The future of Barlaston / Norton Bridge / Wedgwood railway stations.

[Batman]

Upon closer inspection, the timetable booklet stated ‘Norton Bridge Station Drive’ as a calling point, not the actual station. So it appears that they’ve simply failed to remove it from the timetable and are treating it as a random additional bus calling point that they’ve bothered printing in the timetable booklet. That’s despite the fact that the station that stop previously substituted for no longer exists.

However, the same timetable also fails to record Wedgewood and Barlaaton as bud calling points and instead lists as location in those villages. How does that work from a legal perspective when the main reason for this bus service is to serve those stations that would otherwise be without any kind of service?

I bet the bit about checking online journey planners is the get out clause for if, or more likely when, the bus service between Stafford and Stone via Norton Bridge is withdrawn in March.

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Upon closer inspection, the timetable booklet stated ‘Norton Bridge Station Drive’ as a calling point, not the actual station. So it appears that they’ve simply failed to remove it from the timetable and are treating it as a random additional bus calling point that they’ve bothered printing in the timetable booklet. That’s despite the fact that the station that stop previously substituted for no longer exists.

However, the same timetable also fails to record Wedgewood and Barlaaton as bud calling points and instead lists as location in those villages. How does that work from a legal perspective when the main reason for this bus service is to serve those stations that would otherwise be without any kind of service?

I bet the bit about checking online journey planners is the get out clause for if, or more likely when, the bus service between Stafford and Stone via Norton Bridge is withdrawn in March.

The bus (service 14) doesn't call at either Wedgwood or Barlaston Stations. The route does not pass either station. Barlaston is quite close, Wedgwood quite some distance and with poorly located stopping points. The bus service exists as a bus service in itself, conveniently financially supported by some rail money.

Is it legal, who knows? Can you afford a judicial review to find out? I certainly can't. All of the organisations involved seem to be happy with the present arrangement. Now, if the residents of Barlaston Park (the council estate near to Wedgwood Station), whose bus service was removed in March 2018, were to make a fuss about the rail replacement bus not actually serving Wedgwood, they may find that as an effective way of getting their bus service re-instated. But they aren't a campaigning type of resident.

 

[Barnsley]

Still the old Regional Railways name boards on both stations.are there any other stations still with them?

There are 2 old Regional Railways name boards on each platform at Harling Road station, I’m on the 1548 ghost train from Norwich, nobody got off there or Eccles Road!

 

[LowLevel]

There are 2 old Regional Railways name boards on each platform at Harling Road station, I’m on the 1548 ghost train from Norwich, nobody got off there or Eccles Road!

Not really surprising on New Years Day! There's a couple of school kids and the odd extra person who use them.

 

[Deafdoggie]

Interestingly they have put a fence halfway down Wedgwood down platform, and a safety flooring down on the poor condition platform. All this on a disused platform with no access!

I took a photo, but can’t fathom how to add it!

 

[Esker-pades]

Interestingly they have put a fence halfway down Wedgwood down platform, and a safety flooring down on the poor condition platform. All this on a disused platform with no access!

I took a photo, but can’t fathom how to add it!

Choose the "Upload a File" option when commenting and then add the photo from your computer.

 

[Deafdoggie]

Choose the "Upload a File" option when commenting and then add the photo from your computer.

I was on my phone. Couldn’t work that out! Went through every other option. Thank you!

 

[LowLevel]

With evacuating trains in an emergency being a key issue at the moment disused stations are featured as a preference to evacuate people just behind open stations. Hence I imagine the effort to maintain surfaces in a basic useful state.

 

[Deafdoggie]

The Norton Bridge bus is being removed from 1st April

https://www.dgbus.co.uk/assets/14,14a,14w_2019-04-01.pdf


The D&G bus website lists this as being due to removal of railway funding

https://www.dgbus.co.uk/buses-in-staffordshire-and-stoke-on-trent.html

 

[ccityplanner12]

I don't see how there isn't enough capacity to stop at these stations:
Fit the Birmingham – Crewe train into the phase in the timetable when the Manchester express goes via Crewe. This leaves a 40-minute gap.
The Crewe – Birmingham stops at Stone and Kidsgrove. The acceleration for these stations probably consumes about 1 minute each.
38 - 8 = 30 due to requirement to maintain a four-minute gap.
Each station should take about 2 minutes to stop at for a modern train with fast acceleration like a 350, which brings our gap down to 26 minutes, which is plenty. To be temerarious with the timetable you might even be able to fit in a stop at Longport, or a quick connection with the Manchester via Crewe express at Stafford.

