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Amsterdam Eurostar

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HowardGWR

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I'm wondering why they are missing out Schiphol at present. Most of business is now situated nearer to Schiphol than Centraal, and there is also the interlining trade to consider.
 
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30907

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I'm wondering why they are missing out Schiphol at present. Most of business is now situated nearer to Schiphol than Centraal, and there is also the interlining trade to consider.
Somewhere upthread it's difficulties creating a segregated area for departures.
 

AlexNL

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In a few years' time, Eurostar services should move to Amsterdam Zuid. The facilities at Amsterdam Centraal are only intended to be temporary, once Amsterdam Centraal has been remodelled all international trains are due to move to Zuid. And that's where the business district is.

For now, you can go from Centraal to Zuid by metro which only takes like 10 minutes. If you've been on a train for 4 hours a few minutes more shouldn't be that much of a dealbreaker I think.
 

Struner

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Well, tourists would rather arrive at the grandeur of Amsterdam CS than at the dump of A’dam Zuid I suppose.
& this doesn’t just go for Amsterdam but for other cities as well?
 

AlexNL

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I fully agree with that sentiment, CS is a much more welcoming and impressing place than Zuid is (although Zuid will be overhauled as well).

The reason for the move away from Centraal is to increase capacity there. The Dutch railways want to further intensify their high frequency services and for this, they need all the platform space in Centraal they can get. Having international trains with their long dwell times in that station doesn't mix well with the plans.
 

JonasB

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In a few years' time, Eurostar services should move to Amsterdam Zuid. The facilities at Amsterdam Centraal are only intended to be temporary, once Amsterdam Centraal has been remodelled all international trains are due to move to Zuid. And that's where the business district is.

Will domestic trains move to Zuid as well or will changing trains in Amsterdam in the future be as easy as it is in London and Paris today?
 

cle

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I'd have thought easier to intensify through Zuid. Currently, it's more of a (very busy) commuter station in nature, with a few raised island platforms, exposed to the elements. It doesn't have much of a 'terminal' (let's not be too literal here) - or facilities, let alone a roof or shed. Plus it's hemmed in by the motorway... so I can't see it being easier to segregate than Central, which has many more platforms and all of the right facilities. Some Thalys could go there instead perhaps, within Schengen and extendable to Utretcht to not occupy platforms.

Business in Amsterdam is spread widely. Some is old centre, some Zuid, some Schiphol and the way out there, some stretching along the Ij eastwards and indeed across the Ij, and much development by Philips and towards the RAI - and indeed, I need to go to Hilversum often.

It's become a multi-centric metropolis (only set to increase after this auspicious date) - and in the same way that most business is not at St Pancras, a central location is the safest bet.
 

AlexNL

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Zuid will see extensive redevelopment as part of the 'Zuidasdok' project. The motorway will be brought underground, one new platform will be added (two additional tracks) and the entire station will be redeveloped.

In the future Amsterdam Zuid and its surroundings should look like this:

upload_2020-1-31_23-52-35.png

Picture source: Team V Architecture's website
 

popeter45

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Honestly i could see with 4 Amsterdam Paths seeing 2 too each as both have benefits and drawbacks
Centeraal is closer to old city so more popular for tourist who probably outnumber business people on most eurostar trains, Centeraal also has the intercity express for schipol so better suited people flying with the eurostar as a connection
Zuid is better suited for Business people as closer to the economic district and will also host international trains so better suited to people connecting to these services
 

AlbertBeale

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I understand about wanting more intensive local services at the old central station and hence moving internationals to Zuid to make space - but does that mean that most longer-distance national trains will go to Zuid as well, leaving the other station for local/commuter/regional services? If internationals move to Zuid but the main national routes don't, then that will mess up onward connections for people arriving on Eurostar etc [and leave Amsterdam with a London/Paris interchange situation, as has been noted], as well as "spoiling" the arrival for tourists - who expect to arrive somewhere a bit more "historically" central. Given that Amsterdam is a lot smaller than London, and it does have a station in what is the obvious historic centre, then it would be a pity for visitors not to arrive there; with London, the "centre" is (or centres are) much bigger, with no one obviously "most central" station, so the situation is different and several of the main stations are equally good (or not) as a tourist arrival.

By the way - I assume that Amsterdam sleepers will also end up at Zuid then?
 

