Halifax redevelopment: could there be opportunities to improve or expand the station?

In the local paper there is an interesting article with video - link and quote follows:
https://www.halifaxcourier.co.uk/ne...own-centre-plan-brings-mixed-reaction-2444381

"People in Calderdale have been sharing their views on the new designs for a Halifax town centre regeneration project.
Designs include significant changes to make it easier to walk and cycle around the town, encouraging active travel, and bus users will see a revised bus network to allow for better connectivity with the rail station. There will be increased bus services and much improved facilities, with a new bus station planned for the existing site."

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What I don't understand is the logic of rebuilding the present bus station on the existing site which is miles away from the railway station. The article mentions better bus links with the station, which seems counter-intuitive. Perhaps someone local can explain how this is a good scheme for transport integration?

They are planning on closing off Market Street to traffic which means buses having to go via Horton St and Winding Road to get from West to East side of the town centre. That means passing the train station

HowardGWR said:

In the local paper there is an interesting article with video - link and quote follows:
https://www.halifaxcourier.co.uk/ne...own-centre-plan-brings-mixed-reaction-2444381

"People in Calderdale have been sharing their views on the new designs for a Halifax town centre regeneration project.
Designs include significant changes to make it easier to walk and cycle around the town, encouraging active travel, and bus users will see a revised bus network to allow for better connectivity with the rail station. There will be increased bus services and much improved facilities, with a new bus station planned for the existing site."

What I don't understand is the logic of rebuilding the present bus station on the existing site which is miles away from the railway station. The article mentions better bus links with the station, which seems counter-intuitive. Perhaps someone local can explain how this is a good scheme for transport integration?

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With West Yorkshire Combined Authority having a full melt down over cycle provision by building cycle lanes here, there and everywhere that won't be used and will end up being ripped out once the urban town planners decide that cycle lanes aren't the future but something else is. This is why I want to see WYCA being scrapped and replaced with a West Yorkshire Metropolitan Highways and Passenger Transport Unit and lumped in with West Yorkshire Joint Services.

In the recent consultation about the rebuidling of Halifax bus station, I did suggest to WYCA that Halifax would be better off without a bus station and instead have bus hubs (these being Commercial Street & Wards End, Halifax Interchange and Waterhouse Street & George Square) as the town doesn't have a Halifax Town Bus serving the town centre and instead the rerouting of existing bus services would serve the town better than wasting taxpayers money on yet another vanity scheme which will be torn down should the new Calderdale Sixth Form ever expand. The Metro Travel Centre could be relocated into the many unused retail units that are litrering Market Street and the land that the exisiting bus station is on should be sold off to developers to make way for urban housing and green space. The town already has plenty of toilet provision at the Piece Hall, Market Hall and also at George Square / Waterhouse Street and is covered by CCTV 24/7 which would be cheaper in the long term as Metro can cash in on the land and the cash used to fund better bus and rail services.

Judging by the reply that I got from WYCA (Metro) they weren't too happy and insisted that Halifax would be better with a bus station, but here's the thing - if we look at places such as Brighton, Hove, Crawley, York, Scarborough, Haywards Heath, Trowbridge, Salisbury, Goole, Bakewell and Buxton they don't have bus stations and yet with Metro's mentality, Halifax must have one - why?

What's wrong by having a Halifax Interchange with the railway station, even if its just four bus shelters that's plonked outside the railway station and all the other services serving the bus hubs - it's be cheaper in the long term and the integration is there by using the existing stops in the town centre. My view of this would mean the current problem of youths cluttering up the benches at the bus station spitting, shouting, getting in peoples way and acting uncouth would be removed if the bus station was done away with.

When Metro did a load of bus station rebuilds 20 or so years ago, I thought it was odd that Halifax bus station retained the "multiple islands with shelters" set-up when all the other large stations switched to "drive in, reverse out" bays if they weren't already (Bradford Interchange* and Wakefield for example). As a result the site is far bigger than it needs to be, and with so many waiting areas distant from the Travel Centre it's no surprise that it attracts scallies.

*= Bradford is technically a hybrid set-up, with end-on bays one side and parallel bays on the other.

