Air bridges with European countries given "green light"

island

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I've entered the uk twice in the past fortnight and neither time was I asked to show that I'd completed the form to say where I'd been
You did, however, have to enter your passport number in the form, and your passport was scanned when you entered. One supposes that it would pop up a warning for the officer if you had not completed it.
 
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Bletchleyite

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That has not ever been law.
It depends what you mean by "social distancing". If you mean purely the 2m / 1m+ thing no that hasn't, but I include in "social distancing" all measures that keep people from meeting/coming close to people, and some of them have been in law such as maximum group sizes and still are to some extent.

That doesn't bring foreign currency in though does it?
No but it stops our currency leaving at the same time so could easily balance out to some extent. We aren't reliant on the import of foreign currency in the way poorer countries are, though, and nor is NZ (our GDP per capita in 2019 is very close to being the same as theirs).
 

Butts

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Excellent that's me sorted Fag Run to Luxembourg on the 2/3 August and Port Adventura Spain the week after for a few days.

I booked before the announcement, wonder if prices will start climbing now ?
Houston I have a problem !!!

Luxembourg okay but Spain <D

Just going to have to hope BA cancel Mainland Spanish Holidays as seems to be likely according to Which !!
 

Jamiescott1

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You did, however, have to enter your passport number in the form, and your passport was scanned when you entered. One supposes that it would pop up a warning for the officer if you had not completed it
I used e passport gates both times, although I assume I could of been rejected at these if no form completed and made to go to a manual gate.

At luton Airport there was police officers stationed just before the uk border queue randomly asking (about 1 in 5 people ) to see peoples forms.
 

Howardh

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The UK government has decreed Spain out-of-bounds so anyone travelling there now will find their insurance invalid. However, what's the case for UK citizens who are already there and arrived before the government intervened? Is their insurance valid throughout their trip, or are they expected to return immediately?
 

ForTheLoveOf

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The UK government has decreed Spain out-of-bounds so anyone travelling there now will find their insurance invalid. However, what's the case for UK citizens who are already there and arrived before the government intervened? Is their insurance valid throughout their trip, or are they expected to return immediately?
It depends on the individual insurance policy in question, but generally speaking you would be covered to complete your trip as booked unless there was an imminent danger.
 

Tetchytyke

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New Zealand - imprisoned on our island
Interesting choice of words. It depends on how you view it, really.

I can't easily leave my island. If I go, it's a 14 day quarantine when I get back. But it's expensive to go anyway, so realistically I wouldn't be regularly leaving, even without the quarantine.

I can travel to another island in the same position as mine. But the flights are already fully booked, and expensive.

On the other hand, the border restrictions mean I have freedom that you don't- and won't for a long time. No social distancing laws here, no laws about masks. Pubs can play music, even have live bands. I've been to a lunchtime concert and a traditional music festival this weekend. I stood at the bar with a pint. I went on the steam train.

My bubble is smaller, but I've got more freedom in the bubble. And as I spend most of my time in the bubble anyway, the advantages outweigh the disadvantages.

Swings and roundabouts. No doubt the Kiwis feel the same.
 

Bletchleyite

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My bubble is smaller, but I've got more freedom in the bubble. And as I spend most of my time in the bubble anyway, the advantages outweigh the disadvantages.

Swings and roundabouts. No doubt the Kiwis feel the same.
That's exactly my take. And your "bubble", i.e. the IoM, is much smaller than mine likely would be (the island of Great Britain). But I would actually accept being confined to Buckinghamshire for a year or two (which I guess is a similar sort of size) if that meant all social distancing measures could be completely abolished. I like travel, but I like freedom in my daily life a lot more, and all the disadvantages of social distancing are simply to me not worth it for a couple of foreign trips a year. I can take foreign trips when the whole thing calms down, which as some people who went to Spain are learning is prudent anyway.
 

