But the use of Class 47/7s did not solve the routes problems-day to day provision of motive power was still difficult and numerous substitutions of wrong Sector locomotives continued. Using small pools of 25-30 year old machinery of any class on such demanding duties is certain to give rise to availability problems.
 

Cowley

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No worries, I appreciate you having a look anyway :)

I do have an 1986 and 1990 Plat 5 combined somewhere but the latter is just as the 47/7s
were being transferred and 1986 is still 50s territory so my ability to find that sort of information is more limited.

As I said last time though, the area is a bit outside my sphere of interests which is mainly Scotland and recently Ireland, which I have found fascinating to learn more about rail-wise.

Nevertheless I do like my 47s, so any information about them anywhere is always of interest! ;)
Ok well I’ve got these runs listed in late 87/all of 1988 on various Plymouth/Exeter to Brighton/Hove services and the opposite workings:

47658 Feniton - Exeter
47603 Yeovil J - Exeter
47637 Exeter - Honiton
47618 Exeter St David’s - Exeter Central
47622 Exeter - Southampton
47417 Plymouth - Exeter (09:33 Plymouth - Brighton. I think it continued on)
47433 Exeter - Honiton
47440 Exeter - Honiton
47442 Exeter - Honiton
47444 Salisbury - Southampton
47455 Exeter - Southampton
47463 Dawlish - Newton Abbot (11:12 Brighton to Plymouth)
47473 Exeter - Southampton
47479 Exeter St David’s - Exeter Central
47489 Exeter - Honiton
47501 Exeter - Newton Abbot (11:05 Brighton to Plymouth)
47512 Exeter - Yeovil Junction
47521 Exeter - Axminster
47528 Southampton - Exeter
47542 Exeter - Honiton
47547 Salisbury - Exeter
47557 Exeter - Salisbury
47572 Exeter - Axminster
47575 Exeter - Yeovil junction
47583 Exeter - Honiton
47634 Teignmouth - Axminster
47636 Feniton - Exeter

Quite a collection over the space of 12 months or so!
47636 and 637 were good ex Scottish machines. Nice to see a Generator turn up as well.
 

hexagon789

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Great detail in that, thanks for posting it up

Ok well I’ve got these runs listed in late 87/all of 1988 on various Plymouth/Exeter to Brighton/Hove services and the opposite workings:

47658 Feniton - Exeter
47603 Yeovil J - Exeter
47637 Exeter - Honiton
47618 Exeter St David’s - Exeter Central
47622 Exeter - Southampton
47417 Plymouth - Exeter (09:33 Plymouth - Brighton. I think it continued on)
47433 Exeter - Honiton
47440 Exeter - Honiton
47442 Exeter - Honiton
47444 Salisbury - Southampton
47455 Exeter - Southampton
47463 Dawlish - Newton Abbot (11:12 Brighton to Plymouth)
47473 Exeter - Southampton
47479 Exeter St David’s - Exeter Central
47489 Exeter - Honiton
47501 Exeter - Newton Abbot (11:05 Brighton to Plymouth)
47512 Exeter - Yeovil Junction
47521 Exeter - Axminster
47528 Southampton - Exeter
47542 Exeter - Honiton
47547 Salisbury - Exeter
47557 Exeter - Salisbury
47572 Exeter - Axminster
47575 Exeter - Yeovil junction
47583 Exeter - Honiton
47634 Teignmouth - Axminster
47636 Feniton - Exeter

Quite a collection over the space of 12 months or so!
47636 and 637 were good ex Scottish machines. Nice to see a Generator turn up as well.

Quite the collection indeed! Didn't realise there was a Plymouth-Brighton service via the WoE. So many of these more unusual through trains have been lost it seems.
 

30907

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Quite the collection indeed! Didn't realise there was a Plymouth-Brighton service via the WoE. So many of these more unusual through trains have been lost it seems.
The Brighton/Portsmouth-Exeter-Plymouth has a very complicated history stretching back into SR days and lasting, after a fashion, into the early days of privatisation. I am not up with the detail post 1970, but am sure there have been threads...
 

hexagon789

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The Brighton/Portsmouth-Exeter-Plymouth has a very complicated history stretching back into SR days and lasting, after a fashion, into the early days of privatisation. I am not up with the detail post 1970, but am sure there have been threads...

I have some late-1980s timetables, bit I hadn't noticed the working. I recall SWT used to extend beyond Exeter well into Devon and Cornwall though.
 

Cowley

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I have some late-1980s timetables, bit I hadn't noticed the working. I recall SWT used to extend beyond Exeter well into Devon and Cornwall though.
On Saturdays two of these services left St David’s at around the same time. I think it went like this: The 47 hauled Brighton to Plymouth (after the loco had run round) departed from platform 3, and the 50 hauled Waterloo service (which had pulled in afterwards) departed around the same time.
Often these were given the ‘RA’ at exactly the same time - queue the 50 and 47 bashers giving each other loads grief as the trains raced other off the platform ends.
Great times. :lol:
 
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