9/11 Proven wrong

[16CSVT2700]

Basically you're saying the back ups would have been retrieved and all the fraudsters exposed by the CIA/FBI/WTFwhogivesacrap?

No, thats not how it works matey.

 

[Sprog]

Thanks for that Ascot. Ill have a flick through later.

Whats the matter you lot? Did you think Stupid Sproggy was incapable of putting up a logical, sensible and well structured argument?!

Didnt get that 'A' in English Language for nothing

 

[Tom]

This is a final warning for this thread following 43103s comments which have since been soft deleted.

The above text is posted under my capacity as an administrator.

The below text is posted under my capacity as a member.

I can't see the point that people died in 11/9, as then the US gov could be done by lawyers for mass manslaughter by the killings in the WTC buildings, also if it was real, then how come Al Qaeda have claimed it (but then there are some groups who claim everything)...

 

[Tom B]

Basically you're saying the back ups would have been retrieved and all the fraudsters exposed by the CIA/FBI/WTFwhogivesacrap?

No, thats not how it works matey.

That is what should have happened. It did occur with several major banks, and as far as I can ascertain nothing dodgy has been found. Some sysadmin would have found by now, they/we're nosey by nature.

Perhaps certain investors had heard of the events? Not the government, but individuals... who then used this knowledge when dealing in shares. I've read all the stuff people have written... but you can connect all sorts of innocent events and drag them into somethign bigger if you want.

I could construct a longer reply, but I'm tired as it is, I shall return in the morning though and see what has happened in the interim.

 

[Ascot]

Without getting into an argument. Some THEORIES are been discussed about the hitting of the North Tower how there was an explosion Before the aircraft hit. http://911physics.atspace.com/Pages/Boeing.htm <-- backup claim.

A Tri-jet might of been used since a distance gap on the top of the impact holes is seen. http://img154.echo.cx/img154/4222/sam18qd.jpg http://img154.echo.cx/img154/8774/sam20in.jpg
http://img100.echo.cx/img100/2841/wtc1gash5ns.jpg
Not my images, found them on 911 Made Simple.

An aircraft been crashed into the pentagon is 99% proven nowt hit it, look at the size of the hole, and why are there Sledge Hammers on the side??? A missle is possable, as noticed by others looking at the pic and pointed out of the burnt above the hole.
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/6048/p20003214bu.jpg

 

[Sprog]

Basically you're saying the back ups would have been retrieved and all the fraudsters exposed by the CIA/FBI/WTFwhogivesacrap?

No, thats not how it works matey.

If anything J, id say any backups would be taken and destroyed.

Just like the survailance tapes that captured the moment the Pentagon was hit by a 'Boeing 757' *cough* Missile *Cough*.

Within minutes of the impact, FBI agents confiscated all of the CCTV footage from cameras directed at the Pentagon (Hotel, Garage, Traffic cameras etc) and warned emplyess/witnesses not to discuss what they'd seen.

Again, its because they are all involved in some way or another.

Oh, and TC..

Al Qaeda claimed responsiblity 1) because twas a dig (a Hell of a dig!) at the 'Westerners', and 2), the 'confession' tape featuring Osama BinLadden is apprently a fake.

 

[Tom]

Everything these days is apparently a fake ... hehe

I have read one of the sites though and you can't disagree that there are always conspiracy theories.

 

[Ascot]

I guess money has been though the biggest need and greed for. Name anything that could of happened, the US got ALOT of money. Tapes have gone very quickly so something is been hidden. THey we're not normal hi-jacked aircraft that hit the towers. Unless ATC decided to just ignore them and not scramble any jets. THe 198 or so passengers are probably been given new id's in live and living a new style. Or they are shot. I feel sorry for the families as they are wondering if their son/daughter/husband/wife etc... is alive in XYZ or what not.

 

[AlexS]

Without getting into an argument. Some THEORIES are been discussed about the hitting of the North Tower how there was an explosion Before the aircraft hit. http://911physics.atspace.com/Pages/Boeing.htm <-- backup claim.

Sorry matey. That 'pod' is the landing gear bay. The author, being fairly clever actually, has chosen a different colour aircraft. This means that the shadows on the plane show up differently. The 'missile' as it appears, is in fact the crease where the wing and hydraulics systems join the main fuselage. The difference in colours mean that while the roundness on the black bottom United jet is apparent, on the white aircraft, it is infact not, and seems to be flat, as lighting is in a different position anyway.

 

[AlexS]

Oh, and if you look at these conspiracy theorists websites, you will usually find that they have authored a conspiracy for nearly every world event in their lifetimes. Caravan living crackpots with pirate radio station stereotypes if you askme.

 

[Ascot]

I see that but i don't get how the undercarrage extends out and surley if it's the speeds it's doing (well over 270KIAS the Gear ext speed correct me if i'm wrong) it would get ripped off. Something has extended on number 2 side of the a/c. Saying that the gear ent extended but one side differences from the other unless the light really is playing a trick.

