£14m plan for Dundee Station

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marks87

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Local press reporting that Dundee City Council are to vote on plans to spend £14m upgrading Dundee Station. Pictures and more here - http://www.thecourier.co.uk/News/Du...plan-to-transform-dundee-railway-station.html

It's something that's long overdue. Network Rail's stance has always been that it's fit for purpose (which is true) and so it's up to the council to put up the cash for cosmetic improvement. But I wonder if they'll be inclined to put up the final £2m that they're being asked for.
 
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marks87

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I can't help but feel there are stations more in need of an upgrade... Ah well...
£12m of the cash is being put up by the council; they're "only" looking for £2m from NR.

While I'm inclined to agree that cosmetic improvements shouldn't be funded by NR, on the other hand look look at the money spent on (e.g.) Kings Cross. Wile I don't deny that was in need of upgrading, how much was spent on making it look nice, instead of simply making it functional?
 

asylumxl

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While that's true, there's tons of stations with higher passenger usage and more trains that could do with even just that £2,000,000. We just have to refer to the list of medium stations in need of improvement made under the previous government.
 

PinzaC55

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The important phrase in that story is " The Victorian below-ground platforms and buildings will be retained."
Whenever I read a story where something is paid for or "backed by" a council I know that
A) Huge amounts of money will be squandered and
B) The result will worse than what went before.
Nothing here to surprise me, though I hope the Dundee taxpayers don't find it too hard to manage when their Council Tax bills arrive.
 

Stats

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While I'm inclined to agree that cosmetic improvements shouldn't be funded by NR, on the other hand look look at the money spent on (e.g.) Kings Cross. Wile I don't deny that was in need of upgrading, how much was spent on making it look nice, instead of simply making it functional?
Going by comments I've heard from many of my friends none of the money went on it making it functional and all of the money went on it looking nice.
 

tbtc

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Dundee is a functional station, if not particularly pretty.

It copes well with the current service levels (two an hour to Aberdeen, two an hour to Edinburgh, one an hour to Glasgow), so there's nothing really that needs doing.

And since it is always going to be hidden away in a cutting, I'm not what you can do to make any practical difference, other than sorting out the access to/from the city centre (which may not be part of the scope of this £14m).
 

DaveNewcastle

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I quite like the proposal to develop the site with an hotel and ideally an appropriate offering of retail space. You're right tbtc, the distance between the station and centre isn't going to go away, so any development really does need to make it a welcoming place to arrive at - which in the long dark Scottish winters means a warm and dry welcome.

But similarly unwelcoming difficulties arise at platform level.
It can be a long walk to the bay platforms through the cold and wet. The present arrangement where passengers wait standing in the lobby space at the foot of the steps which is shared with a cafe and departure boards (but is still some distance from the bay platforms) is very unsatisfactory.

If the development could allow passengers to reach the bays without the walk along the length of those bleak and exposed through platforms, then at least one of that unfortunately miserable city's burdens would be removed. Perhaps the staff facilities in those buildings could be moved upstairs to liberate more space within the building for the passage of passengers?
 

marks87

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...other than sorting out the access to/from the city centre (which may not be part of the scope of this £14m).
You're right tbtc, the distance between the station and centre isn't going to go away, so any development really does need to make it a welcoming place to arrive at - which in the long dark Scottish winters means a warm and dry welcome.
One of the main reasons for wanting the station redeveloped is the £1bn waterfront redevelopment programme, which is expanding the City Centre down to the waterfront. If all goes to plan, the station will be right on the western edge of the "new" city centre.

http://www.dundeewaterfront.com/
 

johnnychips

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[...] other than sorting out the access to/from the city centre (which may not be part of the scope of this £14m).
It's only five minutes' walk at most! Certainly no more than Manchester Piccadilly to Piccadilly Gardens. The problem with Dundee is the cavernous, freezing waiting area, which a few industrial-sized fan-heaters would solve; and negotiating the roadworks and diggings in front of the station, which I presume will end sometime soon.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
that unfortunately miserable city
I went for the first time this April in a snowstorm and found it OK. Loved the 'Discovery' and 'Desperate Dan' statue; otherwise it seemed a clean 'normal' place to me, and the people didn't seem to be that unfortunate or miserable, just...normal.

