150219 accessibility modifications

Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by 387star, 25 Apr 2015.

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  1. 387star

    387star Established Member

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    Last edited: 25 Apr 2015
  2. Techniquest

    Techniquest Veteran Member

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    I didn't even know 150s were going for DDA mods yet! At least a start has been made on the rather large fleet.

    I'm trying to figure how many seats must have to be removed to make room for the new facility. Surely it can't be that many, I'd be surprised if it's more than 8. For the gains the new facility brings it's worth sacrificing a few seats, and at least it builds up the spares supply of seats!
     
  3. CC 72100

    CC 72100 Established Member

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    Bloody hell. It looks like the toilet just landed there!

    New flooring looks good though, gives them a bit of a tidy up which, while it wasn't getting desperate, is much appreciated.

    How many seats have been lost with this? No wonder 4 cars on the Devon metro is the plan post-IEP and related cascades.
     
  4. richa2002

    richa2002 Established Member

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    Looks like identical components to the 319 'refreshes'.
     
  5. 387star

    387star Established Member

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    All this pink might clash with the proposed green just saying

    Identical to the turbo toilets being fitted as well i think
    PS isn't the new First Bus livery pretty poor
     
    Last edited: 25 Apr 2015
  6. cactustwirly

    cactustwirly Established Member

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    Hopefully the PA voice isn't the annoying one found on the turbos
     
  7. louis97

    louis97 Established Member

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    Most certainly is - however the extra bits for the West network is a different person.
     
  8. GatwickDepress

    GatwickDepress Established Member

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    Silly question, but what's the blue locker behind the panel on the right?

    It always feels a little slapdash when TOCs do that. I wouldn't mind a Bristolian burr doing the automated announcements on West Country stock though...
     
  9. louis97

    louis97 Established Member

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    The on-board Ramp.
     
  10. GatwickDepress

    GatwickDepress Established Member

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    Ah, thank you! Very unobtrusively designed container too.
     
  11. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    It might be a good cause, but with overcrowding as it is it's unacceptable for a modified unit to be simply placed on the same diagrams as unmodified ones.

    I would have preferred the units to be reformed into 3-car trains. This would guarantee no loss of capacity, and represent less vehicles to modify. Failing that, any 1x150 diagram should become minimum 150+153 to make up. I realise we don't have enough units to do this, in which case the work should be waiting til nearer 2020, and/or we shouldn't be talking about Pacer scrapping. All in all, sadly another example of poor planning by the industry as a whole.
     
  12. 47802

    47802 Established Member

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    Wow that's bad who wants to be sat next to that, I'm not sure what the number of seats previously was in a FGW unit but previous 150 layouts show up to 21 seats in that section even on 2+2 layout and now looks to be down to 8 proper seats even if that isn't entirely due to the toilet.

    We have had a lot of talk about loss of seats on Railbuses if they were made compliant, but the loss of seats on a 150 looks significant.

    Maybe a Metro version with no Toilet for some routes needs to be looked at, or as has been suggested maybe a reform into 3 or even 4 car units.
     
    Last edited: 26 Apr 2015
  13. jcollins

    jcollins Veteran Member

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    I was trying to find some figures but somebody's helpfully removed the seating capacities from Wikipedia because one other person agreed with them that it's not necessary to have it on articles. :roll:

    The ex-FNW 150/2s went down from 149 seats to 131 seats when they were refurbished including a new 'accessible' toilet. Although, that 'accessible' toilet doesn't meet the post-2019 requirements.

    Is there a requirement for the 150s to be fitted with a 'ramp locker'? I notice there's a tip-up seat where the ramp would originally have been, so it seems by having one you get a tip-up seat instead of a proper seat.
     
  14. 47802

    47802 Established Member

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    Do we know what changes will need to be made to 156's and 158's presumably it should be a lot less as they already have more of a disabled Toilet.
     
  15. TheEdge

    TheEdge Established Member

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    Whoever makes that toilet module must be laughing all the way to bank. Its the same one on the GA 156s and seemingly the 319s.

    Awful awful things. "TOILET DOOR IS UNLOCKED! TOILET DOOR IS LOCKED!"
     
  16. Techniquest

    Techniquest Veteran Member

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    Compared to what came before them, they are much better and more welcome!

    The 156s and 158s may well have facilities that work now but surely they will also need to be modernised by 2020. Maybe not to comply with DDA regulations but more because the current ones will surely be worn out! Not that some of them on ATW's 158s haven't been knackered for years...
     
