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Amsterdam Eurostar

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dutchflyer

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Also just today NS announced that a 3d train will be added in the 2019 timetable, the general draft of it being finalised this month.
The last years Ive often used the coach (Mega- then, Eurolines, DB or even FLIX) and twice there were not any French officials at hand at Dover for the ''entry into the common-Schengen area'' so after a while the coachdriver just decided to go on and we entered this apparently so heavily guarded area without any due checks at all.
Strangely and for me completely un-understandable, I was also (picked at random, in fact my luggage) inspected by British border guards at Dover, have no idea what the purpose was for that.
 
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route101

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Also just today NS announced that a 3d train will be added in the 2019 timetable, the general draft of it being finalised this month.
The last years Ive often used the coach (Mega- then, Eurolines, DB or even FLIX) and twice there were not any French officials at hand at Dover for the ''entry into the common-Schengen area'' so after a while the coachdriver just decided to go on and we entered this apparently so heavily guarded area without any due checks at all.
Strangely and for me completely un-understandable, I was also (picked at random, in fact my luggage) inspected by British border guards at Dover, have no idea what the purpose was for that.

A while back , there was no French Border guards at Dover when we drove through . That wouldnt happen at St Pancras or an Airport.
 

Goldfish62

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I can't see any reason why the passport scanner couldn't be made handheld, as long as there is a good wifi signal. The photo recognition would be more awkward but since an officer would be needed to do the scanning they would also confirm the accuracy of the passport photo. As they have several hours to work their way through the train, only a handful of officers with scanners would be needed. There might need to be restrictions on people passing the officers to go to the buffet during this time, and perhaps some toilets locked out, to remove possible means of avoiding the checks.

Having said that the fixed passport gates needn't be a big impediment to travel as long as there are enough of them. It's the baggage scanning that is the real problem.
Border checks are done on board from Finland to Russia, a country not known for its lax border controls, so it is possible. Shame there seems to be a jobsworth attitude from UK Border "Force"
 

Adlington

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A moderator thinks this post will be improved by adding a few words from me. Here we go:
If you care to read the full story (see link at the bottom) you will learn that a part of Rotterdam Centraal station will be rebuilt to enable access control to the platform(s) to be used by the forthcoming Eurostar’s services between London and Amsterdam.
Work to adapt Rotterdam Centraal station to accommodate Eurostar’s future Amsterdam – London services has begun.

During a nine-week possession tracks will be realigned and a platform which currently faces track 1 will be widened by 4 m to face onto track 2, providing an extra 3 000 m2 of space to separate passenger who have passed through security screening.

Completion is planned for March 26
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/...ion-to-be-modified-for-eurostar-services.html
 
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Jordeh

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Border checks are done on board from Finland to Russia, a country not known for its lax border controls, so it is possible. Shame there seems to be a jobsworth attitude from UK Border "Force"
Whilst you have a point about conducting checks on board, I don't think you have any understanding of the word jobsworth.
 

MisterT

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It seems like there are some issues with the border checks. According to answers provided by the Dutch government, the border checks will only be in place by the end of 2019.
The letter does not provide any answers about the meantime. It probably means that everyone has to go trough security in Brussels for the time being, but it's even possible that the complete connection will be postponed.
https://www.treinreiziger.nl/eind-2019-directe-eurostar-naar-londen/ (in Dutch)
 
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williamn

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Yes as it is is setting down only en route and not picking passengers up, so can eliminate a long Brussels stop.
 

AlexNL

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It seems like there are some issues with the border checks. According to answers provided by the Dutch government, the border checks will only be in place by the end of 2019.
The letter does not provide any answers about the meantime. It probably means that everyone has to go trough security in Brussels for the time being, but it's even possible that the complete connection will be postponed.
https://www.treinreiziger.nl/eind-2019-directe-eurostar-naar-londen/ (in Dutch)
Treinreiziger.nl is being sensationalist here, it has been known since 2013 that there would be a border check in Brussels. In their 2013 proposal (page 11), NS state that a Amsterdam -> London trip will take 278 minutes while a trip in the opposite direction will only require 230 minutes.