Tetchytyke

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But I would actually accept being confined to Buckinghamshire for a year or two (which I guess is a similar sort of size) if that meant all social distancing measures could be completely abolished. I like travel, but I like freedom in my daily life a lot more, and all the disadvantages of social distancing are simply to me not worth it for a couple of foreign trips a year.
That's exactly it. I'm "imprisoned" here (sort of- I can easily leave, I just can't easily come back!) but, in normal life, I go to work, I drop my daughter off at nursery, I go to Tesco, I go home, I go to the pub or have a takeaway on a weekend. On a warm day we'll go to Peel and play on the beach and have an ice cream. I'm not off gallivanting every weekend. And so the benefits to my day-to-day life- no social distancing, no masks, music in pubs- far outweigh the disadvantage of not being able to easily leave the island. I had a nice ride out on the Manx Electric Railway this morning. I'd rather have that than an open border and everything shut down, as in the UK.

And in the world of business, Zoom/Teams/Skype/Hangouts have managed to prove that, actually, that face-to-face meeting probably isn't essential after all.

And with all the rules in the rest of Europe, I'd not be rushing off to my usual beach holiday in Ibiza anyway, even if I could.
 

DavidB

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And in the world of business, Zoom/Teams/Skype/Hangouts have managed to prove that, actually, that face-to-face meeting probably isn't essential after all.
Hmm. That's not what we've found. Yes, they have a place and we'd already been trying (without much success before this!) to get people to use them for some face to face meetings, but they really aren't a suitable substitute for all meetings.
 

Chester1

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That's exactly my take. And your "bubble", i.e. the IoM, is much smaller than mine likely would be (the island of Great Britain). But I would actually accept being confined to Buckinghamshire for a year or two (which I guess is a similar sort of size) if that meant all social distancing measures could be completely abolished. I like travel, but I like freedom in my daily life a lot more, and all the disadvantages of social distancing are simply to me not worth it for a couple of foreign trips a year. I can take foreign trips when the whole thing calms down, which as some people who went to Spain are learning is prudent anyway.
How would you deal with the common travel area? For a compulsory quarantine of arrivals to be effective Ireland would need to copy UK or we would have to cut Northern Ireland off. If the fuss over light touch customs checks is anything to go by, I doubt mandatory quarantine of anyone arriving in GB from NI will be acceptable to unionists.

That's exactly it. I'm "imprisoned" here (sort of- I can easily leave, I just can't easily come back!) but, in normal life, I go to work, I drop my daughter off at nursery, I go to Tesco, I go home, I go to the pub or have a takeaway on a weekend. On a warm day we'll go to Peel and play on the beach and have an ice cream. I'm not off gallivanting every weekend. And so the benefits to my day-to-day life- no social distancing, no masks, music in pubs- far outweigh the disadvantage of not being able to easily leave the island. I had a nice ride out on the Manx Electric Railway this morning. I'd rather have that than an open border and everything shut down, as in the UK.

And in the world of business, Zoom/Teams/Skype/Hangouts have managed to prove that, actually, that face-to-face meeting probably isn't essential after all.

And with all the rules in the rest of Europe, I'd not be rushing off to my usual beach holiday in Ibiza anyway, even if I could.
I am sure it works on a day to day basis but what happens if you need to urgently visit the UK? There must be Manx who are having to make some awful decisions like whether or not to see those they love in hospital. Ignoring the worst scenarios it means you may not be able to see friends and family not living on the Isle Man for 1-2 years.

I think some people who are resistant to any change are making it sound like life in UK is bad under covid measures. The only major changes are more home working and masks in enclosed public spaces. Vast majority of stuff has reopened and is essentially normal. Public music both in commercial venues and places or worship is a loss but regaining it is not worth a country built around global trade, where many have family abroad, choosing to cut itself off from rest of world indefinitely. New Zealand's is gambling on a quick vaccine. Its gamble that Australia would join it in a Covid-19 free bubble has failed. At this stage Australia is more likely to adopt an Icelandic than New Zealand approach.
 