 

[traveller1030]

BBC and ITV for example put out lots of different stuff. Television news, which I rarely see, differs: BBC will have quality reporting of the facts (though they are starting to be more populist now), whereas ITV will have whichever sensational story can get the most viewers. The BBC is meant to be totally free of bias whereas ITV is not. Don't beleive something just because it is on the news.

I know what iteration is...

Let us suppose that a rich banker wanted to get off the hook and decided to fly a plane into the World Trade Centre. Surely the Government would have picked up on this? Though I can see why they might want to blame it on Islamic terrorists, and where people have started their theories from. However flying a plane into a nearby building which might collapse and might just collapse in the right way to destroy some documents... is very far fetched.

I don't know if you've ever worked in system administration, but it is good practice to perform backups and put them offsite. This will especially be important in banking institutions, do you think the backup tapes are just put in the filing cabinet or something? They are usually taken to secure locations away from the main site. Hence should anything have happened to the hard disks on the machines in the WTC, the data should be on a backup tape elsewhere.

Spot on, but remember 9/11 was before Sarbanes-Oxley regulations (which are more strict on data retention, at least in the States IIRC), so off-siting may not have been as prevalent then as it is now.

As for the video, I haven't seen the one posted but I assume it supports the 'controlled demolition' theory, other videos I have seen with the 'pockets' of blasts that seem to implode the building. I'm starting to agree with one TN that there isn't a lot we can do about knowing the full truth, or getting it out there, but the many are starting to see beyond the deceptive hand of the few and will forge their own path. I just tend to ignore the Government since they seem to be a bunch of philandering soft-money grabbing mortgage fraudsters. Something your TV licence money won't pay for Auntie to tell you, even if it's the truth. As for the Beeb's agenda being purely to broadcast, far from it. The internal politics of the organisation itself tell you different, and being a R4 stalwart you must have heard of James Naughtie's slip on Today a while back referring to the Labour party with a royal 'we', to which I turned off in d.isgust (at least define your smilies with m: or something to differentiate from the actual word, mod team!). If anything certain elements of the BBC have a quasi-Soviet agenda which has the ability to peddle far more rogue-statism than even Bliar has managed.

Osama Bin Laden died of kidney failure in 2001, according to certain sources - similarly to how this tape was perhaps 'knocked up' do you not thing it is beyond our own intelligence services to do this kind of thing as we see pop up on our TV screens from time to time? A modern-day Emmanuel Goldstein if ever I saw one (I assume you have read Nineteen Eighty-Four Tom, if not I suggest you do to get a handle on the thinking behind Bush/Cheney/Capitalism's 'Long War', 'full spectrum dominance' and 'information warfare'), and I'm not willing to play to the tune of a Winston Smith.

Keep an open mind, remember yours and your nearest and dearests' well-being and happiness comes before any seeking of 'the truth' (in a big picture sense), be honest and true to yourself and you will find the path to enlightenment - well, that's taking it a bit far but free-thinkers are far more entertaining than Beeboid/media-driven dullards, in my experience.
Edited (by doublepost prevention system):

THey we're not normal hi-jacked aircraft that hit the towers. Unless ATC decided to just ignore them and not scramble any jets.

NORAD decided not to scramble jets once it had deviated from its expected flightpath, if I remember the reportage correctly. A fatal error caused by complacency or complicit action with the 'objective', I know not.

 

[Sprog]

NORAD decided not to scramble jets once it had deviated from its expected flightpath, if I remember the reportage correctly. A fatal error caused by complacency or complicit action with the 'objective', I know not.

Plus the fact that convieniantly, a huge group of the USAF fighers had fecked off thousands of nautical miles away on a 'training mission'. This left 14 F-16s to cover the whole of the US.

Also, apparently NORAD where very busy anyway with a series of complicated training excercises etc, so they where probably rushed off their feet, again, very convieniantly....

 

[AlexS]

The fact that Fighters were on a training mission doesn't alter the fact that there were mission capable fighters at Edwards Air Force base that were eventually scrambled a wee bit late.

 

[Tom B]

Plus the fact that convieniantly, a huge group of the USAF fighers had fecked off thousands of nautical miles away on a 'training mission'. This left 14 F-16s to cover the whole of the US.

Also, apparently NORAD where very busy anyway with a series of complicated training excercises etc, so they where probably rushed off their feet, again, very convieniantly....

So you think that there shouldn't be any training exercises in case there's a terrorist attack? In which case they'll be totally unprepared for the attack as they've never been trained...

 

[Sprog]

*sighs*

Again - stop already with the picking and choosing - im saying that it seems very interesting that the USAF/NORAD had intensive training missions etc, on that particular day.

