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Abellio wins West Midlands franchise

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All Line Rover

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According to the second bullet point on page 4 of that document, the 06.56 from Long Buckby / 07.16 from Northampton (which runs non-stop from Northampton to Euston, arriving at 08.05) is being withdrawn, with the 07.38 Bletchley to Euston (arriving at 08.33) being extended to depart Northampton at 07.16, calling at Milton Keynes* in addition to various stations south of Bletchley, even Harrow (*which would be of no benefit to Milton Keynes passengers, as there is already a 07.31 departure which arrives in Euston at 08.12).

Is this true? With the only other non-stop LNR service from Long Buckby / Northampton to Euston being the 07.11 / 07.42 arriving at 08.28, this would mean that Northampton would lose half of its non-stop services, with the 07.16 being overtaken by the 07.42. That's appalling, if true.
 
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Bletchleyite

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Demand from MKC is so high I cannot see any case for running any train from Northampton fast through it. Indeed, were it my choice, I'd add Wolverton to them all as well. (I recognise that for pathing reasons you can't also add Bletchley).

Though extending that train back to Northampton is bizarre, as it's not a replacement - people will choose other fast trains, not be happy arriving at Euston well after 0830. Just add an MKC stop to the fast one. Indeed, being Bletchley based, that train would seem an obvious one to run a pair of the forthcoming extra 319s on. (It's presently Desiros, the 0711 from Bletchley is 319s).

(That said, the doc mentions 12-car 319 formations, so maybe there won't be more diagrams, just longer formations?)
 

sd0733

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The station repainting programme has continued onto lnwr stations. Acton Bridge is now fully green when I passed through earlier.
 

DJames

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I noticed yesterday that they'd finally got around to painting the top halves of the lampposts at Wolverhampton, it looks a lot nicer now compared to having half of them in a faded red, and half in fresh paint.
 

causton

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Indeed, being Bletchley based, that train would seem an obvious one to run a pair of the forthcoming extra 319s on. (It's presently Desiros, the 0711 from Bletchley is 319s).

They already thought of that ;)

(The 0738 and an evening train are actually showing as timed for 321s in RTT (hear me out, that alone means nothing, I know...) and in the long term unit diagrams for May - December 2018, are booked for 319s... I presume lack of availability of them is why, every week they are being changed back to 350s though.)
 

Idon'tKnow

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"The existing 05:21 (SX) Crewe-Euston (0805 arrival) runs later at 05:47 and is amended to run via Weedon non-stop to Euston, and ceasing to run via Northampton."

Wow, something is finally being done to reduce the 1 hour 49 minute gap in the morning peak on the Trent valley line. Bravo!
(By my crude calculations, the gap will be reduced by at least 15 minutes)
 

pt_mad

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Both seem to be a hangover from the original plans. This is from Centro in 2016, clearly showing both Stone and Penkridge as WMR stations, though under the assumption that they would only be served by WMR trains. Essentially, it paints only the Trent Valley stations and everything south of Rugby as LNR (or here, WCSBU) stations and everything else as WMR. This doesn't fit the current setup.

It's a little reminiscent of the Water Orton/Wilnecote/Coleshill Parkway problem, all of which were LM stations and will be (based on the map) WMR stations, despite being served purely by a longer distance operator (in this case Cross Country), though of course this is explained by XC not operating any stations.

Edit: of note, on the linked map, Tile Hill, Canley et al. are WMR (well, WMSBU) stations despite not being served by WMR. There seems to be a clear differentiation between LNR services *not* serving Brum and those serving Brum (and extending through, as recently). If a station is only on a route that serves Birmingham, it's a WMR station, even if the trains that serve it aren't WMR services. Bleh.

Could it be because Stone council is part of the West Midlands Combined Authority? I.e. West Midlands Rail? And so presumably they'd want their station in the devolved branding. Could be the same case for Penkridge and others at a guess.
 

Dr Strider

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Looking at the TA application there are some interesting things in the "West Midlands Inter-Urban" section of(Birmingham to Crewe, Shrewsbury etc.).

