greatvoyager
Established Member
For the record, I'm not obsessed with gangways, but when I am on a crowded service, its nice to have access to more of a train to find a seat.
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How have the UK's least-liked trains given such reliable service?
- Thread starter Mitchell Hurd
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Not sure the TL11 was great in road vehicles either. It tended to be viewed as weak and unreliable and much less robust than the previous 0.680 which it was based on. Production ended in 1987/88 when Leyland ceased engine production.
IamTrainsYT
Member
I have to ask, what 150s are you travelling on? Most of the time I have to sit in priority seats as the seats are too small
coradiafan2000
Member
Transport for wales ones. It's been a while since I've been on a GWR one now they're less common in the Bristol/ Cardiff area. I can count the amount of times I've been on Northern 150s on one hand. Same for Northern pacers.
IamTrainsYT
Member
Guess there’s more room on a TFW one?
coradiafan2000
Member
Somewhat. I'd still say the legroom in a none table seat is pretty bad, but it's worse on a pacer.
Lampshade
Established Member
Best on the network IMO (post-privatisation).
coradiafan2000
Member
I'd agree. Out of interest what are the seats in 1st like? They certainly look comfortable.
samuelmorris
Established Member
Pacers are fairly derided because the ambience is objectively poor. Most trains, however, the experience is mostly subjective. Cosy to one is claustrophobic to another. Rock hard seating to one is supportive to another. I actually don't mind travelling on voyagers (when I'm seated, sadly most of my experience with them is standing in a vestibule!) but I know many people really dislike them.
It's very rare that the general public cotton onto a particular type of train because of its reliability (or lack thereof) - it's usually down to the travelling experience. To be fair, Pacers aren't actually that reliable either, but they're no worse than Sprinters and a few other unit types that evade such criticism.
It's very rare that the general public cotton onto a particular type of train because of its reliability (or lack thereof) - it's usually down to the travelling experience. To be fair, Pacers aren't actually that reliable either, but they're no worse than Sprinters and a few other unit types that evade such criticism.
I'll avoid a Voyager service on the WCML if possible - I haven't been on one that hasn't felt like an ancient shuddering DMU over the northern part of the journey.
I don't find the seating or interior unpleasant - it's the underfloor engines that are the worst feature IMO.
Why is it given the cost and weight of the passenger cars can they not come up with a way of attaching and packaging the engines that nulls the noise and vibration. A small family car with 4 pot diesel is typically quieter and more refined.
Pacers as a suburban train I guess is what is expected given that most are meant for short journey's,although some would still complain regardless of how long or even how short the journey was.
Voyagers however are less acceptable as an inter city train due to cramped conditions,smelly toilets and not enough coaches with an ever increasing passenger demand for better services you would expect long enough trains to cope with demand.
Voyagers however are less acceptable as an inter city train due to cramped conditions,smelly toilets and not enough coaches with an ever increasing passenger demand for better services you would expect long enough trains to cope with demand.
A local coach company that still operated a number of elderly Leyland Tiger coaches in the mid 2000s said that the TL11s in them were still very reliable. There was a 680/TL11 cross known as the rationalised 680 or the 1595. There was also the 4041 or L11 which appears to be a non turbocharged TL11 and was fitted to some Class 101s later on. www.railcar.co.uk/technology/engines/leyland-680/?page=variants
I am 6ft 1 and not had a problem with legroom on Pacers. Could it be down to the Chapman seats on the TFW 142s and 143s? I have found that on Northern's 153s and 156s with these seats, there is often no room for my legs.
coradiafan2000
Member
Wouldn't surprise me. I'm a similar height and have problems with legroom on all trains that use those Chapman seats. From my very limited experience of Northern pacers the 144s were the worst for legroom. Definitely worse than any 150 I've been on. I can only recall one ride I've had on a Northern 142 and I think it had bus style seats. I don't actually think the legroom was too bad on that. It certainly wasn't so bad that I remembered it like I did the 144s. Nor was it as bad as the TfW 142s and 143s, which are so bad I have to sort of straddle the seat in front of me. Heaven forbid someone sits next to me.
As for Northern's 153/156s, I can't really comment as I've never ridden a Northern 153, I don't remember 156s being awful but they weren't great either. For what it's worth I don't think the EMR ones are too bad either.
Sorry if that was a bit long-winded.
I too don't like the Richmond seats on the Class 144s. I think that they are too tall and bulky.
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