TOC plans regarding advance tickets if destinations become no-go (Coronavirus)?

Haywain · 15 Mar 2020

yorkie said:
I now understand the situation is that operators won't allow retailers to refund Advance fares, except for any Advance fare for travel with LNER can be refunded regardless of where it was purchased.

Advances bought from LNER for travel with other operators cannot be refunded.

Yet LNER's site says:
https://www.lner.co.uk/travel-information/coronavirus-travel-information/

It could, and should, be clearer but the term “book directly” is key to what is being said.

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yorkie · 15 Mar 2020

Haywain said:
It could, and should, be clearer but the term “book directly” is key to what is being said.

are you saying LNER are only allowing Advance fares to be refunded if the passenger books directly with LNER and are not allowing other retailers to issue refunds?

Saperstein · 15 Mar 2020

yorkie said:
are you saying LNER are only allowing Advance fares to be refunded if the passenger books directly with LNER and are not allowing other retailers to issue refunds?

It would appear so, although they don’t actually say that.

But they do say:

BOOK WITH CONFIDENCE
We want our customers to be able to book with confidence. For a temporary period during the Coronavirus outbreak, we have made it as easy as possible for you to rearrange your travel plans after directly booking with us.

(My bold/italics)

They then go on to give instructions on how to contact them.

https://www.lner.co.uk/travel-information/coronavirus-travel-information/

I think there should be a FAQ in there or a little bit more of information if you’ve bought elsewhere but it seems they are just focused on their sales to me.

Trackman · 15 Mar 2020

yorkie said:
are you saying LNER are only allowing Advance fares to be refunded if the passenger books directly with LNER and are not allowing other retailers to issue refunds?

Trainline are now refunding LNER advance tickets, and they are waiving the £10 for amendments with some 'other' TOCs, so I imagine Avanti too.
https://bit.ly/2Wh6PC6

E759 · 15 Mar 2020

I've put in a refund claim with LNER for a pair of GC services KGX-YRK and YRK-KGX 20/3/2020. I have low expectations of being refunded but thought it worth a shot.

Saperstein · 15 Mar 2020

E759 said:
I've put in a refund claim with LNER for a pair of GC services KGX-YRK and YRK-KGX 20/3/2020. I have low expectations of being refunded but thought it worth a shot.

I take it you booked though LNER? Be interesting to see if they refund you. Please report back in progress.

Good luck though.

E759 · 15 Mar 2020

Saperstein said:
I take it you booked though LNER? Be interesting to see if they refund you. Please report back in progress.

Good luck though.

Indeed. There is a nice page LNER put up in the booking process that’s says are you sure you don’t wish to travel with us and enjoy the benefit of paying more LOL!

ScottGallagher · 15 Mar 2020

I have an advance ticket booked for 2nd April to so I'll wait to see if the refund policy changes, if the over 70 isolation rule comes into force by then I can't go as I stay with my mum who's 71.

35B · 15 Mar 2020

It's worth note that my annual travel insurance policy (provided, not free, as an employer benefit) won't pay out for change of plans due to Coronavirus - because the WHO have declared it a pandemic, it now triggers one of the exclusions in the policy.

sheff1 · 15 Mar 2020

Trackman said:
They want proof of travel from an infected country.

The UK is "an infected country". What exactly do Avanti want ?

trainophile · 15 Mar 2020

sheff1 said:
The UK is "an infected country". What exactly do Avanti want ?

Would have thought that was obvious, they want the money without providing the service it was meant to pay for.

221129 · 15 Mar 2020

trainophile said:
Would have thought that was obvious, they want the money without providing the service it was meant to pay for.

But they are providing the service!

trainophile · 15 Mar 2020

221129 said:
But they are providing the service!

Not to the individual who is being sensible enough not to travel.

221129 · 15 Mar 2020

trainophile said:
Not to the individual who is being sensible enough not to travel.

That's the individuals problem for buying non refundable tickets. This is what insurance is for.
And with TOCs requesting financial assistance from the government I cant see them being forced to spend more money on refunding tickets whilst the services are running.

Medicy · 15 Mar 2020

Haven't seen this latest update posted, but National Rail Enquiries now says:

Q: If I decide not to travel due to concerns about coronavirus, will I get a refund?
A: At the current time, there is no advice against travelling. However, train companies understand that people will be changing their plans and will be increasing support for our customers who decide against travelling as originally intended.

Train operators are working on plans which will be in place very shortly so that it’s free to get money back on most refundable fares. In the case of the cheapest advance fares, which are not normally transferable, almost all operators will be allowing changes to a trip if someone decides not to travel when they had originally booked for.

We will confirm when these additional measures are in place. At that point, people should contact the retailer through which they originally booked.

SHFTraveller · 15 Mar 2020

Had a work trip (self funded) planned for a few weeks time, booked via LNER but traveling exclusively on XC and London Midland, mixture of Anytime and Advance Tickets. Raised a refund request via LNER account, after a short time and manual intervention I received all monies back without being charged an admin fee.

LNER seem to be quite generous, I was expecting to at least pay the fee but luckily haven't.

LeylandLen · 15 Mar 2020

Not sure if covered already, saw this on Newcastle Utd site ..

In view of the current situation, LNER have changed their rules regarding refunds on unwanted travel tickets and removed charges for rebooking any journeys.

