Avanti west coast seat reservation question

[millemille]

I'm currently on an Avanti west coast service down to London and have just witnessed a scuffle between two blokes, who are both old enough to have known better, about a reserved seat.

I'll call the protagonists "Nabber" and "Aggrieved".

As best I can understand "Aggrieved" had a seat reserved from Crewe but didn't claim his seat, from what I heard he couldn't get to Crewe in time so he decided to get on at Tamworth instead.

"Nabber" saw the seat empty after Crewe and, by his logic, as "Aggrieved" hadn't taken up his reservation the seat was fair game so he'd claimed the seat as his own.

"Aggrieved" gets on at Tamworth and goes to his reserved seat, which by his logic he's reserved for the whole journey and it matters not if he didn't take it at Crewe, to find "Nabber" fat and happy in his seat.

Words are exchanged, physical altercation ensues, calmer folks intervene.

"Nabber", with much blustering and threatening, moves to another seat and "Aggrieved" and "Mrs. Aggrieved" move into their reserved seats.

So, forum minds, who's in the right and who's in the wrong?

 

[Watershed]

I'm currently on an Avanti west coast service down to London and have just witnessed a scuffle between two blokes, who are both old enough to have known better, about a reserved seat.

I'll call the protagonists "Nabber" and "Aggrieved".

As best I can understand "Aggrieved" had a seat reserved from Crewe but didn't claim his seat, from what I heard he couldn't get to Crewe in time so he decided to get on at Tamworth instead.

"Nabber" saw the seat empty after Crewe and, by his logic, as "Aggrieved" hadn't taken up his reservation the seat was fair game so he'd claimed the seat as his own.

"Aggrieved" gets on at Tamworth and goes to his reserved seat, which by his logic he's reserved for the whole journey and it matters not if he didn't take it at Crewe, to find "Nabber" fat and happy in his seat.

Words are exchanged, physical altercation ensues, calmer folks intervene.

"Nabber", with much blustering and threatening, moves to another seat and "Aggrieved" and "Mrs. Aggrieved" move into their reserved seats.

So, forum minds, who's in the right and who's in the wrong?

It's a tricky one. On the face of things "Aggrieved" has a reservation so is entitled to boot out "Nabber" or anyone else who sits there.

On the other hand, it is common practice for reservations to only be valid if claimed within a reasonable period of time, and indeed Avanti's reservation displays mirror this as they say "available if unoccupied" for reserved seats (after a period of time, I believe).

If there were other free seats then I think both parties were being silly for squabbling over it. Two bald men fighting over a comb comes to mind...

 

[AndrewE]

The "rule" (if it actually was one) always used to be that you had to claim a seat within 20 minutes of departure. I assumed this was so that someone, maybe after a late connection, could jump in the wrong end of a crowded train and get through to the seat which in the past they had paid to reserve.

 

[sheff1]

I don't think there is a written "rule". If there is can someone provide a link.

If there isn't it could be useful to have one (certainly used to be one on DB in Germany) but introducing such a rule is not likely to be high on any 'rule making' priority list.

 

[AndrewE]

I don't think there is a written "rule". If there is can someone provide a link.

If there isn't it could be useful to have one (certainly used to be one on DB in Germany) but introducing such a rule is not likely to be high on any 'rule making' priority list.

Now you mention it, maybe I just remember it from a note in the Cook's Continental timetable and thought how sensible it was!

 

[Bletchleyite]

On Avanti the display would be saying "AVAILABLE IF UNOCCUPIED" after a certain period, so fair game to sit there.

 

[30907]

"Nabber", with much blustering and threatening, moves to another seat and "Aggrieved" and "Mrs. Aggrieved" move into their reserved seats

In N's position I would not wish to be sitting next to Mrs A all the way to Euston

 

[mmh]

On Avanti the display would be saying "AVAILABLE IF UNOCCUPIED" after a certain period, so fair game to sit there.

Which is a fantastic experience for passengers who've gone to the toilet or buffet.

If only people thinking what technology can do would remember just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

 

[AndrewE]

Which is a fantastic experience for passengers who've gone to the toilet or buffet.

If only people thinking what technology can do would remember just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

You leave a coat on the seat, or ask neighbouring passengers to watch it for you then. It has happened on several of my recent journeys. In fact most reserved seats will not be on trains making frequent stops, so it is highly unlikely anybody will try to claim it if you time your visit intelligently.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You leave a coat on the seat, or ask neighbouring passengers to watch it for you then. It has happened on several of my recent journeys. In fact most reserved seats will not be on trains making frequent stops, so it is highly unlikely anybody will try to claim it if you time your visit intelligently.

If you don't want your bag nicked it's a bad idea going to the buffet over a station stop anyway.

 

[Trackman]

Which is a fantastic experience for passengers who've gone to the toilet or buffet.

Or go in between a long stop, if someone is sat in your seat just be polite with them saying you've just been to buffet or gone for a wee. 90% of the time they will be fine.

If you don't want your bag nicked it's a bad idea going to the buffet over a station stop anyway.

Or put it in the secret hiding place that not many people use... overheads. You have mentioned this before. They are less obvious now since the refurbs.
This is where they hid the newspapers, place mats and wifi controllers and other things in the VT days..