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Weather Disruption caused by storm Ciara (February 9th, 10th and 11th)

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edwin_m

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Perhaps I was inaccurate in comparing a weather forecast to a horoscope but the fact remains that a weather forecast is just a prediction and they can get it wrong !

Storm Ciara may have lived up to its promise in certain parts of the country but here in South Yorkshire I've completely ignored the advice not to travel unless necessary and had a trip into Sheffield and back from Barnsley and experienced no disruption whatsoever.

How sad that we've become such a risk-averse society in which the perceived disruption is far worse than the actual disruption!
The last few of these storm warnings seem to have been pretty accurate in terms of timing and extent of disruption. Conversely I only recall one in the last few years (Doris in Feb 2017) which has been worse than expected and caught people out. So for all but the most essential travel I would take them into account and make other arrangements if one came through several days before. One advantage of widely-publicized warnings is that business associates, family members etc are more likely to understand if someone opts not to travel.

What they can't always predict is exactly where it will happen, as a small change in the track of the storm can make a big difference to where it passes over a few hours later. Not too far from you there were three or four trees blown down within a mile of where I live, and at one point the wind was so strong it was pushing the rain upwards and bringing it in through various gaps that would normally drain downwards. But an hour later it was cloudless blue skies.
 
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Nippy

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There are numerous issues on the Western this morning,
Block to Electric Traction - Ladbroke Grove to Acton, Down Main.
BTET - Acton West Dive-under.
B&H line blocked, Theale, tree has bought wires down.
BTET - Swindon to Didcot, OHLE problem in the Uffington area.
 

timothyw9

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Disruption between Wilmslow and Piccadilly this morning due to damage to the OHLE.
Also emergency services dealing with an incident/fatality on the Chat Moss.

Not looking like its going to be a good day considering the existing disruption caused by the storm.
 
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Wolfie

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Well what an experience it has been today! The primary source of disruption for me has not been the weather, nor bus or train operators, but a random individual.

Firstly, let me describe my normal Sunday journey from the marina back to Kidderminster. I catch the 1445 bus (V3, departing Derby 1415) to Burton (because Willington station has no Sunday service), followed by a quick dash round Sainsbury's and then arrive at Kidderminster at either 1657 or 1733 depending on which train I get from Burton.

Today, mindful of the fact that there were rail replacement buses between Birmingham Snow Hill and Stourbridge Junction, I set off an hour earlier than usual. Shortly after I arrived at the bus stop a car pulled up and the female passenger informed me that there was a tree across the road at Findern and she had seen a bus turn back. "Just so that you won't be waiting for hours." Incidentally, the car was a coupé so they couldn't have given me a lift anyway. So I pondered on my choices, and then decided to walk into Willington to see if the buses were still serving there, as well as there being a 4G signal so that I could see where they were.

Nearing the end of Findern Lane, the bus went past. Clearly not going to Burton since the display had been changed to 'Derby' and it turned right at the end of the lane to head towards the A38. But that would have been fine for me; I just wanted to catch a train to Birmingham. I was spitting teeth! Subsequently checking things out, there were no buses on the Burton side of the route and the 1415 ex-Derby (the one I normally catch) didn't run. Eventually the one after this turned up at around 1550 and I finally got to Burton, after the driver did a 'one-eighty' around Repton Cross and went back through Willington to pick up the A38 - clearly the normal route through Newton Solney was 'out'.

After this it was fairly mundane for the circumstances: a half-hour fester at Burton as the already heavily delayed 1537 clocked up minute by minute (the auto system being completely thrown by the reduced speed the trains were running at), wedged vomiter to New Street via Lichfield (it can't do a 125mph dash on this route anyway), the RRB to Stourbridge Junction (taking an amazingly convoluted route between The Hawthorns and Smethwick Galton Bridge, which are only a few hundred yards apart by rail!) and finally a leisurely saunter to Kidderminster, arriving at around eight o'clock.

Since then I've bought some snap from Captain Cod's, had a bath and been down the pub. And I'm still cursing that bloody woman - for if nothing else I couldn't do my supermarket shopping which will now have to be done after work tomorrow.
Ouch. To be fair to the woman she was trying to be helpful. Assuming that she wasn't lying about the tree being down l guess that the bus somehow got around it.
 

Antman

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Line reportedly blocked by a fallen tree between Reading and Newbury.
 

jon0844

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Seems there might be a warning (not as severe mind) for further wind on Tuesday?
 

