Cl.142 units fitted with dot matrix displays (note: large images)

py_megapixel · 8 Feb 2020

A small number of Northern's Class 142 Pacer units appear to have had their traditional destination blinds replaced with a large LED matrix indicator taking up most of the space above the front window. Units with this modification also have a four smaller, but similar displays, located at both ends of each carriage.

Questions:

What is the background of this modification and who manufactured the equipment?
Why have only some units had it carried out?
What is the system capable of (Can it deliver automated announcements, show the next stop etc. or just destinations)?
Why does it seem be switched on so infrequently? Are the staff simply not trained to use it? Is it very unreliable? Are the correct routes not programmed into it?

RailUK Forums

ainsworth74 · 8 Feb 2020

py_megapixel said:
Why have only some units had it carried out?

It was funded by Merseytravel for units which were in theory supposed to only be used on services serving the relevant area. I believe that before too long that idea broke down and was abandoned.

py_megapixel said:
Why does it seem be switched on so infrequently? Are the staff simply not trained to use it? Is it very unreliable? Are the correct routes not programmed into it?

As far as I'm aware it is incredibly basic to the point that it relied on measuring the distance travelled to identify the next stops on route (rather than GPS for instance). Therefore it only worked on a handful of routes which had been measured appropriately and therefore turning it on is usually a waste of time as all the internal screens seem to be able to display is the destination.

py_megapixel · 8 Feb 2020

ainsworth74 said:
As far as I'm aware it is incredibly basic to the point that it relied on measuring the distance travelled to identify the next stops on route (rather than GPS for instance). Therefore it only worked on a handful of routes which had been measured appropriately and therefore turning it on is usually a waste of time as all the internal screens seem to be able to display is the destination.

Oh, I see. That'll explain why one I saw heading eastbound at New Mills Central a few months ago was displaying "Wigan Wallgate" then!

Llama · 8 Feb 2020

ainsworth74 said:
It was funded by Merseytravel for units which were in theory supposed to only be used on services serving the relevant area. I believe that before too long that idea broke down and was abandoned.

As far as I'm aware it is incredibly basic to the point that it relied on measuring the distance travelled to identify the next stops on route (rather than GPS for instance). Therefore it only worked on a handful of routes which had been measured appropriately and therefore turning it on is usually a waste of time as all the internal screens seem to be able to display is the destination.

It was so basic I don't think it even measured distance. As far as I know, and I might possibly be wrong, it worked solely on door operation.

IamTrainsYT · 8 Feb 2020

Merseyrail units 142041-142049 and 142051-058 had these fitted. This was a refurbishment carried out by merseyrail. They also fitted the dreaded low back seats and the (now defunct) auto announcements that would now and again pipe up mid journey (even when the units weren’t owned by merseyrail)
Now the system is registered the same as TrainFX so announcements can be heard if it’s coupled to a 15X. Ironically I took a photo of the equipment for this earlier today on 142055. (Apologies the first photo is blurry)

NorthernSpirit · 8 Feb 2020

I've seen 'End of route' displayed on the internal destination displays, ironically it was also the last time I travelled on a Merseyrail example as the infamous May 2018 timetable was to come in force two weeks later.

I've also seen Leeds and Huddersfield displayed too.

IamTrainsYT · 8 Feb 2020

IamTrainsYT said:
View attachment 73619

not quite sure why hadfield is programmed onto it, a pacer would never end up on that route!

Kite159 · 8 Feb 2020

IamTrainsYT said:
not quite sure why hadfield is programmed onto it, a pacer would never end up on that route!

Probably for the same reason Macclesfield & Stoke are programmed, in the very unlikely event one ended up covering for a 323

Bikeman78 · 8 Feb 2020

IamTrainsYT said:
not quite sure why hadfield is programmed onto it, a pacer would never end up on that route!

Are they actually banned from that line? I had a 101 up there back in the days when it was worked by 305s.

fgwrich · 8 Feb 2020

Am I right in thinking that the Nexus sponsored Northern Spirit units also received low back seats during their time, with largely only the FNW Examples retaining their bus seats?

(And for a few of the ex FNW examples, their original brown treadmaster flooring).

55018ballymoss · 8 Feb 2020

Bikeman78 said:
Are they actually banned from that line? I had a 101 up there back in the days when it was worked by 305s.

No they are not route restricted. They are cleared to run to Hadfield, and there has been at least occasion in the last three years where the electric service was suspended and at least one pacer substituted...

ainsworth74 · 8 Feb 2020

fgwrich said:
Am I right in thinking that the Nexus sponsored Northern Spirit units also received low back seats during their time, with largely only the FNW Examples retaining their bus seats?

Yes but they were to a very different and much more comfortable design!

fgwrich · 8 Feb 2020

ainsworth74 said:
Yes but they were to a very different and much more comfortable design!

