Advice on what new car to buy.

[DustyBin]

Skoda Octavias are also very reliable "old fashioned" saloon style cars. There's a reason they're very popular with taxi and private hire companies.

The reason is that they are cheap to finance. Like most VAG products they have a habit of going wrong once out of warranty.

 

[The Ham]

The reason is that they are cheap to finance. Like most VAG products they have a habit of going wrong once out of warranty.

I've owned a few VAG cars and the things which lead to us changing them were due to annoyances after many years of ownership. For instance my Leon (Y) it's CD auto chamber stopped working as did the ability to fold down one of the rear seats.

The reason for changing my Fabia (2008) was down to having children (the annoyance wasn't the children, but rather it being a little too small - especially when going camping) although that's still going strong as my sister has it now. Whilst my Mother-in-law has a Fabia Estate (brought a little after ours and I think a little newer than ours, but not by much) which is still going strong.

 

[DustyBin]

I've owned a few VAG cars and the things which lead to us changing them were due to annoyances after many years of ownership. For instance my Leon (Y) it's CD auto chamber stopped working as did the ability to fold down one of the rear seats.

The reason for changing my Fabia (2008) was down to having children (the annoyance wasn't the children, but rather it being a little too small - especially when going camping) although that's still going strong as my sister has it now. Whilst my Mother-in-law has a Fabia Estate (brought a little after ours and I think a little newer than ours, but not by much) which is still going strong.

To be fair there’s good and bad from all manufacturers and my anti-VAG bias may have came through there! My own experience of VAG has been reasonably high end Audis as company cars (A4 and A6) and they all had issues beyond normal wear and tear. Mind you my colleague’s 5 Series suffered a total engine failure (it was a known issue with them). When they’re under warranty or leased it’s somebody else’s problem to fix, but I’d personally not want one at 5/6 years old. There may well be some models across the range that are bomb proof, but I suspect as you’ve found it’s the relatively no-frills Fabias etc. as opposed to the higher end stuff.

 

[ChrisC]

If you enable Waze or Google Maps when you have a signal, it will download the route (and roads adjacent to it) so you don't lose it if you lose signal. It is a bit annoying if you need to start out of signal, though.

Thanks, that really makes sense. I’d just noticed it happen when I had not actually set a route but was driving around country lanes with SatNav on to generally have a map view on the screen of where I was. It just made me think that it wasn’t a lot of use in remote areas.

 

[bspahh]

Thanks, that really makes sense. I’d just noticed it happen when I had not actually set a route but was driving around country lanes with SatNav on to generally have a map view on the screen of where I was. It just made me think that it wasn’t a lot of use in remote areas.

With Google Maps, you can download maps for a region to use offline. You can then use these to set up new routes, although obviously you won't get traffic updates, unless you have an Internet connection.

I used to use CoPilot on my phone, where I had maps for Europe on a 1GB SD card. I first used it on Windows Mobile, and then on Android from 2010, when that was quite a lot of data. The detail varied. In the UK, it had pretty much all roads. For the Republic of Ireland, it didn't have some of the small lanes. However, it let me plan a route from the UK to Vladivostok. Now with data from open streetmaps, you can probably get a pretty cheap SatNav with offline maps.

My advice for buying a second hand car is to try and find one where it is being sold for a good reason, and not because it has an annoying or expensive issue.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Thanks, that really makes sense. I’d just noticed it happen when I had not actually set a route but was driving around country lanes with SatNav on to generally have a map view on the screen of where I was. It just made me think that it wasn’t a lot of use in remote areas.

I find it's always worth putting a route in when driving in an unfamiliar area, as it'll route me round any traffic or road closures, and as mentioned it downloads the route.

I used Copilot in the past but I found it not as good as Waze. Waze is also far better than the built in Google Maps navigation - given that Google owned shares in it at one point I'm surprised they didn't incorporate it.

 

[A0wen]

Are there any car experts on this forum? Or anyone who knows about cars?

