You might think that, but only one party refused to repudiate an endorsement by the KKK.
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Donald Trump and the aftermath of his presidency
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But how much influence do the KKK have in 2020, compared to BLM? I'm not implying that they are comparable, but the republicans aren't influencing social change anywhere near as much as the democrats are.
They have a lot more influence in 2020 than they did in 2015 - and that's the problem.
The implied point of your post being that societal change isn't required?
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
I remembered the SALT treaty, detente, and the end of Vietnam but yes, Nixon is overshadowed by Watergate. In much the same way that Trump's legacy will be overshadowed by this legal s***show.
Also, one term Presidents tend to have a poor rep anyway. Bush Snr was seen more sympathetically but Ford and Carter certainly aren't (despite the latter's humanitarian efforts).
Really? Not the continued deaths of black people by the Authorities and that 25% of deaths by police are of black people that make up only 13% of the population.
Trump used the issue to consolidate and motivate his base and to demonstrate that he was the strong man of law and order and trying to characterise the Dems as being the true racists. This doubtless because it was hard to demonise Joe Biden (other than being sleepy) so it was easier to instead try and show him as some sort of senile patsy to the "radical left".
Do they really? I don't think the KKK are even relevant in any area of American politics these days - they are a VERY fringe group and I don't think that has changed since 2015.
I was implying that social change is going the wrong way - in terms of race relations the US is moving back to the 1960's, but it's not ONLY Trump's fault, I think both sides are to blame for that.
Biden is indeed a hard person to demonise, mostly because he really hasn't done much of importance during his 45-year political career. I don't think he has anything to do with the radical left of his party, but it is also clear that they are gaining a lot of influence in other areas of American politics. In relation to the 25% of police deaths figure, how many crimes are committed by black people? In 2018, 53% of murders, 54% of robberies, 33% of assaults, 42% of weapons violations, 27% of drugs crime and 27% of total crimes were committed by the 13% black population. The number of police shootings of black people per capita are actually LOWER than the number of black people committing offences. I think that the solution here is not to defund the police, which seems to be a very popular view in America, but rather to get to the root of the problem and sort out why so many black people are turning to crime, probably due to unstable or broken family backgrounds, poor living conditions and drugs/alcohol problems, rather than racism.
It's true that they are fringe, but what is concerning (and why they are relevant) is the fact that the decline of membership was pretty much non-stop from the 1970s through to the early 2010s has stopped and may well be reversing. Which is a warning sign of increasing support/acceptance of far-right, racist views. "It's not like I'm a Klan member, but..."
So the side that is calling out entrenched racism and inequality is just as responsible as the side who says that systemic racism doesn't exist? Okay then.
Wow. Not even going to bother.
Whistler40145
Established Member
I have a great dislike for Donald Trump
He's only got to where he is by running roughshot over those he disagrees with, he doesn't care about anyone else but himself, God help the United States of America had he got in for another four years.
I'm totally unimpressed with his childish attitude that he couldn't possibly loose the Election and even after recounting of votes, non sensical legal challenges, which by each one that got thrown out of Court my face was gleaming with the words
You're out Pal
He's only got to where he is by running roughshot over those he disagrees with, he doesn't care about anyone else but himself, God help the United States of America had he got in for another four years.
I'm totally unimpressed with his childish attitude that he couldn't possibly loose the Election and even after recounting of votes, non sensical legal challenges, which by each one that got thrown out of Court my face was gleaming with the words
You're out Pal
Problem is, if he makes bad choices it's not just the USA that suffers - it's the whole world. He had some good points and some bad, especially this absolute mess of claiming he won the election. Good riddance.
overthewater
Established Member
- Joined
- 16 Apr 2012
- Messages
- 8,162
If trump really is a racist then how on earth did he managed to get increase of share of the non white vote in this election? Surly it should have went down?
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
It's far too simplistic to say that.
In Latinos, they are not one homogenous bloc. Firstly, the GOP campaign was very much about trumpeting the threat of the radical left. So if you're a Cuban or Venezuelan Latino and scarred by the experiences of communism/extreme socialism, you're probably not going to vote for the ones being painted as radical socialists. Even with the Mexican diaspora, there is a bedrock of intense observance of Roman Catholic beliefs so they are going to be sympathetic to the GOP with its Pro Life, evangelical bent.
In the black population, you have a number of younger, black people who are concerned more about their prospects rather than their ethnicity. Chuck in some rhetoric about Joe Biden's past and there's the possibility that some will say "neither guy is perfect - I'll go for the businessman" and especially as the economy pre-Covid was performing well.
This is an interesting article https://www.vox.com/2020/11/4/21537966/trump-black-voters-exit-polls
He is.
People can be convinced to vote against their self interest (we had a rather pointed example of that in 2016). As @TheGrandWazoo says, there isn't a single Latino vote - many Central Americans and particularly Cubans are strongly Republican since the GOP talks tough on opposition to Socialism/Communism. The Elian Gonzalez incident in the early 1990s pretty much locked up GOP support in Florida for a generation.
His increase in the non-white vote isn't that large though and is more than likely due to Republican efforts to repress the vote in majority Democrat-leaning areas.
birchesgreen
Established Member
This really is the gift which keeps on giving
www.theguardian.com
Trump supporter who gave $2.5m to fight election fraud wants money back
Businessman Fredric Eshelman sues pro-Trump ‘election ethics’ group citing ‘disappointing results’ of effort to expose cheating
overthewater
Established Member
- Joined
- 16 Apr 2012
- Messages
- 8,162
Surly he should have been arrested before he become president?