 

[hwl]

I don't see how there isn't enough capacity to stop at these stations:
Fit the Birmingham – Crewe train into the phase in the timetable when the Manchester express goes via Crewe. This leaves a 40-minute gap.
The Crewe – Birmingham stops at Stone and Kidsgrove. The acceleration for these stations probably consumes about 1 minute each.
38 - 8 = 30 due to requirement to maintain a four-minute gap.
Each station should take about 2 minutes to stop at for a modern train with fast acceleration like a 350, which brings our gap down to 26 minutes, which is plenty. To be temerarious with the timetable you might even be able to fit in a stop at Longport, or a quick connection with the Manchester via Crewe express at Stafford.

What about the 75mph freight services following the expresses...

 

[Ianno87]

I don't see how there isn't enough capacity to stop at these stations:
Fit the Birmingham – Crewe train into the phase in the timetable when the Manchester express goes via Crewe. This leaves a 40-minute gap.
The Crewe – Birmingham stops at Stone and Kidsgrove. The acceleration for these stations probably consumes about 1 minute each.
38 - 8 = 30 due to requirement to maintain a four-minute gap.
Each station should take about 2 minutes to stop at for a modern train with fast acceleration like a 350, which brings our gap down to 26 minutes, which is plenty. To be temerarious with the timetable you might even be able to fit in a stop at Longport, or a quick connection with the Manchester via Crewe express at Stafford.

Fine....if you disregard all the other pathing constraints on the service, such as:
-North Staffs-Barthomley single line
-Kidsgrove and Stone flat junctions
-Freights on the slows through Stafford
-Paths between Wolverhampton North Jn and Birmingham
-Etc.

350s tend to be more 2.5-3 minutes penalty per stop. Renember they need 45 second dwells for their longer door cycles even if their acceleration is impressive.

Plus there is not a "40 minute gap", as the flight of fasts via Stoke starts with (off Piccadilly) the xx07 Cross Country and ends with the xx35 Euston. So more like a 32 minute gap...

 

[The Planner]

I don't see how there isn't enough capacity to stop at these stations:
Fit the Birmingham – Crewe train into the phase in the timetable when the Manchester express goes via Crewe. This leaves a 40-minute gap.
The Crewe – Birmingham stops at Stone and Kidsgrove. The acceleration for these stations probably consumes about 1 minute each.
38 - 8 = 30 due to requirement to maintain a four-minute gap.
Each station should take about 2 minutes to stop at for a modern train with fast acceleration like a 350, which brings our gap down to 26 minutes, which is plenty. To be temerarious with the timetable you might even be able to fit in a stop at Longport, or a quick connection with the Manchester via Crewe express at Stafford.

As it stands, you need the current northbound trains to be around 3 or 4 minutes earlier to get far enough in front of the following XC if you want to stop at one of Wedgwood or Barlaston which you cannot do as the Virgin to Glasgow is in front of you at New Street. Southbound it doesn't work as you would be in the way of the TfW at Wolves.

 

[toby_farman]

So I was wondering if anyone knew what was happening to Barlaston and Wedgwood...
No real services since 2004 for both of them but related Norton Bridge officially closed in 2017 (but not gonna complain about that).

According to Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barlaston_railway_station) Barlaston is going to reopen in 2020/2021 and Wedgwood will officially close...

I've also heard that Wedgwood has unsafe platforms whereas Barlaston is closer to a larger community and easier to open.

PS. Barlaston and Wedgwood are both on the Stafford–Manchester line, a branch of the WCML

 

[Deafdoggie]

They are very close together. There’s really no need for both. Although there is new housing being built at Wedgwood, realistically more passengers would use Barlaston out of the two. With the increase in trains since 2004 pathing trains to call at both, whilst possible, would be problematic and the potential to cause disruption would be high.
Wedgwood has had safety boards placed on its wooden platform and is in worse condition of the two.
The biggest issue is that the RRB is a service bus. Very few train tickets are used and mainly senior citizen passes used. Without the rail funding the bus service will decrease, so it’s not actually that popular to reinstate trains with the local public transport using population!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

So I was wondering if anyone knew what was happening to Barlaston and Wedgwood...
No real services since 2004 for both of them but related Norton Bridge officially closed in 2017 (but not gonna complain about that).

According to Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barlaston_railway_station) Barlaston is going to reopen in 2020/2021 and Wedgwood will officially close...

I've also heard that Wedgwood has unsafe platforms whereas Barlaston is closer to a larger community and easier to open.
Is there anything preventing a full return to services for both of them, or does the official closure and demolition of Wedgwood now look inevitable?

