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3+2 Seating on ScotRail Replacement Buses!

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route:oxford

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Just had a text from my parents to tell me that they are on a rail-replacement bus from Stirling and it's got 3+2 seating...

That doesn't sound overly comfortable.
 
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Bletchleyite

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Because it is not physically possible for an average (let alone large) adult male to occupy only one seat on these coaches, and therefore to use their seat belt in a proper, safe manner, it is my strong view that carrying passengers over the age of 16 in these seats should be an offence. This would be implemented by having a minimum seat width and legroom dictated by law for carrying adults, as it is on aircraft.

I recognise why they are used (they basically substitute for the old but unsafe practice of 3-kids-for-2-adults on coaches), but they are not suitable to carry adults.

For teacher use on school trips, which is what they are for (and perfectly well suited to), a few rows of normal 2+2 could be provided at the front.
 
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J-2739

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3+2 seating is the worst on a bus/coach. Sure, it increases capacity, and your mates can sit with each other. But the day when the air-con breaks...:cry:
 

XC90

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Where is this, which route?

I would be amazed if this is the case unless they were at the back of the bus where 5 seats is very common.
 

route:oxford

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Where is this, which route?

I would be amazed if this is the case unless they were at the back of the bus where 5 seats is very common.

DSCF7412-e1360662482475.jpg


Dunblane/Stirling to Falkirk High

Service was delayed further at Larbert.

An exasperated passenger, who had missed 2 earlier services due to full coaches, lay down on the road in front of the bus and refused to move...
 
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AM9

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3+2 seating is the worst on a bus/coach. Sure, it increases capacity, and your mates can sit with each other. But the day when the air-con breaks...:cry:

Do you need air conditioning as far north as Scotland? :)
 

radamfi

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I was presented with one of these on a Southern replacement bus a couple of years ago and I refused to get on it, and chose the slower replacement bus instead.
 

Butts

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DSCF7412-e1360662482475.jpg


Dunblane/Stirling to Falkirk High

Service was delayed further at Larbert.

An exasperated passenger, who had missed 2 earlier services due to full coaches, lay down on the road in front of the bus and refused to move...

Well I was on the 0716 Bus from FKG to FKK which was virtually empty and ironically provided by First :p

2x2 no jazzy arrangements onboard.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Do you need air conditioning as far north as Scotland? :)

Only in exceptional circumstances - heating is far more important :p
 

DasLunatic

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DSCF7412-e1360662482475.jpg


Dunblane/Stirling to Falkirk High

Service was delayed further at Larbert.

An exasperated passenger, who had missed 2 earlier services due to full coaches, lay down on the road in front of the bus and refused to move...

Half surprised there isn't a sixth seat on the back row....
 

Hadders

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Quite common to see 3+2 seats on service buses in the Highlands.
 

Robertj21a

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A lot of school contracts call for buses with about 70 seats. It used to mean double deckers were essential (with all the problems of low bridges, trees, riots on top deck etc) - now, a long coach with 3+2 seating can achieve the 70 capacity needed for schools.
 
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This has happened quite a few times in Surrey and Sussex as well. Buses Excetera have used SN56 AXX on Rail Replacement. Countryliner and Sunray Travel (before they both went bust) have used X432 KON / X433 KON / X439 KON / R100 PAR / R200 PAR on Rail Replacement.

Personally i think that all Rail Replacement buses should be low floor DDA compliant buses with normal 2+2 seating. Coaches and School Bus style buses should not be used on Rail Replacement.
 

XC90

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DSCF7412-e1360662482475.jpg


Dunblane/Stirling to Falkirk High

Service was delayed further at Larbert.

An exasperated passenger, who had missed 2 earlier services due to full coaches, lay down on the road in front of the bus and refused to move...

My goodness - I am now officially amazed! Must be used for school kids, look how narrow each individual seat is.
 

NotATrainspott

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Banning 3+2 seating on RRBs is just going to make it more expensive to run RRB services. It's no surprise that the main RRB fleet is the set of buses which aren't needed for most of the week and aren't used for revenue services. If you want to stop councils contracting 70 seaters then you'll need to spend more on tax for no obvious benefit to the schoolchildren who use these every day. RRBs are terrible but at the very least they are capable of safely carrying people from A to B, which is fundamentally what a transport network is meant to be about.
 

tsr

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Personally i think that all Rail Replacement buses should be low floor DDA compliant buses with normal 2+2 seating. Coaches and School Bus style buses should not be used on Rail Replacement.

It can be exceedingly hard to get hold of any bus at times, let alone of one suitable for every passenger, but to be fair it always seems to me that there are just as many decent coaches as bad ones used on emergency/ad-hoc replacement services, perhaps excluding Redhill-Tonbridge.

I'm by no means a bus or coach fan when it's put in comparison with a train, but a lot of the time GTR use the likes of Crawley Luxury which, though perhaps not always living up to the second bit of its name, won't cause much discomfort at all!