  17. DanTrainMan185

    DanTrainMan185 Established Member

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    I think it looks vile personally!
     
  18. jcollins

    jcollins Veteran Member

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    They don't have retention toilets which are also a post-2019 requirement.
     
  19. TheEdge

    TheEdge Established Member

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    The issue with them is that they have been so over designed to meet the DDA rules that most of the area they take up is dead. Despite the size of the cubicle to sit down you need to sit at an angle because of where the loo and sink module are located. Most of the space is clear just to allow the theoretical maximum sized wheelchair to turn. In reality I've never seen them used by anything but a "normal" folding style wheelchair. What I have seen is a family of four all fit in there (yea, I know!)
     
  20. AM9

    AM9 Established Member

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    Enough room for the 1100mm high club. :D
     
  21. Rich McLean

    Rich McLean Established Member

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    On XC Voyagers when they are rammed, I have often seen many passengers squeeze into to the bogs just to create more space standing space for passengers getting on. <D
     
  22. physics34

    physics34 Established Member

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    Am i the only one who thinks that toilets should have a second door between the toliet and the passenger accommodation for reasons of privacy and just general good hygiene/pleasant enviroment?

    If find it slightly bizarre to have seating right outside a toliet and when u are sitting there you often get a "whiff" of whatever somebody has done in there or you hear noises.

    I know it would take up more space but IMO it should almost be some kind of law!!
     
  23. DanTrainMan185

    DanTrainMan185 Established Member

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    Not only would it take up too much room, but 1) any 'tunes' that you may hear can potentially be drowned out just by the natural noise of travel and 2) as for unpleasant smells there are these wonderful inventions called windows :lol:

    However, purely on a private/personal point of view, I agree entirely. But it's not practical.
     
  24. physics34

    physics34 Established Member

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    ha ha,i guess thats where mk1-4 coaches have one over on MU coaches. Having doors on the coach ends, thereby the ability to have access to the loos in the vestibles.
     
  25. 455driver

    455driver Veteran Member

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    So you admit they don't have enough units to do what you propose and then say its poor planning! :roll: :roll:

    As for carrying out the work nearer 2020, what services are you going to cancel while the units are away for modifying?
    The whole point of starting modifying them now is so they can still have the maximum number of units available taking into account the other maintenance requirements.
     
  26. Blindtraveler

    Blindtraveler Established Member

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    I havnt met one of these yet. Other than the above info on the status of the door, which despite being designed for people like myself without vision sounds mega anoying, plus the location of the pan itself, why are they so awfull as to prompt laughing to the bank comments?

    Some of the retrofits done to MK3 Stock e.g the Caly Sleapers and HST Trailers seam quite well designed to me, and whilst the space is different on a sprinter or turbo, could the design not have been coppied to an extent?
     
  27. edwin_m

    edwin_m Established Member

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    As do Voyagers and Pendolinos, where toilet smells seems to be high on the list of complaints made on this forum. So a second door doesn't necessarily help much.
    --- old post above --- --- new post below ---
    Not heard one of those but it's a good idea in principle, considering how many people fail to press the lock button to the general embarrassment of them and the person who opens the door while they're still doing their business. Perhaps it should wait about 5s after the door closes, so people who know about the lock button will have pressed it, then issue a reminder if it hasn't been.
     
  28. TheEdge

    TheEdge Established Member

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    Because that design of toilet seems to have become the go to design being put on all BR built units being refurbished. They have appeared in 156s, 319s and 150s. They also have popped up in the CGI renders of refurbishments of various other units. Given the vast amount of BR age units that need to be DDA'd I would wager the company making them is doing fairly well out of it!

    And I know the announcement is designed for those with poor sight but that doesn't alter the fact it can be heard down the train and in the cab.
     
  29. Blindtraveler

    Blindtraveler Established Member

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    The announcement sounds blooming horrid. Just because we are in some way or other disabled doesnt mean we are stupid or whatever, which would seam to be being implied by the way it is worded? Maybe as someone else suggests a gentle reminder after 5-10 secs would be better? Its instinkt, even to my non seasoned traveler Wife to lock the door once inside. I like the way its done on 390s.
     
  30. physics34

    physics34 Established Member

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    sounds like huge overkill.

    Why does the whole train want to know if you are using the toliet! ALmost embarrassing.
    --- old post above --- --- new post below ---
    I might be wrong but isnt that smell the retention tanks.?
     
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