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A career as a signaller

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Tom Quinne

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Then that is a real shame, not only has someone needlessly lose their life, he has as well.
 

Kraken

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People will have different ways of dealing with maintaining attention. One of the questions that used to be on an application form was something like how would you deal with the time between trains and maintaining that attention span? Depending on the amount of traffic on a route that may differ from box to box. Some may read a book, but that isn't without its pitfalls...you may get a bit engrossed and delay a train or panic and think you've not done something. And yes, I've done that before.

There used to be a poster in the boxes advising to keep away from levers and buttons, in order to not replace signals in error. Don't forget there are times when a signal needs to be replaced in front of a train, but those circumstances are readily explained, or catered for in the rules and regulations.

That said we are all human and it has to be accepted that mistakes occur, and sadly people have been killed or injured as a result of this. Equally the signal(wo)man involved has probably lost their job and may have faced a court appearance.

Thanks High Dyke - I appreciate that nobody is infallible but the consequences of a failure in concentration are very high in these cases. I suppose after a while you get used to the rhythm of the job if you are in a quieter location and when you need to be totally on it?
 

Kraken

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Moreton on Lugg accident was as result of the level crossing barriers not being interlocked with the signalling.

The signaller was busy managing a farmer using a UWC, misremembered a train passing over the level crossing (outside the box) raised the barriers but saldy the train stuck a car on the crossing killing those inside.

NWR where fined, I don’t know what happened to the signaller in the end though.

Thanks Tom, so in this case, whilst it was a failure in concentration by the signaller that caused the accident, had there been adequate interlocking it would not have been possible to raise the barriers?
 

Rockhopper

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When are relief premiums paid

Don't forget that you'll stay on your training pay grade (one grade lower) until you are signed off as competent on all the various panels you are manning (could be a lot for a grade nine position). Also probably no overtime etc until then as well. It wouldn't be unusual for it to take a year or more to get signed off, especially for a grade nine position.
 

bouff34

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Don't forget that you'll stay on your training pay grade (one grade lower) until you are signed off as competent on all the various panels you are manning (could be a lot for a grade nine position). Also probably no overtime etc until then as well. It wouldn't be unusual for it to take a year or more to get signed off, especially for a grade nine position.

I thought that you went from training grade to substantive grade once you had passed out on the first SB or panel? But you won't get the relief premium until you pass out on the second panel/SB???
 

Tomnick

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I’m trying to understand the relief premium. Why is that paid in addition to your salary?
It’s an additional payment as a percentage of the basic salary in return for being expected to be much more flexible and, potentially, travel to different locations over quite a wide area in your own time and at your own cost.
 

Cavan

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I’m trying to understand the relief premium. Why is that paid in addition to your salary?

Do you know you can search this thread? Box top right of page? And select "search this thread only" This has been answered and explained several times.

This thread is a good resource - I would suggest any question you may have a good initial step would be search this thread with the term (e.g "relief" in this case) or the name of the box you have a question about etc etc
 

Tom Quinne

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Thanks Tom, so in this case, whilst it was a failure in concentration by the signaller that caused the accident, had there been adequate interlocking it would not have been possible to raise the barriers?

Correct yes.
 

Tomnick

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Moreton on Lugg accident was as result of the level crossing barriers not being interlocked with the signalling.

The signaller was busy managing a farmer using a UWC, misremembered a train passing over the level crossing (outside the box) raised the barriers but saldy the train stuck a car on the crossing killing those inside.

NWR where fined, I don’t know what happened to the signaller in the end though.
A pedantic point, perhaps, but the signals were interlocked with the barriers (i.e. the barriers couldn’t have been raised with the protecting signal cleared) - the lack of approach locking was the problem. The simplified form hurriedly fitted in most, if not all, boxes that still had the potential for a similar incident led to the odd situation in one of my boxes where you could put the home signal back in front of a train approaching at 90mph, and (rightly) be prevented from raising the barriers but still be able to swing the facing points just ahead of the train to put it through a 15mph turnout...
 

Llanigraham

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Thanks Tom, so in this case, whilst it was a failure in concentration by the signaller that caused the accident, had there been adequate interlocking it would not have been possible to raise the barriers?

Correct.
My Box, just up the line from Moreton, was visited quite quickly after the incident by an official from the RAIB whilsy I was on duty, who wanted to know exactly how we dealt with things and how our barriers worked. They were exactly the same as those at Moreton! Many of us started using "reminder appliances" just in case.

Not long afterwards a modification was designed to stop it happening again, which basically comprised a treddle just after the crossing with a time-out relay so that the barriers could not be lifted unless a train had gone over it, or a set number of minutes had passed after the barriers were dropped.
 

Kraken

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Correct.
My Box, just up the line from Moreton, was visited quite quickly after the incident by an official from the RAIB whilsy I was on duty, who wanted to know exactly how we dealt with things and how our barriers worked. They were exactly the same as those at Moreton! Many of us started using "reminder appliances" just in case.