On the other hand, a lot of the more accessible buses are used on timetabled RRBs during engineering work, which are probably needed to ensure formal plans have been made for those with such requirements; however, these are often double-deck tin cans more suited for 5 minute hops around South London, and by no means comfortable enough for most people to endure on a longer run like Redhill to East Croydon in a crawl on the A23!

My goodness - I am now officially amazed! Must be used for school kids, look how narrow each individual seat is.

I'm amused by the fact that it has window curtains. Not sure anyone's getting much sleep on one of those...
 

XC90

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It can be exceedingly hard to get hold of any bus at times, let alone of one suitable for every passenger, but to be fair it always seems to me that there are just as many decent coaches as bad ones used on emergency/ad-hoc replacement services, perhaps excluding Redhill-Tonbridge.

I'm by no means a bus or coach fan when it's put in comparison with a train, but a lot of the time GTR use the likes of Crawley Luxury which, though perhaps not always living up to the second bit of its name, won't cause much discomfort at all!

On the other hand, a lot of the more accessible buses are used on timetabled RRBs during engineering work, which are probably needed to ensure formal plans have been made for those with such requirements; however, these are often double-deck tin cans more suited for 5 minute hops around South London, and by no means comfortable enough for most people to endure on a longer run like Redhill to East Croydon in a crawl on the A23!



I'm amused by the fact that it has window curtains. Not sure anyone's getting much sleep on one of those...

Keeps the sun out in Autumn.
 

dk1

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Went across Skye on some clapped out old banger of a bus a few years back. It too had 3+2 seating but at the expense of the aisle. My mates a tad on the chunky side & unless you are six years old it doesn't work :lol::lol:
 

Closet2405

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In contrast to this, I walked past Southampton central yesterday and the buses they were using for the Portsmouth replacement buses were much better. Modern, good condition and definitely not 3+2 seats.

Two of the buses parked up were the type you'd normally see on service buses (one from Stagecoach, the other was a double decker but I can't remember the company). These would presumably be used for the "stopping" buses, is it common for these types of bus to be used? I've only ever noticed coaches before.
 

Robertj21a

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This has happened quite a few times in Surrey and Sussex as well. Buses Excetera have used SN56 AXX on Rail Replacement. Countryliner and Sunray Travel (before they both went bust) have used X432 KON / X433 KON / X439 KON / R100 PAR / R200 PAR on Rail Replacement.

Personally i think that all Rail Replacement buses should be low floor DDA compliant buses with normal 2+2 seating. Coaches and School Bus style buses should not be used on Rail Replacement.

Coaches need to be used on many rail replacement services - indeed many contracts specify only coaches - because of the luggage. Coaches have lockers for suitcases, shopping trolleys, bikes etc - buses don't. Coaches are also often available when buses aren't.
 

robbeech

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They're the mk1 seats from Cogent aren't they?
The mk2 ones work a bit better and have external seat belts rather than coming through the seat.
I only know the difference as a friend of mine brought one back from Swansea a few weeks ago after having a refurb (he runs a bus company in Lincolnshire). They weren't horrendous although they were new and I was the only passenger. They do school runs with them so they are ideal. Not sure they'd work for RRB.
 

Hadders

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The 3+2 'buses' I've been on in the Highlands are actually coaches - operated by Stagecoach!
 

Baxenden Bank

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Quite common to see 3+2 seats on service buses in the Highlands.

And people wonder why use of bus services is reducing!

Stagecoach had a service bus with this seating arrangement out-stationed at Ambleside for a while.
 

Baxenden Bank

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Banning 3+2 seating on RRBs is just going to make it more expensive to run RRB services. It's no surprise that the main RRB fleet is the set of buses which aren't needed for most of the week and aren't used for revenue services. If you want to stop councils contracting 70 seaters then you'll need to spend more on tax for no obvious benefit to the schoolchildren who use these every day. RRBs are terrible but at the very least they are capable of safely carrying people from A to B, which is fundamentally what a transport network is meant to be about.

No, they are not safe. How do you get 70 adults off that bus in a hurry if the engine catches fire? The aisle is far to narrow. I'm surprised they get type approval for use even on school contracts. Wholly unsuitable for rail replacement work, unless that happens to be a train service full of school children.
 

radamfi

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Bus with too many seats vice no bus? I know which I'd prefer.

Why not have 6 seats across then? The point is, it is physically impossible to get 5 average sized adults in a 3+2 configuration without excessively intrusive squashing together. These buses are only intended for use by children.
 

Baxenden Bank

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Bus with too many seats vice no bus? I know which I'd prefer.

It's not that they have too many seats, rather the seats are too narrow for anyone over the age of 10 and they tend to have reduced legroom as well. No way would I want to do Inverness to Thurso RRB in one of those!
 

317666

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I had a 3+2 RRB on the Buxton branch last year, but it was really old and the seats were rock hard and bolt upright. Not a very pleasant journey!
 
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