AdamWW

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I think some people who are resistant to any change are making it sound like life in UK is bad under covid measures. The only major changes are more home working and masks in enclosed public spaces. Vast majority of stuff has reopened and is essentially normal. Public music both in commercial venues and places or worship is a loss but regaining it is not worth a country built around global trade, where many have family abroad, choosing to cut itself off from rest of world indefinitely. New Zealand's is gambling on a quick vaccine. Its gamble that Australia would join it in a Covid-19 free bubble has failed. At this stage Australia is more likely to adopt an Icelandic than New Zealand approach.
I'd say we were a bit further away from normal than that makes it sound - particularly for anyone who relies on public transport.
 

Ianno87

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I'd say we were a bit further away from normal than that makes it sound - particularly for anyone who relies on public transport.
???

Public transport in England can be used for any purpose provided distancing is adhered to and face coverings are worn. Passenger loadings, whilst still low, are increasigly looking like a typical 'leisure' mix.
 

Ianno87

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I think @AdamWW is referring to the service levels of public transport, not the "purpose" of journeys.
Ah, I see.

Guess it depends where you are. Round my way pretty much everything is back to a decent 'usable' frequency (though not all full pre-Covid frequencies)

By local bus route was every 10 minutes pre-Covid, dropped to hourly in lockdown, and is now at every 15 minutes. Wouldn't be surprised if the 10 minute service never comes back (for various reasons, I find the 15 minute service actually better!)
 

philosopher

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I think some people who are resistant to any change are making it sound like life in UK is bad under covid measures. The only major changes are more home working and masks in enclosed public spaces. Vast majority of stuff has reopened and is essentially normal. Public music both in commercial venues and places or worship is a loss but regaining it is not worth a country built around global trade, where many have family abroad, choosing to cut itself off from rest of world indefinitely. New Zealand's is gambling on a quick vaccine. Its gamble that Australia would join it in a Covid-19 free bubble has failed. At this stage Australia is more likely to adopt an Icelandic than New Zealand approach.
Home working and face masks are pretty major changes though. Reading these forums it is clear many people really do not like either or both of these changes. Home working whether you like it or not, impacts about 40 hours of your week so it is very big change to people’s lives. Also all the measures (mainly the test and trace one) at pubs and restaurants completely put off some people I know from visiting them.

Personally I would much rather forego international travel for one or two years if it enabled us to get rid of facemasks, allowed pubs and restaurants to operate normally and meant companies felt it safe to resume working in offices.
 

Chester1

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Ah, I see.

Guess it depends where you are. Round my way pretty much everything is back to a decent 'usable' frequency (though not all full pre-Covid frequencies)

By local bus route was every 10 minutes pre-Covid, dropped to hourly in lockdown, and is now at every 15 minutes. Wouldn't be surprised if the 10 minute service never comes back (for various reasons, I find the 15 minute service actually better!)
Buses, trains and trams in Greater Manchester are almost back to normal frequencies. Shops, cafes, restaurants, pubs, gyms amd leisure centres have reopened. Apart from a very small number of people, masking wearing should be no more than a nuisance. Almost all of the adaptations to daily life are minor, most people who don't like them are annoyed about having to adapt full stop.
 

Envy123

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Thameslink is running almost the same as pre-COVID in my neck of the woods. My local leisure centre's gym is open but the pool is closed until September, so I have to temporarily switch to a leisure centre in my nearest city.

Life is almost normal for me here.
 

Bletchleyite

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How would you deal with the common travel area? For a compulsory quarantine of arrivals to be effective Ireland would need to copy UK or we would have to cut Northern Ireland off. If the fuss over light touch customs checks is anything to go by, I doubt mandatory quarantine of anyone arriving in GB from NI will be acceptable to unionists.
NI seems to be willingly joining RoI policy approach, which makes sense anyway because they are one island. That policy does seem more like Scotland's than England's, i.e. they are looking to elimination. And NI seems almost to have achieved that - zero cases today, for example.

I am sure it works on a day to day basis but what happens if you need to urgently visit the UK? There must be Manx who are having to make some awful decisions like whether or not to see those they love in hospital. Ignoring the worst scenarios it means you may not be able to see friends and family not living on the Isle Man for 1-2 years.
I'm not actually proposing going quite as far as the IoM, I'm just proposing a system of quarantine for all international arrivals.