AlexNL

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Amsterdam Centraal and Amsterdam Zuid both see a fair number of long distance trains (if you can call it that in NL ;)). A large number of places are equally served by Centraal and by Zuid, as the IC trains tend to alternate between both stations. Some of the longer distance routes, such as those to Groningen, Leeuwarden and Enschede only serve Amsterdam Zuid.

The only destinations which can't be reached directly from Zuid are Zandvoort-by-the-Sea, the 'kop van Noord-Holland' (Den Helder, Enkhuizen, Hoorn, Alkmaar, etc.), and Haarlem. If you have to go places like that you will have to change to a different station, but even then you won't be going via Centraal. The journey advice will be to take the metro from Zuid to Sloterdijk and join your connecting train there.

But.... if the wider Amsterdam region isn't your destination, you're usually better off changing in Rotterdam Centraal. Take a journey from London to Utrecht for example:

Code:
07:16 D London St. Pancras
11:32 A Rotterdam Centraal

11:50 D Rotterdam Centraal
12:28 A Utrecht Centraal

If you'd stay on board of the Eurostar to Amsterdam, your journey would look like this:
Code:
07:16 D London St. Pancras
12:11 A Amsterdam Centraal

12:24 D Rotterdam Centraal
12:51 A Utrecht Centraal

The same applies to many destinations in the Netherlands, including Nijmegen, Leeuwarden, Groningen, cities in Brabant and Limburg, and so on.
 

sprunt

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The same applies to many destinations in the Netherlands, including Nijmegen, Leeuwarden, Groningen, cities in Brabant and Limburg, and so on.

Oh, I'm going to Groningen next month and I've got an Amsterdam Eurostar ticket, but I've not bought the onward ticket in the Netherlands yet - would I be better getting off at Rotterdam and going from there?
 

Struner

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I think you would, yes. Get off at Rotterdam, have a stopover of about half an hour & get on the train to Groningen. Just a single change. The bahn.de planner will probably tell you so as well.
Anyway, welcome to Stad.
 

AlexNL

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I've just had a look at the DB planner, in the case of Groningen there doesn't seem to be any time difference between changing at Rotterdam or staying on-board until Amsterdam. The price is also the same. However, going via Amsterdam Centraal does mean that you have to change more trains than you would have to when changing at Rotterdam.

Via Rotterdam:
Code:
07:16 London -> Rotterdam pl. 12 11:32
12:05 Rotterdam pl. 14 -> Groningen pl. 2b 14:42

Via Amsterdam:
Code:
07:16 London -> Amsterdam pl. 13 12:11
12:38 Amsterdam pl. 13b -> Almere pl. 3 12:58
13:02 Almere pl. 4 -> Zwolle pl. 7 13:43
13:45 Zwolle pl. 6 -> Groningen pl. 2b 14:42

There is some slack in the Eurostar timings, so if you get to Rotterdam a bit early (and you already have a ticket for your onward journey*) you could also use this itinerary:
Code:
07:16 London -> Rotterdam pl. 12 11:32
11:35 Rotterdam pl. 14 -> Zwolle pl. 7 13:09
13:15 Zwolle pl. 6 -> Groningen pl. 4b 14:12

(In Almere and Zwolle, the connecting train is on the opposite side of the same platform.)

* You can buy e-tickets on the NS website, www.ns.nl. NS don't do 'booked train only' tickets, an e-ticket bought on their website will be valid for the entire day.
 

island

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On the other hand, your NS ticket will cost more if you get off the Eurostar at a Rotterdam. So there’s that.
 

404250

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Yes strange that Eurostar to Rotterdam exactly the same price as Amsterdam when Rotterdam to Amsterdam high speed on its own is an expensive ticket.
 

edwin_m

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Yes strange that Eurostar to Rotterdam exactly the same price as Amsterdam when Rotterdam to Amsterdam high speed on its own is an expensive ticket.
If Eurostar sold tickets between Rotterdam and Amsterdam then it would make sense for them to charge less for London-Rotterdam so they could fill the seat again and make more money. But they don't so they don't.
 

radamfi

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Yes strange that Eurostar to Rotterdam exactly the same price as Amsterdam when Rotterdam to Amsterdam high speed on its own is an expensive ticket.