The railway station is in the wrong place. If you had all buses going there you would need a free bus to get them to the shops. I'm disabled and would have a monumental struggle walking up the hill so do not go by train anywhere near as often as I used to. Halifax does need a proper bus station on a similar design to Huddersfield though

But these plans are dependant on the WYCA Transforming Cities Fund bid to government being successful in full so we will see what happens

I find the rant above very bizarre that Halifax doesn’t deserve a Bus station just because some other small towns don’t (and it could be argued some of those other places should have a Bus station) and rather than rebuilding it they should abandon it altogether.

The reason the layout of Halifax Bus station is how it is, is that it was built in the late 80s. The first modern style Metro Bus station weren’t built until the mid 90s (the first being Leeds)

Andyh82 said:

I find the rant above very bizarre that Halifax doesn’t deserve a Bus station just because some other small towns don’t (and it could be argued some of those other places should have a Bus station) and rather than rebuilding it they should abandon it altogether.

The reason the layout of Halifax Bus station is how it is, is that it was built in the late 80s. The first modern style Metro Bus station weren’t built until the mid 90s (the first being Leeds)

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I agree Halifax does need a bus station, a town bus would be very useful to link the station to the bus station.

As an aside, Halifax bus station was built in 1989 replacing the station at Crossfields and the first 'modern' metro bus station was in fact Dewsbury in 1993/4.

Glenn1969 said:

The railway station is in the wrong place. If you had all buses going there you would need a free bus to get them to the shops. I'm disabled and would have a monumental struggle walking up the hill so do not go by train anywhere near as often as I used to. Halifax does need a proper bus station on a similar design to Huddersfield though. But these plans are dependant on the WYCA Transforming Cities Fund bid to government being successful in full so we will see what happens

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Andyh82 said:

I find the rant above very bizarre that Halifax doesn’t deserve a Bus station just because some other small towns don’t (and it could be argued some of those other places should have a Bus station) and rather than rebuilding it they should abandon it altogether. The reason the layout of Halifax Bus station is how it is, is that it was built in the late 80s. The first modern style Metro Bus station weren’t built until the mid 90s (the first being Leeds)

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The rant as you put it does mention that "by having a Halifax Interchange with the railway station, even if its just four bus shelters that's plonked outside the railway station" could be regarded as a bus station albeit bolted on to the side of Halifax railway station, thus creating a Halifax Interchange.

The current overbridge is suppose to be removed and replaced by a new building off Discovery Road that would incorperate a bus interchange. Hence why my idea of having bus services rerouted to serve the town better would help integrate two forms of public transport without the need of a full scale bus station that's miles from the railway station.

I think that plan has changed because of WYCA funding limitations but not sure. The current plan doesn't seem to mention alterations to the station buildings like the old one did

NorthernSpirit said:

The rant as you put it does mention that "by having a Halifax Interchange with the railway station, even if its just four bus shelters that's plonked outside the railway station" could be regarded as a bus station albeit bolted on to the side of Halifax railway station, thus creating a Halifax Interchange.

The current overbridge is suppose to be removed and replaced by a new building off Discovery Road that would incorperate a bus interchange. Hence why my idea of having bus services rerouted to serve the town better would help integrate two forms of public transport without the need of a full scale bus station that's miles from the railway station.

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That would be pretty pointless as most of the buses that use the bus station are long distance ones that go to the same places as the trains do.

The existing bus station is next to the new sixth form college, the broad street plaza, and with level access to the main shopping areas and the piece hall. A site at the railway station would offer none of this.

The dates for the Halifax Station element of the Town Centre plan have slipped to Post 2022 start to construction. I think that means the Bus Station will open first. All plans depend on WYCA getting its full £0.5bn Transforming Cities bid approved

Andyh82 said:

I find the rant above very bizarre that Halifax doesn’t deserve a Bus station just because some other small towns don’t (and it could be argued some of those other places should have a Bus station) and rather than rebuilding it they should abandon it altogether.

The reason the layout of Halifax Bus station is how it is, is that it was built in the late 80s. The first modern style Metro Bus station weren’t built until the mid 90s (the first being Leeds)

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Your last sentence doesn't really tell the whole story: I'd argue that Huddersfield was the first "modern" Metro bus station, built in 1974- the year the PTEs were formed. When Metro refurbished or replaced the bus stations across the county around the turn of the millennium, Huddersfield was a relatively simple job: just reglaze and redecorate, and fit modern departure screens. Halifax had boxy faded shelters replaced with the faux-vintage type seen now, departure screens and that was about it.