Not long afterwards a modification was designed to stop it happening again, which basically comprised a treddle just after the crossing with a time-out relay so that the barriers could not be lifted unless a train had gone over it, or a set number of minutes had passed after the barriers were dropped.

That’s a fascinating insight Llanigraham, thanks for sharing.
 

Llanigraham

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That’s a fascinating insight Llanigraham, thanks for sharing.
No problem.
Like most lines we all knew each other, although only slightly, and what happened to Adrian shocked us all and certainly for a while affected how we worked.
It is one thing I would say to anyone coming in to the job, even at a signalling centre. You are joining a big family and staff do look out for each other, often without saying anything.
 

Tom Quinne

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It’s very sad people have to die for these things to be improved.

What is it they say about the rule book being written in blood.
 

amanda08

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There is a new Signaler vacancy posted for Worcester and it says for locations across the route (grades 2-4)
Could anyone tell me which locations would be included here? Just in and around Worcester or further afield?
Thanks
 

ArchangelA

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There is a new Signaler vacancy posted for Worcester and it says for locations across the route (grades 2-4)
Could anyone tell me which locations would be included here? Just in and around Worcester or further afield?
Thanks
That's odd as I can't see it open on NR website any longer? I've just completed the online tests for that vacancy and thought I did pretty crap really!! Worcester covers the two boxes at Worcester, Evesham, Norton, and there may be a couple of others.
 

amanda08

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That's odd as I can't see it open on NR website any longer? I've just completed the online tests for that vacancy and thought I did pretty crap really!! Worcester covers the two boxes at Worcester, Evesham, Norton, and there may be a couple of others.
It came through on this evening’s position update email. I’ve noticed there is a delay between the email links and being able to find the job by searching the website so will probably pop up tomorrow.
Thank you for the info re areas
 

ArchangelA

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Does anybody else here think that they did really badly on the online tests for signaller, but actually got through? Be interested to hear from anyone who has succeeded in this way?
 

Kraken

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I appreciate these questions get asked a lot but would anybody be able to say whether the boxes at Rauceby and Sibsey are on 8 hours, 12 hours, or a mixture of both? Also would I be correct in thinking they are both Absolute Block?

I know it’s not the primary concern but I think grade 2 pay may be marginal for me and both those boxes would be quite a commute. They look to be lovely rural locations though! I’m strongly tempted but I don’t want to do it if commuting costs will make life a struggle. Thanks in advance for any help.
 

Tomnick

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I appreciate these questions get asked a lot but would anybody be able to say whether the boxes at Rauceby and Sibsey are on 8 hours, 12 hours, or a mixture of both? Also would I be correct in thinking they are both Absolute Block?

I know it’s not the primary concern but I think grade 2 pay may be marginal for me and both those boxes would be quite a commute. They look to be lovely rural locations though! I’m strongly tempted but I don’t want to do it if commuting costs will make life a struggle. Thanks in advance for any help.
Both work Absolute Block, plus a variation on TCB in Sibsey’s case for the single line towards Boston. 8-ish hour shifts with no regular nights.
 

LincsBobby

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Hey guys to anybody that maybe coming up to interview stage etc here is my personal timeline to give u a heads up.
January 2019 - applied for job
February 2019 - interview
March 2019 - finally found out i got the job
July - 2019 officially started employment
End of july 2019 - started signalling school
October 2019 - finished signalling school
November 2019 - TCB conversion course
Early March 2020 - Rules verified
End of March 2020 - passed out grade 2 box
29th March 2020 - First shift in box

Obviously this sort of timescale can change from location to location and i applied for a grade 2 position so my 'training pay' was the lowest grade, but may just give you a little insight what to expect. Financially this last year has been a struggle but my passion and determination for the job got me through. I would say its important to have a similar passion if you are serious about being a signaller because there are tough times ahead before you can really appreciate the job. Hope this doesn't put anyone off just thought i'd offer a brief descriptiom of my personal experience of applying and training to become a signaller.
 

Kraken

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Both work Absolute Block, plus a variation on TCB in Sibsey’s case for the single line towards Boston. 8-ish hour shifts with no regular nights.

Lovely, thanks for that really useful response Tomnick. Lack of nights could be a bit of killer there.
 

Cavan

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That's odd as I can't see it open on NR website any longer? I've just completed the online tests for that vacancy and thought I did pretty crap really!! Worcester covers the two boxes at Worcester, Evesham, Norton, and there may be a couple of others.

I would suggest the seperate "Evesham" vacancy will cover that area (Cotswold line boxes)! So if you interested in both areas, apply to both pools.
 

89jordanbj

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With regards to the Worcester vacancies.. Does anybody know which boxes they are looking to fill and which are closest to South Wales? I live in Newport so trying to work out whether or not it would be commutable for me to make enough sense to apply. Thanks in advance
 

Llanigraham

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Worcester area Boxes are those basically in and around the city, so a commute from South Wales is going to be around 2 hours, and probably beyond what NR would deem acceptable.
 

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