It depends what you call "expensive". The regular fare without the high speed line is 16.40 (or 11.50 using the offer above). Using the high speed line incurs a surcharge of 2.60.
 

AlexNL

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On the other hand, your NS ticket will cost more if you get off the Eurostar at a Rotterdam. So there’s that.
It won't, Amsterdam - Groningen is just as expensive as Rotterdam - Groningen as you run into the maximum single fare price on NS. :)
 

Gadget88

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I’m the same I think moving to Zuid is a bad idea even if redeveloped. I notice the waiting area in Amsterdam Eurostar terminal looks good nice seating makes me wonder why they don’t do similar at other Eurostar stations? France in particular needs an upgrade.
 

sprunt

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Thanks for all the tips. Looking at the times, it does seem to be that changing at Rotterdam makes sense, but only for the single change. Arriving at Rotterdam at 15.32 I can get the 16.05 to Groningen, arriving at 18.42 - if I stay on until Amsterdam, I have to get three trains, the last of which is the same one I'd be getting on at Rotterdam, so I may as well do that.

* You can buy e-tickets on the NS website, www.ns.nl. NS don't do 'booked train only' tickets, an e-ticket bought on their website will be valid for the entire day.

Thanks, I've bought them in the NS app before, I'll probably do that this time.

Amsterdam to Groningen and Rotterdam to Groningen both cost the maximum NS fare of 27.00. If you travel outside rush hours, there are usually special offers available. Currently you can get singles for 11.50.

https://www.treinreiziger.nl/goedkoop-treinkaartje/

Thanks a lot, but unfortunately I'll be travelling in the rush hour - catching that 16.05 from Rotterdam.
 

cle

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Zuid will see extensive redevelopment as part of the 'Zuidasdok' project. The motorway will be brought underground, one new platform will be added (two additional tracks) and the entire station will be redeveloped.

In the future Amsterdam Zuid and its surroundings should look like this:

View attachment 73336

Picture source: Team V Architecture's website
Where is the metro island? Is that being buried too? It already has 3 islands (1 pair metro, sharing the lines, which is less than ideal, 2 pairs for rail)

It still looks like an elevated set of island platforms, just now landscaped - not an international terminus or anything resembling a station of stature.

And to the other poster, what does economic centre mean? Where is the economic centre of London? As I mentioned, it's a large multi-centric economic centre - I would say across all sectors, the most important in Europe after London these days - and jobs are clustered across the metro area. Let's please not dwell on finance/legal jobs = all jobs. And Clifford Chance are right by Centraal, to give one very prominent example.
 

dutchflyer

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Check till what date the direct FROM LON to Ams trains are bookable now-is that also much less as the 180 days?
In fact its posible also to book single Ams-BRU by EUR* too, but very few people do (or know). For some reason they could not make it thus in BRU like in the LIlle checks that they do on the long-distance trains to LON from South of France.
That treaty has to be signed still and then staff from UK who are willing to take up those posting needs to be found. No idea at all how easy/difficult thats going to be. But if brexit comes to much more restrictions-like we continentals also having to have full passprts and not just ID etc this will hurt traffic immensely for pleasure trips. Let alone the threat that even VISA will come in force-as has been said some place/some time.
 

some bloke

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I'll be travelling in the peak.
The two-singles € 24 offer allows your journey in the evening peak, so it's a question of whether you can make use of a single ticket on another day, for the extra € 5.
 
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tasky

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I understand about wanting more intensive local services at the old central station and hence moving internationals to Zuid to make space - but does that mean that most longer-distance national trains will go to Zuid as well, leaving the other station for local/commuter/regional services? If internationals move to Zuid but the main national routes don't, then that will mess up onward connections for people arriving on Eurostar etc [and leave Amsterdam with a London/Paris interchange situation, as has been noted], as well as "spoiling" the arrival for tourists - who expect to arrive somewhere a bit more "historically" central. Given that Amsterdam is a lot smaller than London, and it does have a station in what is the obvious historic centre, then it would be a pity for visitors not to arrive there; with London, the "centre" is (or centres are) much bigger, with no one obviously "most central" station, so the situation is different and several of the main stations are equally good (or not) as a tourist arrival.

By the way - I assume that Amsterdam sleepers will also end up at Zuid then?
Mostly agree with this but worth pointing out that a lot of *national* connections will be available at Rotterdam as well, which is a very convenient station for interchange
 
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