61653 HTAFC said:

Your last sentence doesn't really tell the whole story: I'd argue that Huddersfield was the first "modern" Metro bus station, built in 1974- the year the PTEs were formed. When Metro refurbished or replaced the bus stations across the county around the turn of the millennium, Huddersfield was a relatively simple job: just reglaze and redecorate, and fit modern departure screens. Halifax had boxy faded shelters replaced with the faux-vintage type seen now, departure screens and that was about it.

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Not to stray too far off topic but Huddersfield bus station is excellent in terms of design and functionality. It has everything one needs whilst catching a bus.

Glenn1969 said:

They are planning on closing off Market Street to traffic which means buses having to go via Horton St and Winding Road to get from West to East side of the town centre. That means passing the train station

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Ah, I see. Yes, if most buses go near the station anyway, then my post is answered.

On Huddersfield, the bus station is a stone's throw from the station,it would appear. As long as it is well signposted and includes a pedestrian friendly path between them, that's not so bad as Halifax.

When I am abroad, the buses are always integrated with the railway station, wherever I visit.

Andyh82 said:

I find the rant above very bizarre that Halifax doesn’t deserve a Bus station

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I don’t think anyone is saying Halifax doesn’t “deserve” a bus station, more that it doesn’t really benefit from having one.

From recollection of a conversation with someone from Metro a few years ago, only a small percentage of bus journeys to/from Halifax involve changing buses, so the interchange / somewhere to wait element is perhaps less important.

If buses start / terminate on the road in central areas, and are routed close to the station, then I don’t really see an issue, other than the loss of somewhere for buses to be parked between journeys.

SteveM70 said:

I don’t think anyone is saying Halifax doesn’t “deserve” a bus station, more that it doesn’t really benefit from having one.

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Personally I'm in favour of a bus interchange with the railway station and a series of hubs in the town centre, it'd still be a bus station but integrated with the railway station.

On the attached map shows how integration would work using my idea, the blue and red diamonds mark the mentioned bus hubs (basically glorified bus shelters but treat as interchange points), the two by the railway station could be either stop 5 on Horton Street being used or the new build railway station on Discovery Road with shelters, with bus services orbiting Halifax town centre for example service 576 could for instance from North Bridge run Broad Street, Waterhouse Street, Commercial Street, Wards End, Horton Street then Halifax Interchange. From Halifax Interchange, via Winding Road, Broad Street and back to North Bridge and beyond - which clearly shows its serving both the town centre better as well as connecting with rail services at Halifax which in turn gives Queensbury (and north Halifax if we throw the 521, 522 & 523 in there as well) access to rail services.

Huddersfield already has in interchange point outside the railway station there with the five shelters however only three are used (S2, S3 and S4), S5 has closed and the other S1 is used for rail replacement services. Halifax requires the same.

61653 HTAFC said:

Halifax had boxy faded shelters replaced with the faux-vintage type seen now, departure screens and that was about it.

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The shelters in Halifax are the originals from 1989. Halifax didn't get more of a makeover because, at the time the other stations got done, it was only 10 years old. I don't see what benefit pulling it down now would serve, it's fine for what it is!

SteveM70 said:

don’t think anyone is saying Halifax doesn’t “deserve” a bus station, more that it doesn’t really benefit from having one.

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It benefits from a bus station in the same way everywhere else does- it's a central, dry place to wait for your bus, a short walk from the shops. Compared to, say, Bradford Interchange (a white elephant which most Bradford buses still don't use!) it's so much more useful.

It is a pain that the railway station is so far out of the town centre, and so far away from the obvious roads buses would use, though.

They are talking about rebuilding Halifax Bus station because it doesn’t confirm to the modern way of thinking, which is that passenger and vehicle movements should be completely separate and that all passengers should be in one place for safety and security reasons. It’s the last one in West Yorkshire that involves passengers having to cross the bus carriageway to access different stands

You need to look at Sheffield to see why a Bus station adjacent to the railway station isn’t all that. Very few buses use it as they prefer to serve the shops. The geography of Halifax is quite similar just on a smaller scale. You’d have buses leaving the station empty and everyone forced to use a stop in the town centre in the street.

Barnsley has an excellent combined bus /train station.