My current car is now well over thirty years old (in fact i think in a few years it will reach fourty years old) and it is in a terrible state and really needs replacing. I have used it every day since i bought it brand new over well over thirty years ago and it is so worn out now and constantly develops issues and i have to take it to the garage all the time. So i am now looking for a brand new car to buy.

However the thing that puts me off is that i do not like any of these modern cars. They are to complicating and have too many features and controls and touchscreens and electrics and automated driving and all other sorts of things that cars never used to have. My current car is so basic and simple. Cars these days are just too complicating.

So my question is which brand new car is the most basic simple car i can buy. I want a brand new car but preferably i want it to be as basic and simple as possible with the absolute minimal amount of features and controls with none of these touchscreens or lots of added features or any unnecessary things. I am basically looking for the most basic simple brand new car that is sold nowadays.

It needs to be a manual transmission. I need it to be a petrol or diesel as i do not really want to switch an electric car yet. And i most certainly do not want any car that is capable of driving automatically. I do not trust any automated cars like these Tesla i think they are called or anything like that.

So can anyone give me any recommendations? Is anyone on here good with cars? What is the most basic simple cars that you can buy these days? Any help or recommendations would be great to hear as i am no expert when it comes to cars?

Without knowing the size car you want, your budget or how you use your car it's a bit difficult to say. So we'll look at generalities:

As a private motorist, presumably you want reliability, low running costs etc - the obvious candidates (as mentioned by others) are the Koreans - so Kia or Hyundai. Very much doing what the Japanese did 30 years ago, building safe, reliable cars with good warranties and reasonable pricing. For an undemanding private motorist they're difficult to find fault with. If you don't fancy one of them then look at Toyota or Honda - again pretty much bulletproof reliability though usually a bit more expensive than the Kia / Hyundai. If none of those then I'd tend to recommend a Ford over most other things (including pretty much all (Volkswagen Audi Group) VAG products) - there are always plenty to choose from, their reliability is noticeably better than VAG and their ubiquity means pretty much any garage up and down the land can fix them with parts prices being much cheaper than VAG.

Belts are fine, they’re generally easy to change it’s just that in the case of the 1.0 EcoBoost they’re a pain. There have been plenty of chain driven engines with issues, Vauxhall’s 1.0 Ecotec was/is notorious for early chain failure (I’ve seen thicker chains around peoples necks!).

Easy to change for a mechanic yes, but with a bill of £ 300 - 600 for doing so, means it is an unnecessary cost at 5-6 years old.

The worst culprit for failing timing chains was, once again VW with masses of problems on the 1.2TSI engine, such that they modified it to being a belt cam - thereby giving their customers a nice £ 500 bill for future replacement.

The original argument for belts over chains is it made engines quieter - the reality is chains tend to last the life of the engine where belts don't and where engines aren't well designed a cambelt failure can write of an engine - Ford CVHs being a prime offender in the past.

It's interesting that the Japanese and Koreans have tended to stick with timing chains and the Europeans gone for belt cams - especially given the Japanese and Koreans cars are much more reliable as well.

 

[jfollows]

I hate cambelts. Chain-driven engines are far better, no need to change that in the average car's life. It's very much a "buy cheap, buy twice" type issue in a way.

I hate them on "interference engines" which are increasingly common, because they're more efficient, in which if the cambelt breaks when the car is in motion the valves hit the pistons.

My second car (X-reg Ford Escort 1.3) I bought from a friend and it was a non-interference engine, he had the cam belt break on him and the car simply coasted to a stop, he then had the belt replaced.

My third car was a Ford Capri 2.8 with no belt, one less thing to worry about!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I hate them on "interference engines" which are increasingly common, because they're more efficient, in which if the cambelt breaks when the car is in motion the valves hit the pistons.

Yes, true. My point is that there should never be a consumable that isn't user checkable that, if it fails, will effectively write off the car. That's a design flaw.