Bantamzen

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Perhaps I was inaccurate in comparing a weather forecast to a horoscope but the fact remains that a weather forecast is just a prediction and they can get it wrong !

Storm Ciara may have lived up to its promise in certain parts of the country but here in South Yorkshire I've completely ignored the advice not to travel unless necessary and had a trip into Sheffield and back from Barnsley and experienced no disruption whatsoever.

How sad that we've become such a risk-averse society in which the perceived disruption is far worse than the actual disruption!

I'd say you were lucky. Not too far north here in West Yorkshire we've had, indeed still got some serious flooding along the river valleys, we've had numerous trees come down in our area including one at the entrance to Baildon station & one on the main road heading towards Guiseley. If you've ever seen a fully grown tree come down suddenly, you'll know that they don't just lightly flop to the ground. Luckily no-one has been injured in these, but it shows that even winds gusting to 70-80mph can cause serious problems. And had the Aire risen another couple of feet, it could have repeated it's trick of a few years ago and started to punt cars, buses & shipping containers down it's course & along the valley. That is why people are advised not to travel unless they have to, the unpredictable nature of power Atlantic storms can play havoc very quickly.
 

Belperpete

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In 2014 a two car DMU very nearly got trapped just north of Tonfanau on the Cambrian due to over-topping of the rock armour and track washouts. Yesterday TfW cancelled all services on the Cambrian. Today, Dyfi Junction is flooded and there is beach debris north of Barmouth which would have been a most definite derailment risk. Llanwrst, on the Conwy Valley line, was flooded today in under an hour with water levels worse than previously recorded. Imagine if a "more robust" less risk-averse management's perception of potential disruption had resulted in a train going headlong into beach debris and ending up in the storm whipped seas at Llanaber, or a train which had passed Llanwrst safely earlier on had returned to be incapacitated by what was not a "Snowdonian stream" but the full fury of the River Conwy which had risen by several feet in the hour since the train had been bumbling up to Llandudno.

TfW, Network Rail and those who took the brave decision to stop the job yesterday deserve praise not sneering pity.

Oh, and the Barmouth-Dolgellau road was closed due to the tidal surge, so should Gwynedd Council and Gogplod be castigated for being risk averse?
The disruption does appear to have been very localised and fast changing. Where I was in Snowdonia, at 9am I was wondering what all the fuss was about, OK it was a bit rainy and gusty but nothing too bad. However, I was glad I didn't venture out, as an hour later, and all hell had been let loose, rain sheeting it down, trees whipping frantically and metal wheelbarrow blowing away down the garden, so bad that I gave up on even going to the shop across the road. A couple of hours later, blue skies and sunshine.
 

30907

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Meanwhile in Germany DB suspended all IC/ICE services until at least 10.00 today (haven't checked for an update...!).

Back on topic: the wind forecast seems to have been remarkably accurate (except perhaps for South Yorkshire :) ) - it wasn't unsafe to drive between Shipley and Bradford yesterday, but I was very glad to have been indoors when a violent storm blew up mid-morning. On the other hand rainfall seems to have been under-forecast for Lancashire and the Pennines, with the Aire, Yorkshire Calder, Lancashire Calder and Ribble (among others) flooding spectacularly.
 

MDB1images

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Caldrew Jn was/is under water(or the area near it).
WCML shut at Carlisle until at least this afternoon.
 

The_Train

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Guessing the Stafford-Wolverhampton line is suffering as well then as I've just watched XC's 1O12 Man Picc to Bournemouth depart Stafford and head down the Trent Valley?
 

Llanigraham

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Cambrian mainline from Machy to Shrewsbury reopened, but Aberystwyth and Pwllheli still closed.
 

CHAPS2034

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Guessing the Stafford-Wolverhampton line is suffering as well then as I've just watched XC's 1O12 Man Picc to Bournemouth depart Stafford and head down the Trent Valley?

Read somewhere that nine trees had come down near Penkridge yesterday. Trees are now removed but lots of OHLE damage which is being repaired today. One hourly XC from Manchester re-routed via Trent Valley; the other is cancelled.
 

The_Train

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Read somewhere that nine trees had come down near Penkridge yesterday. Trees are now removed but lots of OHLE damage which is being repaired today. One hourly XC from Manchester re-routed via Trent Valley; the other is cancelled.

I'm quite surprised at that as the weather wasn't really all that bad around here yesterday. It was wet and windy but nothing out of the ordinary really.

I'm guessing the hourly will be the Bournemouth workings with the South West one the one being cancelled. Out of interest does anyone know what route the XC trains take when they head down the Trent Valley. I'm guessing they don't head down the chase line at Rugeley to get back on track at Birmingham?
 

