Avanti West Coast: Standard Premium

[Dryce]

Avanti offer a light meal, snacks and drinks in "proper" 1st, so it had to fit "lower" than that.

My experience over the last three months is that the limited offering is often even more limited on the day.

So I would reckon about half the trips I have made recently then my first choice of food/snack or soft drink have not been available.

I also would observe that service standards and presentation vary quite a bit - some of the staff are bit switched off. So compounding the lack of availability is the delivery of something you didn't ask for - or non delivery of what you asked for because somebody esle presumably received it. And this is on near empty services.

 

[Trackman]

It seems the webpage has disappeared.

Standard Premium | Avanti West Coast

Introducing our brand new onboard offering - Standard Premium Class. Upgrade from Standard and treat yourself to a few added extras on your next journey.

www.avantiwestcoast.co.uk

 

[Journeyman]

The way this is looking to work, whether I'd use it or not depends on the price differential between standard and first Advance tickets on a particular train. If, for example, Standard cost £40 and first cost £80 on a particular service, I'd happily pay the £25 upgrade and forego the freebies for the comfier seat. If, however, standard was £50 and first was £75, I'd book first from the start, as you'd get the free refreshments too. They're not a deal breaker for me, but I'll have them if they're going.

It looks similar to whether I'd consider forking out for a Seatfrog upgrade when I use LNER. The cost of the various ticketing options in the first place needs to be considered.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Of course it's not just about Standard being £X and First being £Y, it's also about flexibility at a reasonable price.

Yes, there's the First Off Peak but it's mostly too expensive for me; to me the added value is a multiplier of about 1.5 (which is sort of where Weekend First sits), and the freebies don't really influence that because they're rarely what I want.

 

[Vespa]

I tend to book my First Class in advance with railcard, this works out better for me.

I don't know enough about Premium to make decision either way, the website explaining it didn't inspire too much confidence especially with seat picker website issues

 

[Bletchleyite]

I tend to book my First Class in advance with railcard, this works out better for me.

And that's fine, keep doing so. This isn't intended to do anything for those who currently happily travel First Class at the current fare set, because they are already paying a premium fare. Its purpose is to increase income by attracting people who presently travel Standard to upgrade, while keeping that existing First Class income as much as possible (though I'm sure some will downgrade).

 

[Vespa]

And that's fine, keep doing so. This isn't intended to do anything for those who currently happily travel First Class at the current fare set, because they are already paying a premium fare. Its purpose is to increase income by attracting people who presently travel Standard to upgrade, while keeping that existing First Class income as much as possible (though I'm sure some will downgrade).

Indeed, at present there's not a lot of detail on how premium will work in practice.

Nobody has yet reported back on their experience.

 

[Skie]

Back when delay repay netted you just vouchers, a First upgrade was always an occasional treat when heading home from Londinium or on the next trip down. Now that delay repay is cold hard cash, it's a little bit more difficult to justify with the walk up fare being so extortionate pre-covid. I guess this might fit into the treat category, but I still maintain £25 for a nicer seat/environ and then the 'ability' to pay more for food is outside of the 'treat' range. £20-£25 and a tea/coffee and filled roll, now that would get some usage.

 

[Scotrail314209]

I've got a feeling the web page might've been put up by accident, as it seems that there was no social media announcement about it.

 

[Skie]

The page was up a few months ago and then pulled during Lockdown 2. I'd bet they are suspending the trial again due to the increased restrictions.

 

[Mikey C]

The first class seating on Pendolinos is a major step up from standard class, with far more room and comfort, and a much less claustrophobic feel, for a sensible premium I'd definitely be interested. I'm happy to bring my own "liquid" refreshments anyway

 

[Aictos]

Sounds a good idea, maybe they could rename First Class to Business Premier aka Eurostar.... Seriously though, I do like the idea and wish them all the best.

I've got a feeling the web page might've been put up by accident, as it seems that there was no social media announcement about it.

Actually and this was confirmed by the TOC in question but their reply was yes there was a trial of Standard Premier on a limited number of London to Birmingham services between the 7th and 18th December 2020 and yes there are still plans to introduce it in the future at some point.

Personally it's something I would use on the Anglo Scottish services as it ticks all my requirements of a train journey.

The page was up a few months ago and then pulled during Lockdown 2. I'd bet they are suspending the trial again due to the increased restrictions.

The end of the trial has nothing to do with any restrictions or lockdowns but is rather as the key word Trial says is simply a trial so could end earlier or finish later regardless.

 

[Wolfie]

Sounds a good idea, maybe they could rename First Class to Business Premier aka Eurostar.... Seriously though, I do like the idea and wish them all the best.