Reading it, it appears that the new Birmingham-Stoke-Crewe service is an additional express every hour, and not the extension of the stopper that was originally mooted. If so, the path appears to have been found by routing the new additional Birmingham-Shrewsbury via Proof House and Bescot. It specifically mentions the Derby lines, so perhaps there is a bit of slack around the higher-number platforms at New Street.

It says that the routing of the Shrewsbury service is to enable calls at Willenhall and Darlaston when they open. I assumed they would be served by extending Walsall stoppers to Wolverhampton, clearly not.

Good to see that they are going to try for 110 mph running on one or both of the Liverpool services.

Dr Strider
 

pt_mad

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"The existing 05:21 (SX) Crewe-Euston (0805 arrival) runs later at 05:47 and is amended to run via Weedon non-stop to Euston, and ceasing to run via Northampton."

Wow, something is finally being done to reduce the 1 hour 49 minute gap in the morning peak on the Trent valley line. Bravo!
(By my crude calculations, the gap will be reduced by at least 15 minutes)

Guessing this will give Virgin some stiff competition. As this working becomes fast via Weedon and starts closer to the main commuter peak. Expect this to be a very popular train. Can see quite a few awaiting to LNR as the time penalty Vs VT won't be all that bad Vs the cost.

What we don't know is whether they will make all of them or some or just a few 8 cars on the Crewe Euston via Trent route.
 
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Idon'tKnow

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Guessing this will give Virgin some stiff competition. As this working becomes fast via Weedon and starts closer to the main commuter peak. Expect this to be a very popular train. Can see quite a few awaiting to LNR as the time penalty Vs VT won't be all that bad Vs the cost.

What we don't know is whether they will make all of them or some or just a few 8 cars on the Crewe Euston via Trent route.

As an estimate, if it runs 26 minutes later throughout, it'd leave Lichfield TV at 0635, and Tamworth at 0642, so would still unfortunately be overtaken by the 0513 Lancaster - Euston Virgin service (0641 Lichfield TV and 0648 Tamworth departures). However, a 90 minute (83 from Tamworth) journey time southbound seems really good for an LNR service.

Would 12 carriage trains be possible from December? Or does unit deselect not allow 8 out of 12 coaches to be locked out at stations such as Atherstone?
 

STKKK46

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UDS can only lock out 4 carriages. LNWR could do a bit of a rearrange and use 12 at Crewe. However I expect this would throw their unit diagrams out quite substantially.

I think it’ll be a case of enjoy the 8 cars, because you won’t be getting 12 on that route.
 

SeanM1997

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How I read this. At Crewe:
Platform 3 - Crewe-Stoke-Birmingham-Northampton-London
Platform 7 - Crewe-Stafford-Trent Valley-London
The 2 hourly Crewe-Shrewsbury stopping shifts to Platform 8
Platform 5 - Liverpool-Crewe-Birmingham
Platform 11 - Birmingham-Crewe-Liverpool

What I would like to know is, is the Liverpool-Crewe-Birmingham being extended. One to Birmingham International and one to London Euston via Northampton?
 

SeanM1997

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I think that's right.

That would leave Crewe with 7 trains an hour to London:
1 Virgin Non Stop
1 Virgin Stafford Only
1 Virgin Milton Keynes Only
1 Virgin via Birmingham
1 LNWR via Trent Valley
1 LNWR via Stoke, Birmingham and Northampton
1 LNWR via Birmingham and Northampton

Think that makes Crewe the furthest station from London with such a high frequency of service
 

setdown

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I think that's right.

Unless I'm reading the document wrong, isn't only one train a day going to run direct from Liverpool to Euston?

ORR Document Birmingham New Street – Liverpool Lime St section said:
Existing xx.36 SX and SO services from Birmingham New St will use the existing xx:33 arrivals at Birmingham New St from Birmingham International, also using 110mph rolling stock. In addition to reducing journey times between Birmingham and Liverpool this will therefore also provide throughjourney opportunities from Birmingham International to Liverpool.

Additionally the 06:49 (SX and SO) Crewe – Euston (via Birmingham New St) service will start back from Liverpool Lime St at 06:10, providing an earlier journey opportunity between Liverpool and Birmingham
 

hawk1911

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I knew I shouldn't have expected too much regarding the promise of later services. The document suggests the last train from Birmingham New Street to Stafford will leave New Street at 23:10 instead of 23:09. Whoopee do!
 

