voyagerdude220
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I saw VT report on their twitter page early on Friday that it was their own driver.
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Bletchley Derailment
- Thread starter bengley
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I saw VT report on their twitter page early on Friday that it was their own driver.
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I'd imagine the CCF replay will be looked at by the RAIB as a matter of course.
I'm awaiting the RAIB report with interest. All sorts of issues that could be thrown up here, but *if* driver fatigue was a contributory factor, I'd imagine ASLEF and all train companies needing to consider the implications, especially in light of the incident involving the lengthy rollback of a 92 in recent times.
I'm awaiting the RAIB report with interest. All sorts of issues that could be thrown up here, but *if* driver fatigue was a contributory factor, I'd imagine ASLEF and all train companies needing to consider the implications, especially in light of the incident involving the lengthy rollback of a 92 in recent times.
Whistler40145
Established Member
I don't know at what time the Driver would have signed on for the departure of 0A00 @ 01:03?
If he is a Virgin Driver, then this must be one of few or any movements in the early hours?
Can anyone confirm any of the above?
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If he is a Virgin Driver, then this must be one of few or any movements in the early hours?
Can anyone confirm any of the above?
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MidnightFlyer
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There's quite a few night shifts on most TOCs, starting from 2100-2359, finishing at 0500-0700, taking trains back to depots or sidings, or into stations for the first duties of the day.
Problem with nightshifts is there's always a first one of them! So, say you go to bed at 2200, get up at 0600 the next morning. You are due to sign on at 0030 that night so you attempt to get some sleep at 1800, but find you are too awake to get any meaningful rest. You book on as planned at 0030, but feel thoroughly shattered. It's a recipe for problems....
Nym
Established Member
Ahh ya see I can move my sleep pattern easilly, the night before a night shift I wouldn't be going to bed until 4am, up at 2pm, kind of a pre-night shift shift... But when you're on four on four off that WHS did because the're thick, then it's a pain, 8 on 8 off or 6 on 6 off is a much nicer way to work it. (And 12hr shifts mean a standard working hours week averages out)
Interesting Nym - all of us are different though. The real killer for my grade is when you finish at 2300 on a Saturday, Sunday off and then in at 03## on a Monday. I defy anyone to feel on top of their game and fully rested when they book on for duty on the Monday!
Nym
Established Member
Yeah, if I had that, I'd get home from the shift at something like midnight, either go out sans drink or stay in and pay the xbox some long overdue attention, get to sleep at ~6-7am on Sunday morning, wake up at 4pm and then work through, possibly with a 1hr power nap on the sofa at midnight...
When I was on my 4am starts at H&B and weekends at LDC I had something similar, 7pm finished at LDC Trafford on sunday, onto a 4am start at H&B Bolton on Monday... That was more fun to plan, did it with 3hrs sleep and lots of coffee, luckily Mondays where quiet days and I could usually finish by 11 - 11:30am...
Also, thankfully at H&B I had a cupholder and could just kneck coffee all morning, usually avoided all the kak traffic too if I landed it lucky, got into York before the AM rush and then back out during the AM rush, slip into Bilbrough Top for 10mins and more coffee, then sod off back to depot and usually missed every rush hour on route
For those who know this country: Bolton - Northallerton - York - Elvington - Bilbrough - Tadcaster - Rothwell - Tingley - Middleton - (Hyde) - (Ashton Moss) - Prestwich - Bolton was my usual Monday run...
When I was on my 4am starts at H&B and weekends at LDC I had something similar, 7pm finished at LDC Trafford on sunday, onto a 4am start at H&B Bolton on Monday... That was more fun to plan, did it with 3hrs sleep and lots of coffee, luckily Mondays where quiet days and I could usually finish by 11 - 11:30am...
Also, thankfully at H&B I had a cupholder and could just kneck coffee all morning, usually avoided all the kak traffic too if I landed it lucky, got into York before the AM rush and then back out during the AM rush, slip into Bilbrough Top for 10mins and more coffee, then sod off back to depot and usually missed every rush hour on route
For those who know this country: Bolton - Northallerton - York - Elvington - Bilbrough - Tadcaster - Rothwell - Tingley - Middleton - (Hyde) - (Ashton Moss) - Prestwich - Bolton was my usual Monday run...
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Whistler40145
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I expect it takes a while for a Driver getting used to working strange shift patterns, especially night shift.
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phil8715
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Where would the driver be based who was driving this loco?
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AlterEgo
Veteran Member
No, they said there was evidence that the locomotive was travelling too fast.