Cancelling tickets:

online here

LNER have been experiencing large call volumes and issued additional advice:

If you need to claim a refund, you can go to the booking in your online account to submit a request with the reason 'Other' then state Covid19 in the text box (even with Advance tickets).

Bletchleyite · 15 Mar 2020

By the way for the non-IT minded it's likely someone's pulling a database query from that so literally only put precisely "COVID19" in, not "please can I have a refund because of Covid 19" or somesuch.

E759 · 15 Mar 2020

Medicy said:
Haven't seen this latest update posted, but National Rail Enquiries now says:

Q: If I decide not to travel due to concerns about coronavirus, will I get a refund?
A: At the current time, there is no advice against travelling. However, train companies understand that people will be changing their plans and will be increasing support for our customers who decide against travelling as originally intended.

Train operators are working on plans which will be in place very shortly so that it’s free to get money back on most refundable fares. In the case of the cheapest advance fares, which are not normally transferable, almost all operators will be allowing changes to a trip if someone decides not to travel when they had originally booked for.

We will confirm when these additional measures are in place. At that point, people should contact the retailer through which they originally booked.

NR and TOCs conveniently don’t mention Gov. advise if you have flu is not to travel.

Haywain · 15 Mar 2020

Do you assume that all other refund requests submitted with the reason 'other' will be ignored?

Bletchleyite · 15 Mar 2020

Haywain said:
Do you assume that all other refund requests submitted with the reason 'other' will be ignored?

No, I'm just thinking along the lines that they might seek to automate Covid19 ones to save a bit of time, if you put a load of text in it may take longer for a human to get to it.

I don't know they are doing this but it would make sense.

Birkonian · 15 Mar 2020

221129 said:
That's the individuals problem for buying non refundable tickets. This is what insurance is for.
And with TOCs requesting financial assistance from the government I cant see them being forced to spend more money on refunding tickets whilst the services are running.

In the long run though, customers who've lost money might decide to drive in future.

sheff1 · 15 Mar 2020

trainophile said:
Would have thought that was obvious, they want the money without providing the service it was meant to pay for.

That has nothing to do with the "proof" I was asking about.

Haywain · 15 Mar 2020

Bletchleyite said:
No, I'm just thinking along the lines that they might seek to automate Covid19 ones to save a bit of time, if you put a load of text in it may take longer for a human to get to it.

I don't know they are doing this but it would make sense.

It might, but they'll all get looked one way or another.

Bletchleyite · 15 Mar 2020

Haywain said:
It might, but they'll all get looked one way or another.

Absolutely. But if you want yours quicker...

sheff1 · 15 Mar 2020

221129 said:
That's the individuals problem for buying non refundable tickets. This is what insurance is for.

It has been pointed out many times that generally insurance will not cover costs of domestic rail journeys.

Birkonian said:
In the long run though, customers who've lost money might decide to drive in future.

I have received emails from IHG (Intercontinental, Holiday Inn etc), Hilton & Marriott all stating that cancellation fees for any previoulsy booked "non-cancellable" stays in forthcoming weeks have been waived due to Covid-19.
It would appear major hotel chains are more interested in maintaining customer goodwill/loyalty than most TOCs who seem to have forgotten/do not care that their main competitor is the private/hired car.

Starmill · 15 Mar 2020

sheff1 said:
I have received emails from IHG (Intercontinental, Holiday Inn etc), Hilton & Marriott all stating that cancellation fees for any previoulsy booked "non-cancellable" stays in forthcoming weeks have been waived due to Covid-19.
It would appear major hotel chains are more interested in maintaining customer goodwill/loyalty than most TOCs who seem to have forgotten/do not care that their main competitor is the private/hired car.

Agreed.

Starmill · 15 Mar 2020

Haywain said:
Why would the admin fee ‘stay gone’? This is an action taken due to current exceptional circumstances.

I think the key point is that these circumstances are near certain to last for a year or more.

LNER could revoke the policy while a large portion of the country is still affected by the virus, and before a recovery has begun. But it seems that they probably won't want to do that.

An economic recovery might signal a return to more 'normal' times, 12 - 15 months from now, optimistically. At that point the policy could of course be reversed. But it would be a business decision at that time, and in a very very different trading landscape.

All travel firms, not just railways, will at that time need to do an awful lot of work rebuilding their markets. And that's the most optimistic of timescales.

westv · 15 Mar 2020

Bletchleyite said:
By the way for the non-IT minded it's likely someone's pulling a database query from that so literally only put precisely "COVID19" in, not "please can I have a refund because of Covid 19" or somesuch.

That's all LNER ask you to do so there really is no need to put anything else.

Starmill · 15 Mar 2020

Bletchleyite said:
By the way for the non-IT minded it's likely someone's pulling a database query from that so literally only put precisely "COVID19" in, not "please can I have a refund because of Covid 19" or somesuch.

IF they were doing that and didn't set it to include 'COVID19', 'COVID 19', 'Covid19', 'Covid 19', 'COVID-19', 'Covid-19' etc etc etc then they would not be great 'IT-minded' people... Also, if they didn't clock that most people are calling the disease 'Coronavirus' rather than it's correct name, they would be rather out of touch.

To put it another way; I really wouldn't worry exactly what's written there.

TOC plans regarding advance tickets if destinations become no-go (Coronavirus)?

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