ForTheLoveOf

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I knew I shouldn't have expected too much regarding the promise of later services. The document suggests the last train from Birmingham New Street to Stafford will leave New Street at 23:10 instead of 23:09. Whoopee do!
Yes - this is very poor considering the population of the West Midlands and Stafford. Stafford could definitely do with significantly later last services. The service from London Euston - last train leaving 22:00 - is just about acceptable, though still not great.
 

Bletchleyite

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Yes - this is very poor considering the population of the West Midlands and Stafford. Stafford could definitely do with significantly later last services. The service from London Euston - last train leaving 22:00 - is just about acceptable, though still not great.

It would be good to get a 23xx on all the WCML branches (including the mainline as far as Preston) - that's one for the WCP/HS2 franchise, though.
 

sd0733

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How I read this. At Crewe:
Platform 3 - Crewe-Stoke-Birmingham-Northampton-London
Platform 7 - Crewe-Stafford-Trent Valley-London
The 2 hourly Crewe-Shrewsbury stopping shifts to Platform 8
Platform 5 - Liverpool-Crewe-Birmingham
Platform 11 - Birmingham-Crewe-Liverpool

What I would like to know is, is the Liverpool-Crewe-Birmingham being extended. One to Birmingham International and one to London Euston via Northampton?

If I'm reading the document linked to further up this thread correctly that was the original plan but now been replaced with something different.

Crewe will see
1tph Crewe to Birmingham via Stoke,
1tph Crewe to London via Tamworth
1tpd Liverpool to London via Birmingham
1tph Liverpool to Birmingham New Street
1tph Liverpool to Birmingham International
 

lammergeier

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Yes - this is very poor considering the population of the West Midlands and Stafford. Stafford could definitely do with significantly later last services. The service from London Euston - last train leaving 22:00 - is just about acceptable, though still not great.
Not to mention Birmingham council has just this week announced a pollution/congestion charging scheme to begin in 2020. I don't necessarily have a problem with these schemes but the public transport has to be good enough to justify it, and I don't personally think that Birmingham's is currently.
 

pt_mad

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If I'm reading the document linked to further up this thread correctly that was the original plan but now been replaced with something different.

Crewe will see
1tph Crewe to Birmingham via Stoke,
1tph Crewe to London via Tamworth
1tpd Liverpool to London via Birmingham
1tph Liverpool to Birmingham New Street
1tph Liverpool to Birmingham International

But isn't the first one mentioned here (Crewe to Birmingham via Stoke) going to be a Crewe to Euston via Stoke and Birmingham I thought?

And do we know whether one Liverpool to Birmingham per hour will go through to London, and the other to Birmingham International?
 

STKKK46

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Nope, can definitely lock out 8 of 12 leaving 4 open, I've seen it done when a Euston train was routed (exceptionally due to a points failure - may well be the only time it has ever happened) into Bletchley P6.

Ah, you may be correct it can be done. I just know in normal practice it can’t be as the conductor can only lock out one set at a time. Maybe with 5 minute dwells it’d be doable!
 

setdown

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But isn't the first one mentioned here (Crewe to Birmingham via Stoke) going to be a Crewe to Euston via Stoke and Birmingham I thought?

And do we know whether one Liverpool to Birmingham per hour will go through to London, and the other to Birmingham International?

The document linked above only mentions one train per day from Liverpool to Euston. Looking at the detail it goes into for other services, it looks like that may be it.

It also says 1tph from Liverpool will go to New Street, and 1tph from Liverpool will go to Birmingham International. I can’t see a third regular train running from Liverpool.
 

Bletchleyite

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Ah, you may be correct it can be done. I just know in normal practice it can’t be as the conductor can only lock out one set at a time. Maybe with 5 minute dwells it’d be doable!

Yes, it wouldn't be normal practice as you'd need really long dwells. As this was unexpected (may well be the only time it has ever happened) it stayed there for a while.

The way UDS works is that the guard uses the front cab at the front of the last unit that *isn't* to be released. So in a 12-car if you use the third cab back you can lock out all but the front 4.
 
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