 

[Grumpy Git]

It's no so much a problem having a cam belt engine (over a chain). It's when you have to strip-doen half the car to replace it where the problem lies. Much like some bulb replacements on certain cars nowadays.

 

[A0wen]

I hate them on "interference engines" which are increasingly common, because they're more efficient, in which if the cambelt breaks when the car is in motion the valves hit the pistons.

My second car (X-reg Ford Escort 1.3) I bought from a friend and it was a non-interference engine, he had the cam belt break on him and the car simply coasted to a stop, he then had the belt replaced.

My third car was a Ford Capri 2.8 with no belt, one less thing to worry about!

You were lucky - the CVHs (which a 1.3 Escort would have had) tended to bend the valves if the cambelt failed - the CVH wasn't a "non-interference" engine. The Vauxhall 1.3 OHC which was in the Astras of that age were non intereference and didn't do that - they were also a much nicer engine, quieter and much, much more muscular to drive.

It's no so much a problem having a cam belt engine (over a chain). It's when you have to strip-doen half the car to replace it where the problem lies. Much like some bulb replacements on certain cars nowadays.

The designers should be shot.

Going OT - but quite agree. The best example I heard of was the (I think ) Mk2 Renault Laguna which requires removal of the front wing to get at the headlight bulb. The ultimately irony of that is it is a legal requirement to carry spare bulbs in your car in France so you can replace a blown bulb ! Nice bit of design there by one of France's finest.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's no so much a problem having a cam belt engine (over a chain). It's when you have to strip-doen half the car to replace it where the problem lies. Much like some bulb replacements on certain cars nowadays.

The designers should be shot.

Chains are designed to last the life of the car. If they don't that's a design fault.

A belt has a problem, as I said, because it's a non-checkable consumable with catastrophic results from a failure. That's a design fault. My mind will not change on this - the whole idea is ludicrous.

Anyway, the ICE is on the way out, so I suppose it doesn't matter.

 

[A0wen]

Chains are designed to last the life of the car. If they don't that's a design fault.

Not quite - a design fault would be a high proportion of the chains failing prematurely due to a design failure e.g. the VW TSI ones.

Some years back my dad had a Saab 9000 which at about 110,000 had a chain cam failure - something which was considered a very rare occurrence by the Saab dealers. Not sure I'd have said a chain failure at that kind of mileage was a "design fault" - it could just as easily be a material failing which on 100 other chains would never happen.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not quite - a design fault would be a high proportion of the chains failing prematurely due to a design failure e.g. the VW TSI ones.

Yes, I more meant that.

 

[jfollows]

You were lucky - the CVHs (which a 1.3 Escort would have had) tended to bend the valves if the cambelt failed - the CVH wasn't a "non-interference" engine. The Vauxhall 1.3 OHC which was in the Astras of that age were non intereference and didn't do that - they were also a much nicer engine, quieter and much, much more muscular to drive.

Thank you, interesting, and getting completely off the original topic I know, but I learned something today so that's good. Yes, the engine was noisy and unpleasant and the car was boring but reliable. I replaced it after 6 months with a Capri 2.8 (A890 OPO for some reason I remember) and was much happier, albeit poorer!

 

[Ediswan]

Going OT - but quite agree. The best example I heard of was the (I think ) Mk2 Renault Laguna which requires removal of the front wing to get at the headlight bulb. The ultimately irony of that is it is a legal requirement to carry spare bulbs in your car in France so you can replace a blown bulb ! Nice bit of design there by one of France's finest.

I believe this is a myth, but based on a truth. French police can issue on-the-spot fines for faulty lights. However, you are likely to escape the fine if you have a spare and can fix the problem there and then. The net result is much the same, it is wise to carry spares. I have no idea how the French police cope under the circumstances you describe.

 

[DustyBin]

Chains are designed to last the life of the car. If they don't that's a design fault.

