When train services don't appear to exist

SteamPower · 13 Sep 2011

For example, when running the national rail journey planner it won't admit the 06:20 service from Derby to Sheffield exists and it won't admit a 21:30 from London St. Pancras to Derby either, instead suggesting a 21:35 departure from Euston involving two changes. Anyone else came across anything like this or know why it happens?

RailUK Forums

cuccir · 13 Sep 2011

The 06:20 from Derby won't show as it is overtaken by the 06:34, which arrives at 07:07 (4 minutes before the 06:20). I'm not sure how to bring this up (there must be a way) without ticking the 'East Midlands Trains Only' box.

It seems to be showing the 21:30 fine for me though when I search 'London to Derby' at 21:30 tomorrow. Perhaps there are engineering works affecting it the date you are searching for?

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More generally, if you're looking up train times for fun/speculation to see what's available, I can recommend any of the WebTIS journey planners as the best. They show more, though they are a little more prone to crashing or running slowly on smartphones. Examples include East Coast, Southern and London Midland.

swt_passenger · 13 Sep 2011

cuccir said:
The 06:20 from Derby won't show as it is overtaken by the 06:34, which arrives at 07:07 (4 minutes before the 06:20). I'm not sure how to bring this up (there must be a way) without ticking the 'East Midlands Trains Only' box.

They've recently changed the 'show slower trains' tick box to 'show fastest trains'. The option doesn't seem to do anything on that journey...

wintonian · 13 Sep 2011

Try setting a via point for a station where the slower train stops but the faster one doesn’t.

mickey · 13 Sep 2011

Try an ATOS-designed site. I've never tried Derby but on other routes where this happens it shows both (listed in order of departure, not arrival).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

wintonian said:
Try setting a via point for a station where the slower train stops but the faster one doesnt.

It uses route not calling points so that will work only if they go through different places.

bb21 · 13 Sep 2011

wintonian said:
Try setting a via point for a station where the slower train stops but the faster one doesn’t.

Hmm. This is no good. Station timing points for both services intermediately is Chesterfield only, unless you can enter junction names...

mickey said:
It uses route not calling points so that will work only if they go through different places.

Not true. Some services will pass certain stations yet they might not be timing points so the booking engines won't know whether the train passes those stations. via/avoid works on the basis of timing points, not which station is passed en route.

causton · 13 Sep 2011

Indeed, for example on the ECML Potters Bar is a timing point given for all trains - even the East Coast trains that don't stop till Peterborough! So if you put 'via Potters Bar' it will show them too last time I checked...

Mutant Lemming · 13 Sep 2011

I have the opposite problem - my train appears on the timetable but doesn't turn up.

mickey · 13 Sep 2011

causton said:
Indeed, for example on the ECML Potters Bar is a timing point given for all trains - even the East Coast trains that don't stop till Peterborough! So if you put 'via Potters Bar' it will show them too last time I checked...

I know that, but I thought it just knew which stations it passes without stopping. I didn't realise it was timing points instead - thanks for putting me straight.

bb21 · 13 Sep 2011

mickey said:
I know that, but I thought it just knew which stations it passes without stopping. I didn't realise it was timing points instead - thanks for putting me straight.

An example is the 1708 Bedford - Luton Airport Parkway service (destination Brighton), arriving 1734, which is overtaken by the 1718 service (destination London St Pancras), arriving 1730.

The 1708 service has timing points Flitwick, Harlington, Leagrave and Luton between Bedford and Luton Airport Parkway, whereas the 1718 only has Flitwick and Luton. So if you specify via Luton, the fast train will still show instead of the overtaken service despite not stopping at Luton, whereas specifying via Leagrave will filter out the fast train, despite it passing through.

When train services don't appear to exist

SteamPower

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RailUK Forums

cuccir

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swt_passenger

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wintonian

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mickey

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bb21

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causton

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Mutant Lemming

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mickey

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bb21

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