Perhaps some Dundonians (?) would like to comment on their city and station.
 

Liam

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Perhaps some Dundonians (?) would like to comment on their city and station.
Not a Dundonian, but a nearby Fifer. Dundee is a great city if you don't fancy the touristy Edinburgh or the longer travel to Glasgow. Okay there are some dodgy parts of the city, but are there any cities that don't have any dodgy areas? Yes the station is out of the way of the city centre, but on the other hand it isn't much further away from the city centre than the bus station on the other side of the centre, arguably it is closer to the uni and associated nightlife. The station building needs an upgrade from its 60/70s looking facade but the platform level is reasonable. I'm not really sure how you could make the bays more accessible from the main concourse without destroying those 'Victorian buildings'.
 

12CSVT

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How about a meaningful service for the stations between Dundee and Carnoustie, instead of the 0600 parliamentary ?
 

IanXC

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£12m of the cash is being put up by the council; they're "only" looking for £2m from NR.

While I'm inclined to agree that cosmetic improvements shouldn't be funded by NR, on the other hand look look at the money spent on (e.g.) Kings Cross. Wile I don't deny that was in need of upgrading, how much was spent on making it look nice, instead of simply making it functional?
I think its also relevant that Kings Cross is also managed by Network Rail. What contribution would ScotRail be making to these works?
 

MidnightFlyer

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Why did they scrap the footbridge from the station over the complex series of roads into the city centre? I remember it but it went about four years ago. You can still see the stairway at the station, when I was at Dundee last November though it was occupied by a bunch of chavs.
 

marks87

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I think its also relevant that Kings Cross is also managed by Network Rail. What contribution would ScotRail be making to these works?
Transport Scotland might be prepared to contribute from the recently announced £30m pot for improving stations, but the key word in your post is "managed" -- ultimately, the station is still owned by Network Rail.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Why did they scrap the footbridge from the station over the complex series of roads into the city centre? I remember it but it went about four years ago. You can still see the stairway at the station, when I was at Dundee last November though it was occupied by a bunch of chavs.
Because it was an eyesore! They've got rid of most of its sister as well, as part of the Tayside House demolition.

Mind you, I've good memories of the bridge to the station. Many a good railway-based holiday started by crossing it when I small.
 

IanXC

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Transport Scotland might be prepared to contribute from the recently announced £30m pot for improving stations, but the key word in your post is "managed" -- ultimately, the station is still owned by Network Rail.
Ah but in general aren't the individual TOCs (or NR in the case of their managed stations) responsible for issues of appearance and passenger facilities?
 

tbtc

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It's only five minutes' walk at most! Certainly no more than Manchester Piccadilly to Piccadilly Gardens. The problem with Dundee is the cavernous, freezing waiting area, which a few industrial-sized fan-heaters would solve; and negotiating the roadworks and diggings in front of the station, which I presume will end sometime soon
...though Manchester obviously has a much bigger city centre.

The problem isn't the distance/time (in the case of Dundee), its the unwelcoming ways of getting across Marketgait/ the roundabout, which creates quite an unwelcoming barrier.

At least the city is finally recognising that cutting off the "centre" from the water (by filling the space between the shops and the Tay with dual carriageways) was a bad thing, and this will help the railway station to feel less "cut off".

I don't think there's really anything that you can do to the structure of the station - I think that the bay platforms could be extended further east, which means that you will always have a long trek to/from any terminating services. The more important thing is that these services exist (the doubling of Edinburgh/Fife trains a couple of years ago being a big improvement).
 
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