PS. Barlaston and Wedgwood are both on the Stafford–Manchester line, a branch of the WCML

Not sure about the Wikipedia article. As far as I know, no announcements have been made about either Wedgwood or Barlaston. The bidders for the London Midland franchise were invited to submit options to serve the stations (one, the other, both or perhaps neither) but the formal announcement was silent on the issue. The Wikipedia article offers the following as its source ([Rail. No. 867. p. 27. Missing or empty |title= (help)]

Barlaston is near an existing village and has a small car park.
Wedgwood is near a new development of executive homes, the Wedgwood Experience and, potentially, has a large car park.
Both have poor access to the main road network so neither could really be considered as park and ride locations to serve the surrounding area.
Both have poor pedestrian access, requiring use of an adjacent level crossing rather than a footbridge or subway.
As an aside, Stone also has very limited car parking.

 

[toby_farman]

They are very close together. There’s really no need for both. Although there is new housing being built at Wedgwood, realistically more passengers would use Barlaston out of the two. With the increase in trains since 2004 pathing trains to call at both, whilst possible, would be problematic and the potential to cause disruption would be high.
Wedgwood has had safety boards placed on its wooden platform and is in worse condition of the two.
The biggest issue is that the RRB is a service bus. Very few train tickets are used and mainly senior citizen passes used. Without the rail funding the bus service will decrease, so it’s not actually that popular to reinstate trains with the local public transport using population!

Yes, Barlaston would be used more, but if neither were re-opened then I think that would be a disaster. Do you agree?

 

[Baxenden Bank]

They are very close together. There’s really no need for both. Although there is new housing being built at Wedgwood, realistically more passengers would use Barlaston out of the two. With the increase in trains since 2004 pathing trains to call at both, whilst possible, would be problematic and the potential to cause disruption would be high.
Wedgwood has had safety boards placed on its wooden platform and is in worse condition of the two.
The biggest issue is that the RRB is a service bus. Very few train tickets are used and mainly senior citizen passes used. Without the rail funding the bus service will decrease, so it’s not actually that popular to reinstate trains with the local public transport using population!

Without the rail support, I suspect the bus service will cease rather than decrease - except perhaps for a couple of school journeys.

The train is actually cheaper than the bus so, if you get your ticket from the station first, it is the better option (£3.20 single Stone to Hanley on the 14, £5.00 single on the First 101, £2.50 single by train but to Stoke rather than Hanley of course). Pensioners go free on the bus of course.

 

[toby_farman]

Not sure about the Wikipedia article. As far as I know, no announcements have been made about either Wedgwood or Barlaston. The bidders for the London Midland franchise were invited to submit options to serve the stations (one, the other, both or perhaps neither) but the formal announcement was silent on the issue. The Wikipedia article offers the following as its source ([Rail. No. 867. p. 27. Missing or empty |title= (help)]

Barlaston is near an existing village and has a small car park.
Wedgwood is near a new development of executive homes, the Wedgwood Experience and, potentially, has a large car park.
Both have poor access to the main road network so neither could really be considered as park and ride locations to serve the surrounding area.
Both have poor pedestrian access, requiring use of an adjacent level crossing rather than a footbridge or subway.
As an aside, Stone also has very limited car parking.

As far as I can see, the general public favours Barlaston for reopening.

Here are some links to more material relating Barlaston reopening:
https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commo...ningOfBarlastonRailwayStation(Stoke-On-Trent)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/stoke/hi/people_and_places/history/newsid_8871000/8871511.stm

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Yes, Barlaston would be used more, but if neither were re-opened then I think that would be a disaster. Do you agree?

I think disaster would be over-stating it. Unfortunate perhaps, disappointing certainly. But people seem to have managed since 2002.

 

[toby_farman]

I think disaster would be over-stating it. Unfortunate perhaps, disappointing certainly. But people seem to have managed since 2002.

2004 actually.

It'd be nice to see a station that closed 16 years ago reopened however, and Barlaston seems to be favoured for reopening, because it's platforms are supposedly safer than the ones at Wedgwood...

 

[toby_farman]

One of the platforms at Barlaston looks a little worn (img date: 2016)

 

[toby_farman]

It's even worse at Wedgwood - the platforms are looking low... (img date: 2018)
Perhaps Barlaston is a better candidate for reopening?

 

[toby_farman]

I found the reason why Wedgwood can't reopen

 

[Deafdoggie]

Barlaston platform has been re-edged. Wedgwood platforms would realistically need rebuilding.

Yes, Barlaston would be used more, but if neither were re-opened then I think that would be a disaster. Do you agree?