Nobody in the press have actually suggested it was the driver's fault...
Whistler40145
Established Member
phil8715, I am not sure, but I expect Crewe station is a signing on point for Virgin traincrew.
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MidnightFlyer
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It is not a depot though, nor indeed a 'signing on point' - you must sign on at your depot AFAIK. Only depots for drivers are Euston, Wolves, Manchester, Liverpool, Preston, Polmadie (Glasgow) and Edinburgh.
Whistler40145
Established Member
So, the Virgin driver would have had to travel from his signing on point by other means to pickup 90046?
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MidnightFlyer
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Yes, say it was a Manchester man, he would get a train (usually specified) from Manchester to Crewe after he'd signed on, and milled about on Crewe (if need be) or gone straight to his job, it just depends on what the shift is. When no trains are running, they are taxied there.
DarloRich
Veteran Member
The Pway lads were still hard at it this afternoon (attached picture taken C.1400). I think they deserve a massive pat on the back for working on a big job, on a busy line, all day and night in terrible weather.
I know some of the shifts some of these lads have pulled in the last 72 hours and it is really incredible. They have done a great job and deserve praise.
I know some of the shifts some of these lads have pulled in the last 72 hours and it is really incredible. They have done a great job and deserve praise.
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hairyhandedfool
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Some TOCs allow drivers to sign on at a point other than a SOP or depot, for example, Thameslink allowed Bedford based drivers to sign on at Luton if their first booked service was from there. This could save a driver a 1 hour round trip just to sign on. I'm not saying Virgin is a TOC that allows it, just that it can happen.
merlodlliw
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What about the drivers from Holyhead? one up starts at around 0430,
MidnightFlyer
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No driver depot at Holyhead, I think Liverpool and Manchester men only sign it.
DarloRich
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how do thye roster the early turns then?
Work still ging on at Blethcley but aim is to have everything open for am peak tomorrow ( plus sort out the wire issues at Tring!)
headshot119
Established Member
The morning Voyager goes up ECS with a driver on it.
5D13 Crewe CS - Holyhead. Arrives at 06:25
merlodlliw
Established Member
I know there is a voyager service area built at Holyhead, so for tomorrows 0425 departure for Euston where will the driver come from? out of interest, will it be a ATW staff driver, as these guys used to take HSTs to Crewe.
As an interested person, surly no VT driver will sign on over 100 miles away from Holyhead.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
What about the 0425 UP
headshot119
Established Member
I answered that in my post above :
Holyhead is not a driver depot for Virgin, they only have Train Managers and I think catering staff.
The driver who brings the voyager up to Holyhead as 5D13 will either be a Liverpool based driver, or a Manchester based driver.
As for the 04:25 UP train (1v51) I believe the train stables overnight from 1D41 the day before. No idea on the driver though, possibly a hotel turn?
MidnightFlyer
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Like I've said only Manchester and Liverpool crews sign to Holyhead. There is a catering and TM (I think) depot there, but no drivers. I obviously have no access to rosters, but I could guess they arrive on the 0220 ATW service ex-BHI, have a break then take it back to Crewe at 0448, that would work out well within their hours.
merlodlliw
Established Member
Think you for your info,I do as an interested party wonder why at least three vt voyagers stable overnight at Holyhead, I had no idea VT drivers were used from such distant places stay overnight at HHD. VT do have a servicing facility as well at HHD as well as catering staff & Management
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Thank you, but its like like working a two hour day,with all respect to the drivers if they sign on at Man Or Pool
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phil8715
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My Brov works for Virgin Trains and reckons it was a Euston man.
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Whistler40145
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Where will the 67 come off?
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Often early morning trains are night shifts. And often might shifts have less work in them partly due to obvious fatigue in nights and also as less services run. Many night shifts are ferrying to depots but running ones are often very little work.
Up until last summer timetable (I think) one of Victoria's night shifts was the 0100 vic-Brighton then the 0415 back up. This gave a couple of hours break and often the train terminated at bridges due to engineering works so you were looking at 3-4 hours break. Virgin may also have lodging turns like various companies still do (I only know NXEA and EC to deffinately have them still).
Up until last summer timetable (I think) one of Victoria's night shifts was the 0100 vic-Brighton then the 0415 back up. This gave a couple of hours break and often the train terminated at bridges due to engineering works so you were looking at 3-4 hours break. Virgin may also have lodging turns like various companies still do (I only know NXEA and EC to deffinately have them still).
craig87034
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67011 and 67020 will work 1S26 as far as Crewe where 90035 will take over
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