Greater Anglia: No buffet car on some intercity services?

darasafvatnia · 4 Mar 2020

I've noticed recently that several off-peak Class 90 services don't have a buffet car and instead just a trolley service. I prefer to walk to the buffet car rather than waiting to order from the trolley. Does anyone know either from experience or information which Greater Anglia Class 90 services include the buffet car?

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Sleepy · 4 Mar 2020

It's all random as buffet cars are only missing from a set due to any fault.

dk1 · 4 Mar 2020

They are gradually going off lease as are out of miles. Several are stored in the Wensum Sidings now. Trolley only sets until more 745s are accepted & nothing if it's a 321 I'm afraid.

XCTurbostar · 5 Mar 2020

dk1 said:
They are gradually going off lease as are out of miles. Several are stored in the Wensum Sidings now. Trolley only sets until more 745s are accepted & nothing if it's a 321 I'm afraid.

That’s pretty much the definition of running them into the ground and then running!

Flying Snail · 5 Mar 2020

Just the usual order new trains and don't bother maintaining the outgoing fleet properly that is repeated across TOCs. Add the utterly predictable issue of new stock deliveries being delayed and having ongoing technical issues and you get the current situation of constantly short-formed IC sets and a lottery of replacements with suburban stock while sidings across the region are littered with Mk3s which the TOC are too tight to keep maintained.

trebor79 · 5 Mar 2020

Trolley is inferior as tea made with hot water out of a flask is undrinkable and the water also isn't hot enough to make the porridge pots work.
And they'd sold out of sandwiches by the time it got to me last week.

Better than nothing. But really they ought to have tried to maintain a few buffet cars because people will stop using the catering offer if it can't be relied upon. Catching the 6am to Liverpool Street planning on porridge and bacon butty on the train to find there is neither on offer is not good.
And why are they using ridiculously small cups for tea and coffee now?

darasafvatnia · 5 Mar 2020

trebor79 said:
Trolley is inferior as tea made with hot water out of a flask is undrinkable and the water also isn't hot enough to make the porridge pots work.
And they'd sold out of sandwiches by the time it got to me last week.

Better than nothing. But really they ought to have tried to maintain a few buffet cars because people will stop using the catering offer if it can't be relied upon. Catching the 6am to Liverpool Street planning on porridge and bacon butty on the train to find there is neither on offer is not good.
And why are they using ridiculously small cups for tea and coffee now?

I absolutely agree, so it seems it’s not just me experiencing a lack of buffet cars on the greater anglia class 90 services. If you and others have experienced the same problem at different times then I’m assuming most these services lack a buffet car. I’d be interested to know if anyone on these services has had a buffet car recently. I know the new trains do but there’s only two in service, how do they expect everyone else at all other times to be okay with just a understocked trolley.

HamworthyGoods · 5 Mar 2020

Flying Snail said:
Just the usual order new trains and don't bother maintaining the outgoing fleet properly that is repeated across TOCs. Add the utterly predictable issue of new stock deliveries being delayed and having ongoing technical issues and you get the current situation of constantly short-formed IC sets and a lottery of replacements with suburban stock while sidings across the region are littered with Mk3s which the TOC are too tight to keep maintained.

It’s nothing new this, look at when the mk2 sets were being run down on Waterloo - Exeter, first the Micro Buffets went as load 9s became 8 then 8s became 7 and a few were load 6 by the end.

Like Anglia the 159s were late, but BR as a business with a budget like the TOCs didn’t want to spend money on overhauls - it’s not routine maintenance that’s the killer it’s the plan that a fleet rundown is based around heavy exams.

I’m sure there’s plenty of other examples.

trebor79 · 5 Mar 2020

darasafvatnia said:
I absolutely agree, so it seems it’s not just me experiencing a lack of buffet cars on the greater anglia class 90 services. If you and others have experienced the same problem at different times then I’m assuming most these services lack a buffet car. I’d be interested to know if anyone on these services has had a buffet car recently. I know the new trains do but there’s only two in service, how do they expect everyone else at all other times to be okay with just a understocked trolley.

A few weeks ago I worked out there were at least 2 hauled sets with no buffet. I think that perhaps half of them are now no buffet. I travelled twice last week and both up and down journeys were devoid of buffet. I also saw other trains with no buffet. So either I was unlucky or a significant proportion have no catering vehicle.
But only a few more weeks to go, and I suppose we'll have forgotten about it.

Mogz · 5 Mar 2020

At least the replacement Greater Anglia Intercity stock have buffets.

The (otherwise brilliant) new GWR IET trains sadly don’t, and the restaurant services are few and far between (notwithstanding the fact that EVERY set has an on board kitchen!).

Ditto Chiltern have axed the buffet from
their Class 68 hauled Mk3 sets.

Nice to see Greater Anglia and LNER bucking the trend in the long term with their new trains.

dk1 · 6 Mar 2020

darasafvatnia said:
I absolutely agree, so it seems it’s not just me experiencing a lack of buffet cars on the greater anglia class 90 services. If you and others have experienced the same problem at different times then I’m assuming most these services lack a buffet car. I’d be interested to know if anyone on these services has had a buffet car recently. I know the new trains do but there’s only two in service, how do they expect everyone else at all other times to be okay with just a understocked trolley.