It would appear that the plans for Halifax station have changed once again!



Taken from the Next Chapter website.
http://www.calderdalenextchapter.co.uk/projects

I love Halifax station from an enthusiast perspective because you can still see so many old, steam-era features, but I've always thought it's insufficient for the town.

What are the plans for the station itself? There was talk of bringing the third platform back into use - is that likely to happen?

The oft-recurring debates about bus stations on this forum seem to go round and round, like buses where there isn't one. Ideally, bus and rail stations would be together, as for example in Altrincham, Barnsley and (near enough) Bolton. When the station is away from the shopping centre, as in Halifax, and Chester for another, it makes less sense. But there's no single right answer.

On a nostalgic note, in my youth I had occasion to go from Bromsgrove to Lichfield by bus. Not pleasant changing in Brum's hellhole of a Midland Red bus station, but easy. Now try it, with out of town buses turning round at various points on the periphery of the city centre. In contrast, Glasgow is easy to change in due to Buchanan's ubiquity.

alexl92 said:

I love Halifax station from an enthusiast perspective because you can still see so many old, steam-era features, but I've always thought it's insufficient for the town.

What are the plans for the station itself? There was talk of bringing the third platform back into use - is that likely to happen?

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Regarding the third platform, the last plans that were publicly unveiled were to extend platform 3 out towards the down platform. This might be as part of returning platform 3 back into operational use or as a brand new platform in front of it, either way it is unlikely that Eureka will be able to vacate the third platform any time soon as they currently have no-where suitable to relocate their nursery to.

Halifaxlad said:

Regarding the third platform, the last plans that were publicly unveiled were to extend platform 3 out towards the down platform. This might be as part of returning platform 3 back into operational use or as a brand new platform in front of it, either way it is unlikely that Eureka will be able to vacate the third platform any time soon as they currently have no-where suitable to relocate their nursery to.

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I thought the proposed third platform was just going to be the Bradford end of the platform (of which the Rochdale end is occupied by the nursery), towards the signal box.

I thought Network Rail had ruled out the third platform as unnecessary and they were just going to build it out to effectively replace Platform 2. I note the current plans make no mention of a third platform

Glenn1969 said:

I thought Network Rail had ruled out the third platform as unnecessary and they were just going to build it out to effectively replace Platform 2. I note the current plans make no mention of a third platform

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I don't see how there would be any benefit to doing that. No added capacity, no extra flexibility, but an added inconvenience for anyone making what is currently a cross-platform interchange (such as from Huddersfield heading towards Sowerby Bridge or vice-versa). Just a load of unnecessary spending on an extra lift and staircase.

Is there anyway of telling how many delays are caused by the current layout at Halifax? There is quite a mix of services and destinations calling here and I would have thought the argument is a little like Platforms 13/14 at Manchester Picc but on a lesser scale. An extra platform at Halifax would surely add options in terms of resilience - but does the evidence point to delay minutes being caused by a lack of it?

modernrail said:

Is there anyway of telling how many delays are caused by the current layout at Halifax? There is quite a mix of services and destinations calling here and I would have thought the argument is a little like Platforms 13/14 at Manchester Picc but on a lesser scale. An extra platform at Halifax would surely add options in terms of resilience - but does the evidence point to delay minutes being caused by a lack of it?

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There is a new hourly service terminating at HFX from the north, which adds pressure on the layout, and having the reversing siding south of the station adds time to the turnround, so there may be more of a case now.

30907 said:

There is a new hourly service terminating at HFX from the north, which adds pressure on the layout, and having the reversing siding south of the station adds time to the turnround, so there may be more of a case now.

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In the 90s the turnback was used regularly, though the line wasn't as busy then. IIRC the services that turned back at Halifax became the Huddersfield service once the line through Brighouse reopened.

Having the turnback to the South shouldn't make it take longer though- a turnback in the other direction would require changing ends three times rather than just once.

61653 HTAFC said:

In the 90s the turnback was used regularly, though the line wasn't as busy then. IIRC the services that turned back at Halifax became the Huddersfield service once the line through Brighouse reopened.

Having the turnback to the South shouldn't make it take longer though- a turnback in the other direction would require changing ends three times rather than just once.

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Sorry, should have re-read before posting I was meaning extra time using a turnback rather than a (possible) bay platform.