I don’t think it would be a disaster, no. Disappointing possibly. Of course, if officially closed the RRB funding would cease anyway. But hopefully some service may survive. If the station reopened it’s doubtful anything would survive off the bus service.
The current situation, strange though it may seem, suits the locals quite well.

Not sure about the Wikipedia article. As far as I know, no announcements have been made about either Wedgwood or Barlaston. The bidders for the London Midland franchise were invited to submit options to serve the stations (one, the other, both or perhaps neither) but the formal announcement was silent on the issue. The Wikipedia article offers the following as its source ([Rail. No. 867. p. 27. Missing or empty |title= (help)]

Barlaston is near an existing village and has a small car park.
Wedgwood is near a new development of executive homes, the Wedgwood Experience and, potentially, has a large car park.
Both have poor access to the main road network so neither could really be considered as park and ride locations to serve the surrounding area.
Both have poor pedestrian access, requiring use of an adjacent level crossing rather than a footbridge or subway.
As an aside, Stone also has very limited car parking.

Wedgwood station is on private land on a private road next to a weight restricted bridge. It’s access really isn’t ideal.
Wedgwood station was built for the factory workers, I can’t see the modern train service matching the factory shift patterns now, so it would only be of use to visitors or owners of the large and expensive executive homes being built-the sort of people unlikely to be using a local train service. If a station reopened it really has to be Barlaston.

 

[toby_farman]

Barlaston platform has been re-edged. Wedgwood platforms would realistically need rebuilding.

I don’t think it would be a disaster, no. Disappointing possibly. Of course, if officially closed the RRB funding would cease anyway. But hopefully some service may survive. If the station reopened it’s doubtful anything would survive off the bus service.
The current situation, strange though it may seem, suits the locals quite well.

Wedgwood station is on private land on a private road next to a weight restricted bridge. It’s access really isn’t ideal.
Wedgwood station was built for the factory workers, I can’t see the modern train service matching the factory shift patterns now, so it would only be of use to visitors or owners of the large and expensive executive homes being built-the sort of people unlikely to be using a local train service. If a station reopened it really has to be Barlaston.

Agreed

 

[Deafdoggie]

Without the rail support, I suspect the bus service will cease rather than decrease - except perhaps for a couple of school journeys.

The train is actually cheaper than the bus so, if you get your ticket from the station first, it is the better option (£3.20 single Stone to Hanley on the 14, £5.00 single on the First 101, £2.50 single by train but to Stoke rather than Hanley of course). Pensioners go free on the bus of course.

The bit I have put in bold in the quote above are the very crucial points. No one wants to go to Stoke. It’s Hanley or Newcastle (or Stafford). If you are then going to get the bus at Stoke station, much better to go all the way on one bus. And pretty much all passengers getting on/off at Barlaston have passes. The 101 doesn’t really go close enough to Barlaston that Rail passengers will be using that.

 

[Meerkat]

To be brutal neither of these places deserve a station, certainly not on a main line. Barlaston is less than 3,000 people and looks from the air like a high car ownership kind of place and unless the Wedgwood museum is a significant visitor magnet Wedgwood is even less viable. This is bus service territory.
If there is a desperation to add stops to the line Trentham looks far more viable.

 

[onlinespotting]

To be brutal neither of these places deserve a station, certainly not on a main line. Barlaston is less than 3,000 people and looks from the air like a high car ownership kind of place and unless the Wedgwood museum is a significant visitor magnet Wedgwood is even less viable. This is bus service territory.
If there is a desperation to add stops to the line Trentham looks far more viable.

To be honest how many places with stations could you say that about? The only reason it’s bus service territory is because they are technically rail replacement buses. Which may not exist had there not been a train station. There are also many new housing developments around the area now. A misguided comment in my opinion.

 

[Deafdoggie]

To be brutal neither of these places deserve a station, certainly not on a main line. Barlaston is less than 3,000 people and looks from the air like a high car ownership kind of place and unless the Wedgwood museum is a significant visitor magnet Wedgwood is even less viable. This is bus service territory.
If there is a desperation to add stops to the line Trentham looks far more viable.

Agreed. Barlaston is never going to be a busy station. Whilst very good, the World Of Wedgwood isn’t going to be tourist magnet for those travelling by rail.
Trentham is the kind of place where you have two cars and a pony, and it’s proximity to Stoke & Longton makes a station there fairly pointless. If the line were closer to the Trentham Gardens Estate, that may be a tourist magnet (more coaches go there than Wedgwood) but alas, the line is too far away for it to appeal to visitors.
However, people on here don’t like stations closing so I suspect one will survive. With Staffordshire having already lost Etruria and Norton Bridge, there probably isn’t the political will to loose both Wedgwood and Barlaston.