It's not illegal to hold racist viewpoints. He has, however, been successfully sued over his racist practices as a landlord.
nlogax
Established Member
Rikers Island becoming an ever more likely vacation prospect for the soon to be ex-president.
https://lawandcrime.com/high-profil...-recently-interviewed-deutsche-bank-employees
https://lawandcrime.com/high-profil...-recently-interviewed-deutsche-bank-employees
nlogax
Established Member
Now confirmed that Deutsche Bank has decided it's going to stop doing business with Agent Orange. Considering Trump owes them the best part of $340m I can see them calling in the debt in the very near future. There's not enough popcorn for any of this.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/11/business/trump-brand-capitol-mob.html
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/11/business/trump-brand-capitol-mob.html
Trump is clearly a lunatic, but it's not like we didn't know that already prior to 2016. He didn't (and still doesn't) exist in a vacuum. Surely the people who put him there must be just as accountable? The mind boggles and boggles on this one.
In other words, the >40% of American voters who voted him in? My mind boggles as to how many gullible people are just supporting his outlandish claims no matter what!
birchesgreen
Established Member
Prior to 2016 most people considered Donald Trump a rather eccentric game show host and blowhard. The signs were actually there for some of the darkness in his soul but most would not have known about it.
Trump has continually played to "his base". Those have known from the start about what he stands for. He provided them with a voice and a symbol to gather behind. The sycophants in power gathered behind him to protect themselves and for personal gain. Those people I can understand.
What I find absolutley abhorent is the behaviour of people like Mitch McConnell. Those career politicians who have stood behind Trump for political gain. They have stood back and watched America burn. They turned their backs on the country and have enabled him. They have used him to push some basic ideals, which is to be expected but turned a blind eye for some of the most despicable acts in US history. Now Trump is clearly out the door they have seen the wind blowing in a different direction and distanced themselves from Trump.
Shamefully 197 Republicans still voted against impeachment.
Xenophon PCDGS
Veteran Member
I often wonder if Trump is an example of a leader of the USA that would have been President should the Confederates have won the American Civil War.
eMeS
Member
Some time yesterday, there was a pretty scary news report on Ch4 I think, from Washington, and featuring heavily armed US citizens claiming that it was their constitutional right to bear arms - and the arms they were bearing were serious assault rifles etc. along with face camouflage etc. (Possibly put together for the news cameras, but who knows...)
Xenophon PCDGS
Veteran Member
Time for the armed forces of the USA with far greater firepower at their disposal to also adhere to the same constitutional right to bear arms to protect the country.
Why do I keep remembering Joan Baez singing "The night they drove Old Dixie down"?
Probably not. The NRA/GOP combination has, in collusion with or driven by the arms industry, spent the last 40 years or so pushing the "The only defence against a bad man with a gun is a good man with a gun" narrative and advocating against him control of any form despite it being supported by almost 90% of the population.
The worry about that is that quite a few people in the military believe in the lies Trump spouts as well.
The lady that died in the riots was ex military and then there’s people like this guy with his ‘Q’ badge on...
It feels to me that we were lucky this time in that Trump was so incompetent.
The next person that comes along if they have a bit more intelligence could cause significantly more problems.
Xenophon PCDGS
Veteran Member
If the Orange One wanted an anthem for a new political party that would reflect the views of his new faithful, could I suggest that famous "good old boys" song sang by Lynyrd Skynyrd...."Sweet Home Alabama"
Don’t ruin that song for me! No he can keep YMCA.
birchesgreen
Established Member
I read up on QAnon and some of their most far out beliefs last night, apparently some of them believe Donald Trump is an ageless intergalactic being of light who will be beamed all over the world by Space Force on inauguration day and finally arrest all of the pedophile carnivores.
CNN will be a must watch then.
www.news.com.au
CNN will be a must watch then.
Joe Biden is JFK Jr: wild Q conspiracies
Joe Biden is really John F. Kennedy Jnr in a CGI mask and Donald Trump is a billion-year-old intergalactic being made of pure starlight who plans to introduce a cure for all disease in his second term.
www.news.com.au
I know you shouldn't laugh at the mentally ill, but.... bwhahahahaha! There really are more out than in.
As a reminder, an openly QAnon-supporting candidate was elected to Congress this cycle.... scary!
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I read up on QAnon and some of their most far out beliefs last night, apparently some of them believe Donald Trump is an ageless intergalactic being of light who will be beamed all over the world by Space Force on inauguration day and finally arrest all of the pedophile carnivores.
CNN will be a must watch then.
Joe Biden is JFK Jr: wild Q conspiracies
Joe Biden is really John F. Kennedy Jnr in a CGI mask and Donald Trump is a billion-year-old intergalactic being made of pure starlight who plans to introduce a cure for all disease in his second term.
It’s not too surprising that they’re disappearing off down that rabbit hole. There’s so many people involved in the grift that they’ll just keep sucking people in no matter how mad it all gets. It’s like some bizarre new treasure hunt for people that live in modern day online echo chambers.
Follow it back and back and eventually you get down to the fact that it’s just another version of the oldest conspiracy theory in town though, anti Semitism...