I think some people who are resistant to any change are making it sound like life in UK is bad under covid measures. The only major changes are more home working and masks in enclosed public spaces. Vast majority of stuff has reopened and is essentially normal.
I wouldn't agree with that. The hospitality trade is at seriously reduced capacity, the entertainment industry is in bits and masks are necessary but highly unpleasant. I'd give up travel abroad in a stroke to solve all that. Goods need to move, but lorries can move without the tractor unit, and that's how most of them used to move (and some still do), and air crews (for the small number of flights left) don't need to leave the aircraft. Indeed, there are other benefits of that - for instance, reduced risk from having left hand drive tractor units on UK roads.
 

Chester1

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Home working and face masks are pretty major changes though. Reading these forums it is clear many people really do not like either or both of these changes. Home working whether you like it or not, impacts about 40 hours of your week so it is very big change to people’s lives. Also all the measures (mainly the test and trace one) at pubs and restaurants completely put off some people I know from visiting them.

Personally I would much rather forego international travel for one or two years if it enabled us to get rid of facemasks, allowed pubs and restaurants to operate normally and meant companies felt it safe to resume working in offices.
How do your address the Ireland problem with banning foreign travel? They need to copy us or we would need to cut off Northern Ireland or seal the border.

Offices are increasingly reopening on a part time basis. The majority of office workers like working from home some of the time, the old practices are dead already. Your employer might allow you to work in office 5 days a week but many will not, especially once leases start to expire. Cutting the country off won't change that.

NI seems to be willingly joining RoI policy approach, which makes sense anyway because they are one island. That policy does seem more like Scotland's than England's, i.e. they are looking to elimination. And NI seems almost to have achieved that - zero cases today, for example.

I'm not actually proposing going quite as far as the IoM, I'm just proposing a system of quarantine for all international arrivals.
There is litterally no chance of unionists agreeing to compulsory quarantine with the GB for a long period of time, absolutely none. Its about as likely as your suggestion in another thread, of making a vaccine compulsory with threat of imprisonment. Ireland's current approach would still allow the virus to transmit at a low level, from there it would pass through the UK (some people inevitably will break their at home quarantine). Ireland is allowing quarantine free travel from a very small list of green countries, its much closer to UK policy than anything you are suggesting.
 

Tetchytyke

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I am sure it works on a day to day basis but what happens if you need to urgently visit the UK? There must be Manx who are having to make some awful decisions like whether or not to see those they love in hospital. Ignoring the worst scenarios it means you may not be able to see friends and family not living on the Isle Man for 1-2 years.
It's easier now- if we return, it's a 14 day quarantine. But yes, people did face some tough choices. It's not nice not being able to see my family and my elder daughter. It's certainly not ideal.

My family live across and referred to Leeds as a ghost town, they said many shops were still boarded up. I see most shopping malls are still on reduced hours and with one-day systems, queues, and all the rest. They say Bradford is even worse. Naturally I have to go on these reports as, obviously, I can't see for myself!

It's not ideal but, on balance, I prefer our handling of it to England's
 

philosopher

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How do your address the Ireland problem with banning foreign travel? They need to copy us or we would need to cut off Northern Ireland or seal the border.

Offices are increasingly reopening on a part time basis. The majority of office workers like working from home some of the time, the old practices are dead already. Your employer might allow you to work in office 5 days a week but many will not, especially once leases start to expire. Cutting the country off won't change that.
If an elimination strategy were to be pursued then yes I think it would be need to done together with the RoI to avoid issues relating to Northern Ireland border.

With offices, myself and most of those I know have not returned to an office even part time, so even a shift to working say half the time in office would represent quite a big beneficial change in my view.
 

AdamWW

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I think @AdamWW is referring to the service levels of public transport, not the "purpose" of journeys.
Yes, I was mostly.

But I was also thinking about the different messaging in Wales and Scotland - the original comment did say UK.

It's good to see from comments below how many places have returned to a near normal service level, but it's clear that this isn't true everywhere.
 

Chester1

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It's easier now- if we return, it's a 14 day quarantine. But yes, people did face some tough choices. It's not nice not being able to see my family and my elder daughter. It's certainly not ideal.