Actually and this was confirmed by the TOC in question but their reply was yes there was a trial of Standard Premier on a limited number of London to Birmingham services between the 7th and 18th December 2020 and yes there are still plans to introduce it in the future at some point.

Personally it's something I would use on the Anglo Scottish services as it ticks all my requirements of a train journey.


The end of the trial has nothing to do with any restrictions or lockdowns but is rather as the key word Trial says is simply a trial so could end earlier or finish later regardless.

A trial which isn't publicised is hardly representative.

 

[Clansman]

What was this 'trial'? Presumably just a bog standard upgrade announcement from the guard akin to the weekend offers?

 

[Vespa]

I suspect with Premier class you get the seat, but no first class meal or use of the lounges.

 

[ricoblade]

I'd like this. I like to travel first because of the room and am often working on the train (one of the great boons of rail travel IMHO). I rarely use the "freebies", the food and drink is not that good and you get very small portions anwyay.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'd like this. I like to travel first because of the room and am often working on the train (one of the great boons of rail travel IMHO). I rarely use the "freebies", the food and drink is not that good and you get very small portions anwyay.

Pretty much exactly how I see it. Indeed, it's how I believe all First Class should be. If you want food, buy it - as easyJet and Ryanair have demonstrated (and now BA on short-haul) you can have a much better range if you only have to cater for a smaller number of people wanting it. I'd concede to free tea, coffee and water, though, as most people will enjoy one of those.

 

[py_megapixel]

Honestly I think charging a small supplement for lounge access wouldn't be a bad idea either. I'd have thought there are plenty of First passengers who don't make use of the lounge, and plenty of Standard passengers who would happily pay for the upgrade before a long journey if they were given the chance, but don't want all the First amenities. I know a few times when I would have done.

 

[YorksLad12]

Pretty much exactly how I see it. Indeed, it's how I believe all First Class should be. If you want food, buy it - as easyJet and Ryanair have demonstrated (and now BA on short-haul) you can have a much better range if you only have to cater for a smaller number of people wanting it. I'd concede to free tea, coffee and water, though, as most people will enjoy one of those.

Careful, you'll get lynched by the East Coast crowd. We love our at-seat service and hot breakfasts/dinners!

 

[Scotrail314209]

Pretty much exactly how I see it. Indeed, it's how I believe all First Class should be. If you want food, buy it - as easyJet and Ryanair have demonstrated (and now BA on short-haul) you can have a much better range if you only have to cater for a smaller number of people wanting it. I'd concede to free tea, coffee and water, though, as most people will enjoy one of those.

On the food situation, particularly at weekdays you need to remember that cutting the food means cutting jobs, which means all the onboard chefs will be out of a job if thats the case, and I can't see them being too pleased with that.

 

[Vespa]

Honestly I think charging a small supplement for lounge access wouldn't be a bad idea either. I'd have thought there are plenty of First passengers who don't make use of the lounge, and plenty of Standard passengers who would happily pay for the upgrade before a long journey if they were given the chance, but don't want all the First amenities. I know a few times when I would have done.

Re my bold, do you have any evidence of this ? Genuine question because whenever I go into Euston First Class lounge its very busy and popular, indeed any other First Class lounge seemed to be utilised.

I certainly would as I paid for it, I'm going to use it to the full, hoovering up all the perks and benefits of it, coffees and nibbles, TV time and comfortable seats, I would absolutely milk it

 

[Bletchleyite]

On the food situation, particularly at weekdays you need to remember that cutting the food means cutting jobs, which means all the onboard chefs will be out of a job if thats the case, and I can't see them being too pleased with that.

It's always sad if someone loses a job they love, but the railway is not a job-creation scheme and as such people should be employed if they are required, not for the sake of it.

 

[py_megapixel]

Re my bold, do you have any evidence of this ? Genuine question because whenever I go into Euston First Class lounge its very busy and popular, indeed any other First Class lounge seemed to be utilised.

I don't have any specific evidence, no, and if it's busy, that's probably why they don't want to let the cheapskates in Standard buy our way in.... (tounge in cheek)

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don't have any specific evidence, no, and if it's busy, that's probably why they don't want to let the cheapskates in Standard buy our way in.... (tounge in cheek)

I wonder if Network Rail could make money out of offering their own paid-for lounge facility?

 

[takno]

Re my bold, do you have any evidence of this ? Genuine question because whenever I go into Euston First Class lounge its very busy and popular, indeed any other First Class lounge seemed to be utilised.