This is confirmed in the letter sent a few days ago by SoS Van Veldhoven, where she reiterates that the original plan was to have safety checks done in Brussels (3rd paragraph). It was not until 2016 that NS and Eurostar expressed the wish to have the security checks done in the Dutch stations, which is now being realised but which needs a lot of preparation time as international treaties are involved.

Ms. Van Veldhoven concludes that the operational preparations necessary for an April 2018 introduction are ongoing and are proceeding according to schedule. Eurostar are still working out their final plans, but postponement is not mentioned anywhere!
 

JonathanP

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Can you elaborate, please?

"Jobsworth", typically refers to an self-important official applying the letter, rather than a spirit of the law in a petty and sometimes absurd way. So, for instance, a border force official refusing to allow someone entry because of some trivial error in their paperwork, or because they are an EU citizen but stood in the 'non-EU citizen' passport line.

However, a major policy decision by an organisation, such as the UK Border Force decision that they will only carry out passport checks in the conventional way at passport desks and not by using staff passing through a train does not fit the usual meaning of "Jobsworth", although given that this method works perfectly well at many other borders it could be described perhaps as blinkered, or over-cautious.
 

Goldfish62

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"Jobsworth", typically refers to an self-important official applying the letter, rather than a spirit of the law in a petty and sometimes absurd way. So, for instance, a border force official refusing to allow someone entry because of some trivial error in their paperwork, or because they are an EU citizen but stood in the 'non-EU citizen' passport line.

However, a major policy decision by an organisation, such as the UK Border Force decision that they will only carry out passport checks in the conventional way at passport desks and not by using staff passing through a train does not fit the usual meaning of "Jobsworth", although given that this method works perfectly well at many other borders it could be described perhaps as blinkered, or over-cautious.
Thanks.
 

Goldfish62

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Treinreiziger.nl is being sensationalist here, it has been known since 2013 that there would be a border check in Brussels. In their 2013 proposal (page 11), NS state that a Amsterdam -> London trip will take 278 minutes while a trip in the opposite direction will only require 230 minutes.

This is confirmed in the letter sent a few days ago by SoS Van Veldhoven, where she reiterates that the original plan was to have safety checks done in Brussels (3rd paragraph). It was not until 2016 that NS and Eurostar expressed the wish to have the security checks done in the Dutch stations, which is now being realised but which needs a lot of preparation time as international treaties are involved.

Ms. Van Veldhoven concludes that the operational preparations necessary for an April 2018 introduction are ongoing and are proceeding according to schedule. Eurostar are still working out their final plans, but postponement is not mentioned anywhere!
But is 20-odd minutes sufficient to get everyone off the train, "process" them, and get them back on the train?
 

edwin_m

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"Jobsworth", typically refers to an self-important official applying the letter, rather than a spirit of the law in a petty and sometimes absurd way. So, for instance, a border force official refusing to allow someone entry because of some trivial error in their paperwork, or because they are an EU citizen but stood in the 'non-EU citizen' passport line.
Originated I believe by Esther Rantzen's "That's life" TV show in the 80s. They gave out a "jobsworth award", a golden peaked cap, and the name is a shortening of "it's more than my job's worth to ...".
 

33Hz

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But is 20-odd minutes sufficient to get everyone off the train, "process" them, and get them back on the train?

278 - 230 is 48 minutes.


There are on-train checks done when you go from other non-Schengen to Schengen countries (Croatia to Austria for example), so this is not the problem. It is the other way that is the issue.

Besides, even if UK Border Control did agree to this, there is still the problem of the baggage and x-ray machines (which I know the Spanish do a lot quicker on their main line checks).
 

route101

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278 - 230 is 48 minutes.


There are on-train checks done when you go from other non-Schengen to Schengen countries (Croatia to Austria for example), so this is not the problem. It is the other way that is the issue.