Thats what I thought, thanks Ainsworth! I just about remember going on one when I was younger and thinking that they reminded me of the buses back home (Stagecoach Alexander B10M) - The bus, being far more comfortable than a Pacer to Whitby. :lol:

M60lad · 9 Feb 2020

Not to sure if its just one particular unit or a couple of the former Merseyrail Pacers but End of Route seems to pop up quite frequently on the internal displays no sooner a train has set off from its destination and sometimes just sticks on that for the whole journey instead of showing the trains destination.

Love the fact that Buxton is programmed into the displays even though a Pacer isnt cleared for the route.

Bikeman78 · 9 Feb 2020

55018ballymoss said:
No they are not route restricted. They are cleared to run to Hadfield, and there has been at least occasion in the last three years where the electric service was suspended and at least one pacer substituted...

Thanks. What's the problem with Buxton? Seems odd that they going almost everywhere else in the area but not Buxton.

Kieran1990 · 9 Feb 2020

Bikeman78 said:
Thanks. What's the problem with Buxton? Seems odd that they going almost everywhere else in the area but not Buxton.

class 142’s and 153’s are barred from the Buxton line after Hazel Grove. Think it’s to do with the gradients as the line heads into the peaks

IamTrainsYT · 9 Feb 2020

Bikeman78 said:
Thanks. What's the problem with Buxton? Seems odd that they going almost everywhere else in the area but not Buxton.

Buxton is on a 142s roller blind, I think it’s just standard across DMUs.

yorksrob · 9 Feb 2020

It's dissappointing that the dreaded Merseyrail abominations are still on the network tormenting passengers, when other more comfortable pacers have gone to the scrap man.

Bikeman78 · 9 Feb 2020

Kieran1990 said:
class 142’s and 153’s are barred from the Buxton line after Hazel Grove. Think it’s to do with the gradients as the line heads into the peaks

They're happily working the Darwen line at the moment. That has a steep climb to the tunnel in both directions. The power to weight ratio of a Pacer is no worse than a 150. Is Buxton a particularly leafy route? Perhaps adhesion is the problem.

IamTrainsYT · 9 Feb 2020

Bikeman78 said:
They're happily working the Darwen line at the moment. That has a steep climb to the tunnel in both directions. The power to weight ratio of a Pacer is no worse than a 150. Is Buxton a particularly leafy route? Perhaps adhesion is the problem.

I find class 150s have worse problems with wheelslip.

IamTrainsYT · 9 Feb 2020

I heard that they don’t fit through a tunnel

fgwrich · 9 Feb 2020

yorksrob said:
It's dissappointing that the dreaded Merseyrail abominations are still on the network tormenting passengers, when other more comfortable pacers have gone to the scrap man.

I'm surprised to see some of the Merseyrail examples escape the grasps of the scrap man too, I'd have thought they would have been the first to leave, with the Northern Spirit and FNW units being the last.

Buxton I believe is a clearance issue with one of the tunnels.

yorksrob · 9 Feb 2020

fgwrich said:
I'm surprised to see some of the Merseyrail examples escape the grasps of the scrap man too, I'd have thought they would have been the first to leave, with the Northern Spirit and FNW units being the last.

Buxton I believe is a clearance issue with one of the tunnels.

Buxton seems to be very firmly 150 territory.

D365 · 9 Feb 2020

fgwrich said:
I'm surprised to see some of the Merseyrail examples escape the grasps of the scrap man too, I'd have thought they would have been the first to leave, with the Northern Spirit and FNW units being the last.

One would imagine that the units in poorest condition (or those closest to their next exam) would be the priority.

fgwrich · 9 Feb 2020

D365 said:
One would imagine that the units in poorest condition (or those closest to their next exam) would be the priority.

That's true. And more than likely to be the situation.

Llama · 9 Feb 2020

IamTrainsYT said:
I find class 150s have worse problems with wheelslip.

That's not the case at all, 142s are significantly worse performers for wheelslip and wheelslide. The WSP (wheelslip protection) on 150s cuts the throttle back when under power and wheelslip is detected, but then returns to whichever power setting the controller is in very quickly so the driver may need to make a manual adjustment. On 142s the traction power cuts back in a similar way but is returned to the selected throttle position very slowly, over 10 seconds or more depending on throttle position.

But as far as the units slipping in the first place goes, 142s are far more likely to slip, this is widely known by drivers who work them.

The way the power delivery is returned on a 150 lends itself to wheelslip being more easily noticed by passengers than on a 142.

py_megapixel · 9 Feb 2020

D365 said:
One would imagine that the units in poorest condition (or those closest to their next exam) would be the priority.

It's not because the PIS screens make them a tiny bit more PRM compliant is it?

IamTrainsYT · 9 Feb 2020

I was on a merseyrail one yesterday, The TrainFX announcements were quiet and clear!

507 001 · 10 Feb 2020

The input panel in the cabs is exactly the same as that on a Metrolink M5000, which does indeed work off distance travelled.

IamTrainsYT · 26 Feb 2020

I wonder if anyone knows how easy these are to programme. Example could they get it to say “farewell 142” for a farewell tour?

Cl.142 units fitted with dot matrix displays (note: large images)

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