Never said anything about them not being allowed to do training did i..? :?

You see, this is yet another wonderfull co-incidence, out of the many ive already listed!

Theres alot of co-incidences isnt there....

 

[Tom B]

Why? Should all military training schedulers be equipped with TARDISes so they can check that nothing happened on the day they want to plan a training flight?

 

[richa2002]

Look Sprog, I personally found the documentary very interesting and for me cast a whole new light on the events of 9/11. Some of the things mentioned are in my opinion too very odd. It's just a shame that the US government think they can keep all inside workings a complete secret from the world. If only they had a freedom of information act

However, can we calm it down guys? I've had to delete what I percieve to be a completely ridiculous post considering the warnings from my colleagues. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but just stop the flaming!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_information_act
They do!

 

[Techniquest]

...

How can I submit in words a reply suitable for this thread?...

*Sits staring at screen in thought with 450045 staring back*

I know...No I don't...Oh yes I do:

No-one knows what happened precisely. No-one will ever know the full answers. Everyone can come up with ideas. Everyone can come up with something related to any terrorist attack or other conspiracy ever conceived. I could do the same for why both the 0042 and 0105 from Waterloo never go as booked via Point Pleasant Junction to Wimbledon. Could it be terrorists? A lack of suitable rolling stock? Lack of drivers up for the job? Signallers not wanting to put the services that way?

As you can see, for just a routing of a rail service you could come up with anything for why it doesn't go the way you want it to. Both times I've been to London to do the route, it pulls into platform 11 at Clapham Junction, which is not on the line suitable for reaching Point Pleasant Junction. The 0105 did last time start off as calling at platform 6 at Clapham Junction, but then got changed to platform 11. Rude!

What I'm getting at is that this entire thread and the videos linked to (which I refuse to watch for several reasons) is a whole lot of BS. And no, that's not an abbreviation for Bescot Stadium either...I'm not taking either side in this argument, preferring to stay neutral as this is something that doesn't interest me. I recognise people want to know what happened because their relatives or friends or colleagues died in the tradegy, but nothing in this thread can or will convince me that there is some deep, horrifying government cover-up on this.

As for the discussion on the BBC/ITV, both are as bad as each other. News-wise the BBC sucks more than it ever has done, ITV seeming to have a mindset along the lines of 'If they suck, we have to suck even more!'. None of it is even news really anymore. In fact, the only two bits of news I've seen anywhere on the BBC that was interesting to me at all was about the Metro being confirmed as hoping to be built in the next few years to Brierley Hill as previously hoped and not just Five Ways as the news has previously reported, the other bit being on the BBC News website about Dukes Travel, a bus company down this way, sort of, being taken over by Stagecoach in Wye and Dean. I've found no news on the ITV news, TV or internet, worth reading or hearing. It is this channel's news that annoys me in the way the presenters are always shown before the news is actually on in a way they have something urgent to say, but is something completely stupid, or something.

All that said, I don't like TV much anyway. Or news, or radio, or newspapers, or journalism (something my uni friends, especially the one doing the media course, found out quite quickly!). With newspapers, I just hate the red-tops (The Sun, Daily Mirror, etc), as I've heard them described recently. Third-class, conspiracy, full-of-****-celebrity 'news', with an appaling manner used in terms of formatting and decency. Something like The Times I can get on with, in that the journalists in that aren't focussed entirely on stalking celebrities so they can report in the morning that they went to the lavatory wearing several layers of 'bling' (and I put that word in like that because I just can't stand the word!) at 10:23:32pm, leaving 2 minutes later to go out sporting some brand name in huge letters all over their clothing to get drunk to the extent they can't stand up, let alone get home. Then of course there's the Daily Express and Daily Mail...Good Heavens, how anyone on God's green Earth can read them, let alone supporting their need to tear down trees to make paper for their 'newspaper' which is full of useless and terrible journalism that its only useful purpose is lavatory paper.

Anyway, that's a mere handful of words and thoughts about news. I'll finish by saying that this entire thread should have been locked by now, more so page 2. Why it was allowed to continue I don't know. Maybe you were waiting for me to return to the forum and post my views? Might have been that you could not lock it because you wanted to continue arguments? Are terrorists at TC's house waiting for me to reply angrily to this thread before he locks it, threatening to shoot out the servers and him if I don't do so soon?

Note how easy it is to make a conspiracy out of anything simple. I'm not being serious there at all, I'm merely saying that it can be done without any thought (except those red-top readers perhaps). But it should be locked now really, certainly before it gets too far out of hand (or has it already? Reading the thread right through, it looks like it might be too late for that).

Thus primarily concludes the late-running previous week's weekly Sunday rant. This does not constitute the end of this end full stop. This post's author reserves the right to the view stated above. Said author also reserves the right to add to this rant at a later time or date without prior warning.

Regards,
WSXFan.