I certainly would as I paid for it, I'm going to use it to the full, hoovering up all the perks and benefits of it, coffees and nibbles, TV time and comfortable seats, I would absolutely milk it

I've never made much use of them - most of the time I'm aiming to show up at the station a few minutes before departure and going straight to the platform, and none of the train ones have any freebies that are really worth the effort anyway.

 

[gaillark]

As a frequent first class customer ...

My opinion is that Standard Premier should be a simple supplement say £15 for short journeys of upto 80 miles rising to £35 for others with railcard discounts allowed. Benefits would include better seat and complimentary light refreshments such as tea/coffee/juice/water with an option to buy food. This would be very similar to the all day menu at East Midlands Railway first class offering whereby food is paid for. Works quite well. (Obviously pre covid - No catering at all on EMR curently including first).
Chiltern Railways until a few years ago had a superb "Business Zone" product on its Silver Trains which was very well used. They used to have an operational Expresso Bar on the train with the steward serving complimentary tea/coffee/water and juice to Business Zone customers who paid £25 per seat ontop of any standard class ticket you held. In addition the steward took orders for simple but great value and quality freshly cooked food which you paid for.
Chiltern Railways Business Zone was excellent and this is what Avanti seek to recreate in my opinion but today's Chiltern Business Zone is very poor as they got rid of all catering and you still pay a supplement for the first class seat but you often don't get anything else. Now mostly go by car whereas Chiltern was my first choice before.

First Class needs significant improvement in terms of food quality, on-board service, availabilty and ranges of hot food provided all day. Items such as freshly cooked steaks to be offered as meals by way of an example. (A single rump steak at M&S can be bought for less than £4 so the total food cost outlay to Avanti would not be that high). Say £10 per head in ingredients would see a huge improvement in the offering. Also the proper first class carriage needs to be a whole length coach not just the kitchen car which I dislike.
Regarding first class lounges I find Euston quite unpleasant because its crowded most of the time and people filling up on free snacks. I personally would like to see Euston lounge split into two destinctive areas. One for first class walk on customers whereby alcholic drinks and better food and snacks be served separated from the "advance ticket holders" whereby the current offering can remain.
First Class needs a massive uplift in quality and service as well as a reduction in anytime and first off peak return fares.
If Avanti do not significantly improve that first class offering then I would downgrade to standard premier as I would resent paying a huge premium for very poor inferior quality food and service. This could possibly be the beginning of the end for first class. Get the product right in quality and price and people will use it.

 

[jfollows]

Re my bold, do you have any evidence of this ? Genuine question because whenever I go into Euston First Class lounge its very busy and popular, indeed any other First Class lounge seemed to be utilised.

I certainly would as I paid for it, I'm going to use it to the full, hoovering up all the perks and benefits of it, coffees and nibbles, TV time and comfortable seats, I would absolutely milk it

I'm only me, but I usually travel First Class and I never use the First Class lounges. If I have time to kill at Euston I go to the Doric Arch and pay for a pint of ESB and find myself a comfy chair.

Maybe I should add that, although I've not been to the Euston lounge for ten years or more now, I was originally put off because it was busy and scruffy and noisy. I just didn't see the point then, nor do I today. But some people like them, that's fine, but I'm not interested.

On the train I would prefer better food that I pay for rather than the free food, although the morning breakfast service is OK I would prefer something better in the evenings and wouldn't mind paying extra for it.

 

[gaillark]

I'm only me, but I usually travel First Class and I never use the First Class lounges. If I have time to kill at Euston I go to the Doric Arch and pay for a pint of ESB and find myself a comfy chair.

I do agree with you that there are better places than the Euston lounge but I do like the Crewe lounge and use that one when I am in the area. I did like Coventry as it had a good view, spacious and could relax. Euston. no!

 

[route101]

I would be happy to pay for food, for bigger portions, better quality!

Yes, last time I was in Euston lounge it was mobbed. I want a quiet place to relax.

 

[Vespa]

As a frequent first class customer ...

My opinion

As a frequent first class customer ...

Regarding first class lounges I find Euston quite unpleasant because its crowded most of the time and people filling up on free snacks. I personally would like to see Euston lounge split into two destinctive areas. One for first class walk on customers whereby alcholic drinks and better food and snacks be served separated from the "advance ticket holders" whereby the current offering can remain.

I'm a regular First Class customer albeit with a disabled railcard, I would not want The first class to be split into two different areas one for walk ons the other for advance fares.

First Class is more democratic now than it used be, it's not the 1930s anymore, no doffing of hats etc.

I prefer it that way, that said I like Liverpool Lime Street lounge its interesting, I prefer to use lounges simply because I can relax before catching the train in good time.

Very similar to airport lounges, you pay money to use a service, same as First Class service.