Belperpete

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Guessing the Stafford-Wolverhampton line is suffering as well then as I've just watched XC's 1O12 Man Picc to Bournemouth depart Stafford and head down the Trent Valley?
OLE damage - see NRE rather extensive list of disruptions.
 

Mag_seven

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Seems there might be a warning (not as severe mind) for further wind on Tuesday?

The problem is that many trees if not brought down yesterday will be sufficiently weakened such that there is a risk that they may come down in a lesser gale. We are not out of the woods yet (no pun intended!).
 

CHAPS2034

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I'm quite surprised at that as the weather wasn't really all that bad around here yesterday. It was wet and windy but nothing out of the ordinary really.

Funny - I always thought Stafford was not close to S Yorkshire...:smile:

Anyway, these things often happen because of an accumulation of reasons. It may be that one tree was in a bad state and it came down, triggering a chain reaction on the surrounding trees. Just like my fence where one of the posts failed after 20 years and brought other bits down as well.:(

I'm guessing the hourly will be the Bournemouth workings with the South West one the one being cancelled. Out of interest does anyone know what route the XC trains take when they head down the Trent Valley. I'm guessing they don't head down the chase line at Rugeley to get back on track at Birmingham?

Here's the gen from XC

Manchester Piccadilly - Bournemouth services will be diverted southbound and not call at Wolverhampton, Birmingham New Street and Birmingham International. These trains will call additionally at Tamworth and Nuneaton, please change at either of these stations for Birmingham New Street. Change at Coventry for Birmingham International. Change at Stafford for road transport towards Wolverhampton.

Bournemouth - Manchester Piccadilly services will run as scheduled to Birmingham New Street, then divert between Birmingham and Stafford, not calling at Wolverhampton, but calling instead at Nuneaton. Please change at Birmingham New Street for services to Wolverhampton. Buses will run between Stafford and Wolverhampton in both directions.

Manchester - Bristol / Exeter / Paignton services will only run between Birmingham New Street and Bristol / Exeter / Paignton in both directions. Customers travelling between the South West and stations beyond Birmingham New Street towards Manchester Piccadilly will be required to change trains at Birmingham New Street.
 

The_Train

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Funny - I always thought Stafford was not close to S Yorkshire...:smile:

Anyway, these things often happen because of an accumulation of reasons. It may be that one tree was in a bad state and it came down, triggering a chain reaction on the surrounding trees. Just like my fence where one of the posts failed after 20 years and brought other bits down as well.:(



Here's the gen from XC

Manchester Piccadilly - Bournemouth services will be diverted southbound and not call at Wolverhampton, Birmingham New Street and Birmingham International. These trains will call additionally at Tamworth and Nuneaton, please change at either of these stations for Birmingham New Street. Change at Coventry for Birmingham International. Change at Stafford for road transport towards Wolverhampton.

Bournemouth - Manchester Piccadilly services will run as scheduled to Birmingham New Street, then divert between Birmingham and Stafford, not calling at Wolverhampton, but calling instead at Nuneaton. Please change at Birmingham New Street for services to Wolverhampton. Buses will run between Stafford and Wolverhampton in both directions.

Manchester - Bristol / Exeter / Paignton services will only run between Birmingham New Street and Bristol / Exeter / Paignton in both directions. Customers travelling between the South West and stations beyond Birmingham New Street towards Manchester Piccadilly will be required to change trains at Birmingham New Street.

Am I missing something with that bit about S Yorkshire? :s

Anyway, thanks for the info. Will be something different for any spotters braving the elements at Tamworth and Nuneaton :E
 

edwin_m

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Bit of a problem here?
Manchester Piccadilly - Bournemouth services will be diverted southbound and not call at Wolverhampton, Birmingham New Street and Birmingham International. These trains will call additionally at Tamworth and Nuneaton, please change at either of these stations for Birmingham New Street. Change at Coventry for Birmingham International. Change at Stafford for road transport towards Wolverhampton.

Bournemouth - Manchester Piccadilly services will run as scheduled to Birmingham New Street, then divert between Birmingham and Stafford, not calling at Wolverhampton, but calling instead at Nuneaton. Please change at Birmingham New Street for services to Wolverhampton. Buses will run between Stafford and Wolverhampton in both directions.