Only two of the 90/DVT sets yesterday had no buffet car. The rest & the three 745s in traffic daily all provide full catering as advertised.

Class 170101 · 6 Mar 2020

Except Class 321 services

dk1 · 7 Mar 2020

Class 170101 said:
Except Class 321 services

Obviously. Few more of them possibly by next month too :frown:

Class 170101 · 7 Mar 2020

dk1 said:
Obviously. Few more of them possibly by next month too

Can't believe that the Class 755s still don't work in multiple and that a pair of those would be easier to obtain than Class 321s.

306024 · 14 Mar 2020

According to a news item on the GA website the previous announcement regarding catering on Norwich - London services has been reviewed and Sunday catering will continue with a trolley service apart from when there’s engineering work (when isn’t there engineering work though?).

However the first two round trips on Monday to Friday and the first three on a Saturday will not have catering as previously advised.

cactustwirly · 14 Mar 2020

XCTurbostar said:
That’s pretty much the definition of running them into the ground and then running!

The same happened to one of EMRs buffet cars as well

chubs · 15 Mar 2020

Seems silly to have a buffet out of use and a trolley instead. I thought they wanted to do away with trolleys?

dk1 · 15 Mar 2020

chubs said:
Seems silly to have a buffet out of use and a trolley instead. I thought they wanted to do away with trolleys?

No they wanted trolleys in addition to buffet counter on busier trains.

trebor79 · 15 Mar 2020

chubs said:
Seems silly to have a buffet out of use and a trolley instead. I thought they wanted to do away with trolleys?

Agree. I suspect the trolley generates more sales, though my personal preference is to use the buffet.

hexagon789 · 15 Mar 2020

dk1 said:
No they wanted trolleys in addition to buffet counter on busier trains.

I would've thought it would be been easier NOT to have a trolley getting in the way on busier services and only the buffet serving passengers.

HamworthyGoods · 15 Mar 2020

hexagon789 said:
I would've thought it would be been easier NOT to have a trolley getting in the way on busier services and only the buffet serving passengers.

trolleys generally create more sales.

hexagon789 · 15 Mar 2020

HamworthyGoods said:
trolleys generally create more sales.

I understand that, but wondered why trolleys only on specifically busy trains rather than all services? If you had to chose, surely you wouldn't create more congestion by only additionally providing trolleys on the busiest workings?

dk1 · 16 Mar 2020

hexagon789 said:
I understand that, but wondered why trolleys only on specifically busy trains rather than all services? If you had to chose, surely you wouldn't create more congestion by only additionally providing trolleys on the busiest workings?

There aren't many worries of overcrowding on the 745s with their plethora of seating compared to the outgoing loco-hauled fleet. An at-seat service using the newly purchased trolleys are just adding to overall catering revenue.

Class 170101 · 17 Mar 2020

All cancelled due to Coronavirus

Greater Anglia said:
Catering

Catering has been withdrawn from our intercity service until further notice, both to enable staff and customers to follow Government guidelines on “social distancing” and due to falling demand. Staff have been temporarily redeployed to further increase train and station cleaning.

You can still buy refreshments from station retailers before you board your train.

hexagon789 · 17 Mar 2020

Class 170101 said:
All cancelled due to Coronavirus

SBB and the RhB cancelled their on-train catering yesterday I believe.

Now GA have done so, presumably other operators will follow suit.

HamworthyGoods · 17 Mar 2020

hexagon789 said:
SBB and the RhB cancelled their on-train catering yesterday I believe.

Now GA have done so, presumably other operators will follow suit.

Tren Italia and CD did some while ago and in the UK both EMR and Eurostar have suspended catering

D365 · 18 Mar 2020

Class 170101 said:
Can't believe that the Class 755s still don't work in multiple and that a pair of those would be easier to obtain than Class 321s.

Surely the Class 755s are busy operating diesel services.

WesternLancer · 18 Mar 2020

question starts to come to my mind as to whether some of the TOCs will ever re-instate catering on trains after the present virus situation. They often don't seem massively keen on it...
I think EMR and GA are both Abellio - but the GA offer is much poorer than EMRs (who have so far generally stuck to the EMT offer) - I wonder if in due course this will be 'leveled down' across the Abellio group?

cactustwirly · 18 Mar 2020

WesternLancer said:
question starts to come to my mind as to whether some of the TOCs will ever re-instate catering on trains after the present virus situation. They often don't seem massively keen on it...
I think EMR and GA are both Abellio - but the GA offer is much poorer than EMRs (who have so far generally stuck to the EMT offer) - I wonder if in due course this will be 'leveled down' across the Abellio group?

GAs catering was better I thought, using a proper buffet with coffee machine etc

WesternLancer · 18 Mar 2020

cactustwirly said:
GAs catering was better I thought, using a proper buffet with coffee machine etc

Yes, that's a good point. I think I was thinking of 1st class food offer.

Greater Anglia: No buffet car on some intercity services?

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