When TPE had a 170 fleet the Hull Services were meant to be 2x170 in the peak but were quite often 1. 140 people trying to cram on a 2 car was embarassing.
It will happen again. Hull and Scarborough aren’t on the high priority list.
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TPE 'Abysmal' Performance
- Thread starter BenW390Fan
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When TPE had a 170 fleet the Hull Services were meant to be 2x170 in the peak but were quite often 1. 140 people trying to cram on a 2 car was embarassing.
It will happen again. Hull and Scarborough aren’t on the high priority list.
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RailUK Forums
The particular Northern service I’m referring to is frequently regulated to let a late running LNER service to KGX through. My point was to highlight how a 5L service can easily become 14L due to a lack of infrastructure.
I speak on this forum with my own voice and do not represent any TOC that I may work for/with. Please be respectful.
Choosing Leeds as a mid-point, yesterday the following services on the Hull route ran as a 6 car:
To Manchester
0607*
0807*
0907
1507*
1707*
1807
1907
2207
To Hull:
0535
0636
0834*
1034
1533
1634
1734*
1934*
2033
(* indicates additional peak time calls)
The eagle-eyed will notice that one unit diagram was short of a set yesterday which meant it ran as a 3 vice 6.
Clearly not as bad as some people would like you to believe though...
And units have faults, its part of the railway. Lets not forget that the DfT said no to 185's being 4 car.
And as for Scarborough, they're now enjoying 5 car sets. Hardly not being high on the priority list?
Sorry? Please explain.
northernchris
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The York - Leeds corridor is heavily congested, not helped with the peak extras that Northern run, often in very close proximity to another service. It's quite common for a backlog of departures heading out towards York between 1700-1800 usually caused by 1 service being a few minutes late. Now TPE are boosting capacity it may be logical for them to pick up more peak time calls between Leeds and Micklefield so the overall number of services can be reduced and resilience improved
Jamesrob637
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Could you kindly put that in the "TPE Services Allocated For Double Units" thread under "Allocations, Diagrams and Timetables?" since it would be very useful to supplement the South TPE post. Thanks!
Bantamzen
Established Member
This is an interesting observation, there are some members who believe that end door stock are part of the problem, and that getting rid of them through the Castlefield corridor will help. What they seem to miss though is as you have said, the more carriages, the less people standing, the quicker the dwell times. So once the TPEs are generally 5 car Nova, or 6 car 185s, then dwell times through Manchester should improve dramatically.
For an equal number of carriages/doors, I think mid carriage doors are faster, but if the whole train is overcrowded either will be slow. Full and standing 158s are a disaster for alighting & boarding though. When EMT used to run 2 car 158s though Manchester, it was a shambles, with departure basically being when the guard and platform staff convinced those still on the platform to accept that they were getting the next train.
I wouldn’t say abysmal! The only cancellations have been on the Carlisle - Edinburgh stretch, everything to Glasgow and south of Preston has been fine.
Does she book seats? I know a season ticket holder who booked seats while pregnant. You just need to ask at a station.
Merle Haggard
Established Member
Today is ' Random Acts of Kindness Day 2020' if you didn't know (no, I didn't either)
The complimentary snacks offer on a TPE 350 was wider than usual, so I chose the Kit-Kat and then noticed it had a sticker.
Credit to TPE; all the other Manchester Scotland trains I saw were 5-cars, so there were Acts of kindness for the Standard class passenger, too.
The complimentary snacks offer on a TPE 350 was wider than usual, so I chose the Kit-Kat and then noticed it had a sticker.
Credit to TPE; all the other Manchester Scotland trains I saw were 5-cars, so there were Acts of kindness for the Standard class passenger, too.
trainophile
Established Member
I see TPE have pre-emptively cancelled today’s 0745 Glasgow to Liverpool due to “forecasted severe weather” (it’s starting from Preston), although AWC are all showing as running.
Is there some technical reason that their trains are more susceptible?
Is there some technical reason that their trains are more susceptible?
BenW390Fan
Member
If it's forecasted weather, would this not've been cancelled a day or two earlier?
dave59
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Reduced speeds between Carlisle and Preston due to high winds? Plenty of alternatives though because they are/were still using rail buses (cl185) on that route.
trainophile
Established Member
Avanti now cancelling too. Help I’m stuck in Carlisle!
No advice on their Journey Check page. I have tweeted but I expect they are inundated.
No advice on their Journey Check page. I have tweeted but I expect they are inundated.
CaptainHaddock
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Flooding at Oxenholme, apparently. Network Rail staff on their way.
If you're heading South maybe going via Settle might be an option?
trainophile
Established Member
On RRB to Preston now, weather outside atrocious. Will probably get a bus to Southport rather than mess around waiting for a train as they mostly seem to be cancelled even from Preston.
It's simply taking trains out of the plan to ease congestion and delays due to a 50mph speed limit that Network Rail imposed from 17:00 yesterday to 10:00 today.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
The Middlesbrough/Redcar train will be on the slows anyway because of the Thirsk call, so it makes very little difference.
The other day I was on a fast Northern to York (first stop Church Fenton) which was held for 10 minutes at Leeds because of a late TPE to Scarborough (first stop Garforth). Goodness knows what that was all about, I can only assume TPE do get priority in the automatic route setting.
Everyone gets done over at York with the LNERs!
Given it was a Scarborough service, it was probably held on platform 4 for a LNER!
An interesting comment by Henri Murison of the Northern Powerhouse Partnership but I feel it is flawed. The suggestion that Northern was quite well run caused me to splutter my cornflakes.
http://www.passengertransport.co.uk/2020/02/weve-nationalised-the-wrong-train-operator/
Would not the optimal arrangement be to merge the Northern and TPE franchises and devolve franchisee selection and management from the DfT to whatever from the Rail North organisation is called this week?
http://www.passengertransport.co.uk/2020/02/weve-nationalised-the-wrong-train-operator/
Would not the optimal arrangement be to merge the Northern and TPE franchises and devolve franchisee selection and management from the DfT to whatever from the Rail North organisation is called this week?
No, the "franchisee selection and management" is a flawed way of providing an esential component of our civic infrastructure. Even the structure at Merseyrail (previously rather better) is turning into a shambles because of the inherent conflict between proper provision and the need to maximise returns for the players on one side of the agreement.
headshot119
Established Member
ARS has no way to differentiate between TOCS / FOCS, so that assertion is incorrect I'm afraid.
wilsontown
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So why hold the Northern service when it would run clear of the Scarborough anyway? I'm sure there will have been a reason, but it looks baffling on the face of it.
Spartacus
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Hard to say without knowing which train it was, but 10 minutes doesn't sound like ARS.
Think you will find that Lner get done over plenty of times as well, particularly there xx35 northbound which always get held foe XC even when they are still several minutes away from arriving in station
Jozhua
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Doesn't surprise me considering the fact at quite a decent percentage of them run through Manchester Castlefield. Then there's more minor pinch points (not to say these are non-issues, but nothing compares to the terror of Castlefield) North of Sheffield, around Leeds, Manchester Airport, etc.
Overcrowding doesn't help either, takes a while for trains to get in and out of stations. New trains and double sets on south transpennine will help.
I think TPE also had some staffing issues like Northern, although I think these have improved somewhat recently?
Overcrowding doesn't help either, takes a while for trains to get in and out of stations. New trains and double sets on south transpennine will help.
I think TPE also had some staffing issues like Northern, although I think these have improved somewhat recently?
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