My family live across and referred to Leeds as a ghost town, they said many shops were still boarded up. I see most shopping malls are still on reduced hours and with one-day systems, queues, and all the rest. They say Bradford is even worse. Naturally I have to go on these reports as, obviously, I can't see for myself!

It's not ideal but, on balance, I prefer our handling of it to England's
How long would you be prepared to tolerate not seeing your family in England unless you are prepared to quarantine for 14 days on return to Isle of Man? I suspect there will be people is Isle of Man with no love ones off the island who would support status quo even for a couple of years or more if there not a fully effective vaccine. About 1 in 8 British residents were born overseas (either to expat or foreign parents). Nearly 1 in 10 British Citizens live overseas. Too many families would be isolated from each other with a compulsory 14 day quarantine for arrivals for UK. The first vaccine may only provide limited protection, not full immunity and therefore not be sufficient to allow the virus to be eradicated.
 
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Yes, I was mostly.

But I was also thinking about the different messaging in Wales and Scotland - the original comment did say UK.

It's good to see from comments below how many places have returned to a near normal service level, but it's clear that this isn't true everywhere.
Stagecoach (East Scotland) are returning to pretty much pre-pandemic timetables as of 3rd August.

The essential travel only message has been dropped in Scotland, but you are to consider other forms of transport first.
 

Tetchytyke

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How long would you be prepared to tolerate not seeing your family in England unless you are prepared to quarantine for 14 days on return to Isle of Man?
There's no straightforward answer to that. But if the choices are between what we have here, with Covid eradicated and day-to-day life pretty much as normal as before, and what is happening in Leicester, Catalonia and Melbourne, I'm in no rush.

I am one of those Brits who were born overseas too!
 

Richard Scott

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There's no straightforward answer to that. But if the choices are between what we have here, with Covid eradicated and day-to-day life pretty much as normal as before, and what is happening in Leicester, Catalonia and Melbourne, I'm in no rush.

I am one of those Brits who were born overseas too!
So how long are we expected to wait for it to be eradicated (which it won't be)? After one or two years we're still not going anywhere do we wait another one or two years and so on? We just need to get on with life and that includes travelling abroad. Government on about reintroducing quarantines to previous green light countries is really just daft when the virus is not running amok throughout said country. A few thousand new cases is not worth worrying about.
 

Chester1

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There's no straightforward answer to that. But if the choices are between what we have here, with Covid eradicated and day-to-day life pretty much as normal as before, and what is happening in Leicester, Catalonia and Melbourne, I'm in no rush.

I am one of those Brits who were born overseas too!
The answer I suspect is until you are really need to travel for personal reasons and you don't know when that will be. There is a huge difference between a few months and years.

On your previous point about Leeds - many of those shops wouldn't reopen if covid-19 disappeared tomorrow. If the UK managed to eradicate the virus the country won't return to how it was last year, there has been a huge economic and societal change. Radical authoritarian policies to eradicate the virus won't bring bank 2019 UK.
 

Skimpot flyer

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Ah, I see.

Guess it depends where you are. Round my way pretty much everything is back to a decent 'usable' frequency (though not all full pre-Covid frequencies)

By local bus route was every 10 minutes pre-Covid, dropped to hourly in lockdown, and is now at every 15 minutes. Wouldn't be surprised if the 10 minute service never comes back (for various reasons, I find the 15 minute service actually better!)
You might not be saying that if mandating of face coverings in shops achieves the objective the government says it’s for... you may find that the reduced capacity means your selected bus breezes past with a ‘bus full’ sign, increasing the interval between services you can actually board. Not much fun if it means missing a train at the other end, too
 

Jamiescott1

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So how long are we expected to wait for it to be eradicated (which it won't be)? After one or two years we're still not going anywhere do we wait another one or two years and so on? We just need to get on with life and that includes travelling abroad. Government on about reintroducing quarantines to previous green light countries is really just daft when the virus is not running amok throughout said country. A few thousand new cases is not worth worrying about.
Exactly. Well said.
 

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