Besides, even if UK Border Control did agree to this, there is still the problem of the baggage and x-ray machines (which I know the Spanish do a lot quicker on their main line checks).

Croatia to Slovenia is done on train at Dobova .
 

43096

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There are on-train checks done when you go from other non-Schengen to Schengen countries (Croatia to Austria for example), so this is not the problem. It is the other way that is the issue.
AFAIAA Croatia and Austria do not have a land border.
 

TheGrew

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I am just about to take the late running 19:02 services from Brussels Midi back to St Pancras but it has been delayed for 30 minutes due to 'disturbances on the Dutch network' . Does this mean my train would have just completed a test run before picking up people here at Brussels? Interestingly it is also due on platform 3 here. Headcode 9157 for those interested.
 

telstarbox

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Trains start on 4 April!

Eurostar direct rail services between London and Amsterdam will begin on 4 April, the company has announced, in an eagerly awaited move expected to spark a price war with airlines.

Tickets for the two daily trains – starting from £35 one way – will go on sale on 20 February. The services will allow passengers to travel from St Pancras station in central London direct to the Netherlands in three to four hours.

More than 4 million passengers a year fly between London and Amsterdam, making it one of Europe’s busiest air routes as the Netherlands grows in popularity as a key business and tourism hub.

The cross-Channel rail operator is set to challenge established airlines on the route, including British Airways, easyJet and Ryanair. It will target potential converts by saying a London-Amsterdam Eurostar journey emits 80% less carbonthan the equivalent flight.

Plans for the new service were first announced in September 2013 but the official start date has been subject to numerous delays while immigration and passport controls were agreed.

These issues mean direct services returning to London will not be in place until the end of next year. Passengers travelling from Amsterdam and Rotterdam will have to connect through Brussels for passport controls and security screeninguntil the two governments complete an agreement allowing passport checks to be conducted in the Netherlands.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...unch-london-amsterdam-direct-service-in-april
 

BigCj34

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I see the London - Brussels part of the journey time being reduced to 1h48. How is that being achieved, have there been some line improvement works recently?
 

MisterT

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So there will be no direct trains from Amsterdam to London. One has to travel by Thalys to Brussels and change there for the Eurostar trains until the border checks are in place, which is foreseen from the 2020 timetable change.
Yes, of course, the London to Amsterdam leg will improve vastly, but this is absolute not an improvement at all for the other way around.
 

ge-gn

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Anyone know if there will be FIP or safeguarded RST fares on the Amsterdam trains?
 

LNW-GW Joint

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They could name the service the flying dutchman
If you know Wagner's opera, one michm reconsider, unless one enjoys Wagner that is ;)

KLM has The Flying Dutchman (in English) plastered on all its planes, so I can't see Eurostar using it.

I like the Wagner opera, but I prefer another German opera with Dutch connections: Zar und Zimmermann (Lortzing), set in Amsterdam.
It even has a clog dance.
 

Chester1

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So there will be no direct trains from Amsterdam to London. One has to travel by Thalys to Brussels and change there for the Eurostar trains until the border checks are in place, which is foreseen from the 2020 timetable change.
Yes, of course, the London to Amsterdam leg will improve vastly, but this is absolute not an improvement at all for the other way around.

The timetable cuts time in Brussels from 44-48 minutes to 28 minutes. Pressumably Eurostar will hold services in the event of a delay. The stop in Brussels on eastward journey will be 4 minutes so when the new passport check arrangement finally gets introduced then a further 24 minutes will be cut. Alternatively if the new service is a big success then Eurostar might be prepared to pay for larger facilities in Amsterdam and Rotterdam.
 

CdBrux

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I see the London - Brussels part of the journey time being reduced to 1h48. How is that being achieved, have there been some line improvement works recently?

They run non stop (vs stopping in Lille and maybe either Calais, Ashford or Ebbsfleet)
 
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