A belt has a problem, as I said, because it's a non-checkable consumable with catastrophic results from a failure. That's a design fault. My mind will not change on this - the whole idea is ludicrous.

Anyway, the ICE is on the way out, so I suppose it doesn't matter.

It’s worth noting that tensioners can and do fail on both belt and chain driven engines; it’s not always the belt or chain itself that’s the issue. I’m a big fan of chains as they are generally maintenance free as you say but belts are perfectly adequate; it’s certainly not something I consider when buying a car.

I hate them on "interference engines" which are increasingly common, because they're more efficient, in which if the cambelt breaks when the car is in motion the valves hit the pistons.

My second car (X-reg Ford Escort 1.3) I bought from a friend and it was a non-interference engine, he had the cam belt break on him and the car simply coasted to a stop, he then had the belt replaced.

My third car was a Ford Capri 2.8 with no belt, one less thing to worry about!

Good choice!

Despite having no belt (or chain) to worry about there was still an issue with the Cologne V6 as Ford used a fibre timing gear which could disintegrate. The fibre material reduced engine noise but fortunately there were/are steel (and even alloy) replacements available. I have an XR4i with such a steel gear as it happens.

 

[Snow1964]

If you want a car that is easy to maintain at home then need to be looking at ones at least 12-15 years old before multiplex wiring and euro6 emissions monitoring became the norm, there are some models where the old technology survived few more years until model got discontinued.

2 or 3 years ago you could pick up some fairly basic models, virtually new for £8-9k. Cars like Dacia Sandero, Suzuki Celerio, Fiat Panda etc. Also was some city cars like Citroen C1, Skoda Citigo, Hyundai I10, Kia Picanto all available under 1 year old for under £10k

However prices have jumped due to lack of new cars, and secondhand prices are also up as getting hold of a new car quickly is difficult. Dacia used to sell the previous version of Sandero from £7995, now their cheapest is over £11k

One thing the Op could do is check the car manufacturers websites, some have extended test drives (although often need to search for test drive to find the page) where you can try the car. Or simply book a drive in a demonstrator to get feel of modern car (these are usually fairly high spec with options to entice you). But of course can always say not for you and walk away.

 

[david1212]

If you want a car that is easy to maintain at home then need to be looking at ones at least 12-15 years old before multiplex wiring and euro6 emissions monitoring became the norm, there are some models where the old technology survived few more years until model got discontinued.

2 or 3 years ago you could pick up some fairly basic models, virtually new for £8-9k. Cars like Dacia Sandero, Suzuki Celerio, Fiat Panda etc. Also was some city cars like Citroen C1, Skoda Citigo, Hyundai I10, Kia Picanto all available under 1 year old for under £10k

However prices have jumped due to lack of new cars, and secondhand prices are also up as getting hold of a new car quickly is difficult. Dacia used to sell the previous version of Sandero from £7995, now their cheapest is over £11k

Being able to do even basic servicing and simple repairs at home or even have done by your local one or two person band garage is rapidly coming to an end. To justify the diagnostic equipment sufficient of each brand / family have to pass though per year.

It is unfortunate the OP needs to buy now rather than 2+ years ago.

Going back my plan was to change early 2021. However realising I would need to spend soon instead I changed Christmas 2019. I paid less than £10k for a Skoda Rapid 1.0 SE Tech, so not poverty spec, not quite 12 months old hence over 2 years factory warranty remaining. A Ford Focus 1.0 slightly older and mid-range spec would have been £2.5 / £3k more. A very quick look now shows a sub 20k miles 20 plate Focus will be at least £18k. I sold my then current car to a local used only trader rather than px. As things turned out a fortuitous move.

 

[dgl]

One thing I will say regarding at home servicing, whilst I wouldn't necessarily buy a modern Nissan due to the dodgy Renault bit's in a lot of them they do sell all the service items on their website, filters, oil, seals/drain plug Etc. So getting the parts to service a modern Nissan is no issue.