Manchester - Bristol / Exeter / Paignton services will only run between Birmingham New Street and Bristol / Exeter / Paignton in both directions. Customers travelling between the South West and stations beyond Birmingham New Street towards Manchester Piccadilly will be required to change trains at Birmingham New Street.
 

dougofakkad

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As a commuter on the Reading-Newbury line this morning, I'm interested in how cancelled trains are communicated to customers. I checked the live times before I left for the station, discovered that the 0734 and 0803 were cancelled, but that the 0834 was still listed as running. Before I left, that too was listed as cancelled, but the 0849 was still apparently running. I arrived at the station to find that had been cancelled in the intervening ten minute window, but the 0911 was running. At 0900, that was listed cancelled and I gave up.

As this was apparently a fallen tree and damage to the OHLE, wouldn't it be apparent to schedulers that none of these trains would be running? The idea that no one knew they would be cancelled until ten minutes before their scheduled time is somewhat incredible, but that's the impression the information boards give.
 

ainsworth74

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As this was apparently a fallen tree and damage to the OHLE, wouldn't it be apparent to schedulers that none of these trains would be running? The idea that no one knew they would be cancelled until ten minutes before their scheduled time is somewhat incredible, but that's the impression the information boards give.

The number of trains being cancelled will of course be quite a lot which makes it harder for control staff to keep up plus there is quite possibly an element of knowing that the line is currently shut but that it may re-open (in full or part) in the near future. You don't want to be cancelling trains just to then reinstate them five minutes later!
 

The Prisoner

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Still terrible comms from the TOCs about Carlisle-Glasgow & Edinburgh.

Bus replacement is operating Glasgow to Carlisle operated by Avanti due to flooding.

TPE telling people not to travel at all on the route, but also saying Avanti are running a bus replacement and then leaving people totally confused as to whether their tickets will be accepted by them on the bus or anything else for that matter.

Edinburgh and Motherwell excommunicado - no bus, but a tepid mention of LNER acceptance if forced.

Network Rail and Avanti websites showing services as running through to Glasgow and Edinburgh which aren't.

Customers on trains being told there are no buses north of Carlisle when there are (but only to Glasgow).

People being told not to travel at all north of Carlisle now being told that their tickets aren't valid tomorrow and that they should have set out after all.

Things go wrong, but the railway has a particular way of giving mixed messages leading to yet more confusion and making the situation ten times worse. Appreciate the staff are doing their best, but someone in Avanti HQ wants sacking for the way they are handling this (and TPE).

Go have a look at Avanti and TPE's twitter feeds if you want to see just how bad it is for customers today.
 

daveshah

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Finding it rather amusing that SWR are accepting "Crossrail" tickets between London Waterloo and Windsor/Reading according to their disruption info.
 

chiltern trev

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Caldrew Jn was/is under water(or the area near it).
WCML shut at Carlisle until at least this afternoon.
Any photo?

At least the various signalling boxes etc at this location are now at least 1m+ the track level following previous major flood. The adjacent Castle car park is advertised as closed on BBC Radio Cumbria.
 

westv

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Finding it rather amusing that SWR are accepting "Crossrail" tickets between London Waterloo and Windsor/Reading according to their disruption info.
Do they not know it's the Elizabeth Line?! :D
 

Mag_seven

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Still terrible comms from the TOCs about Carlisle-Glasgow & Edinburgh.

Bus replacement is operating Glasgow to Carlisle operated by Avanti due to flooding.

TPE telling people not to travel at all on the route, but also saying Avanti are running a bus replacement and then leaving people totally confused as to whether their tickets will be accepted by them on the bus or anything else for that matter.

Edinburgh and Motherwell excommunicado - no bus, but a tepid mention of LNER acceptance if forced.

Network Rail and Avanti websites showing services as running through to Glasgow and Edinburgh which aren't.

Customers on trains being told there are no buses north of Carlisle when there are (but only to Glasgow).

People being told not to travel at all north of Carlisle now being told that their tickets aren't valid tomorrow and that they should have set out after all.

Things go wrong, but the railway has a particular way of giving mixed messages leading to yet more confusion and making the situation ten times worse. Appreciate the staff are doing their best, but someone in Avanti HQ wants sacking for the way they are handling this (and TPE).

Go have a look at Avanti and TPE's twitter feeds if you want to see just how bad it is for customers today.

So much conflicting info there. When there is disruption this is where the rail industry really needs to up its game. Whether its sending out consistent messages about rail replacement buses or alternative travel routes or agreeing to accept each others tickets, they should be doing much better than this. While industry fragmentation doesn't help, this is surely where bodies like RDG should be stepping in, banging heads together and sending out a consistent message.
 
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