 

[jfollows]

A Volkswagen polo will still have touchscreens.

Personally I'd get a Ford Fiesta over a Polo.

Today's Sunday Times Magazine has a review of the VW Polo. It essentially says "solid choice" and, although littered with technology which I also think is useless, apparently works well. Apart from touch-sensitive switches on the steering wheel which are silly. 79, 94, 109bhp 1L petrol with manual. Not my sort of car but may meet the OP's requirements somewhat.

 

[DustyBin]

One thing I will say regarding at home servicing, whilst I wouldn't necessarily buy a modern Nissan due to the dodgy Renault bit's in a lot of them they do sell all the service items on their website, filters, oil, seals/drain plug Etc. So getting the parts to service a modern Nissan is no issue.

The same applies to Ford (or you can get everything from your local dealership). In fact I imagine it’s the same with all manufacturers. I don’t tend to get my hands dirty when it comes to our modern cars as I really don’t have time but during lockdown I serviced my Focus and our two Fiestas. In the case of one of the Fiestas (MK8 ST) it requires a plug change every other service so I saved a fair amount doing that one myself as the labour charged by Ford is rather excessive.

I’m not your average home mechanic but at the same time if you’re practical and have the confidence it’s not rocket science to change oil and filters (the cabin filter is generally the most challenging!).

 

[birchesgreen]

I am also looking at a new car to replace my 16 year old Fiesta. I know what the OP means about the difference in tech now, a couple of years ago i drove a brand new hire Fiesta for a day, it was like going from a biplane to a jet fighter! I think it will be something you will get used to in the end though, or just ignore as needed.

I'm looking at either a Sandero or a Panda.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The likes of Kwik Fit are often cheaper than buying the bits. And contrary to popular belief you are not required to use main dealers as it was deemed anticompetitive.

 

[jfollows]

I had a hire car once which the previous hirer (presumably) had set to Russian, it was full of touch-screens and technology. I couldn't be bothered to work out how to switch it back to English because, guess what, this button will have been in Russian too, and it turned out it was entirely useless gimmickry.
Car manufacturers seem incented to introduce toys in their cars which are just silly, in case they become the "thing to have" for their competition. Occasionally they're useful and last the course and become standard equipment.

 

[cactustwirly]

The likes of Kwik Fit are often cheaper than buying the bits. And contrary to popular belief you are not required to use main dealers as it was deemed anticompetitive.

Yes but they are highly likely to rip you off for something that doesn't need doing, or do a poor job.

 

[Non Multi]

I had a hire car once which the previous hirer (presumably) had set to Russian, it was full of touch-screens and technology. I couldn't be bothered to work out how to switch it back to English because, guess what, this button will have been in Russian too, and it turned out it was entirely useless gimmickry.

I use the Google Lens app on my smartphone to auto-translate languages in those scenarios.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes but they are highly likely to rip you off for something that doesn't need doing, or do a poor job.

Never had either at Bletchley and I have been using them for about 15 years now.

They are franchised so can be variable, but so can all garages.

 

[jfollows]

I use KwikFit in Wilmslow and they're good too.

My partner found that his main dealer was more keen on ripping him off with unnecessary work, so he dumped them.

I was in KwikFit once and someone came in off the street and described his car problem and asked if he could bring it in to be looked at; "no need" said the chap and quickly described what the problem was and the simple solution (I've totally forgotten what this was now) so the motorist went away happy.

On the other hand, I once went to a Jaguar garage looking to buy a car but they didn't take me seriously, perhaps because I was wearing shorts, and in the end I spent a lot of money (more than the cost of my first house) with another garage.

 

[DustyBin]

The likes of Kwik Fit are often cheaper than buying the bits. And contrary to popular belief you are not required to use main dealers as it was deemed anticompetitive.

They need to use genuine parts though, which they won’t.

Yes but they are highly likely to rip you off for something that doesn't need doing, or do a poor job.

I literally wouldn’t let them check my tyre pressures!