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A career as a train driver

Stigy

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6 Nov 2009
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4,881
If you were to apply whilst currently employed, and were successful (very hopeful I know). Would it be possible to request being put in the talent pool until you become free from your current contract. Clearly there could be a gap between leaving the current job and starting a course, which also may never happen.
If you applied specifically for a talent pool, it's more likely you'll have to just go with the flow and if they contact you before you're able to leave your current job, you'll have to tell them about it and I would imagine they'll keep you in the pool until another course is available. From what I've read here, most TOCs appreciate the fact that you can't put your life on hold for a job which may or may not materialise.

If you are applying for a job vacancy rather than a place in a pool, you obviously can't ask to be kept in a pool until you're free to leave your current job, as that's not how it works (although admittedly railway recruitment historically is painfully slow so one would be forgiven for assuming most TOCs would still adopt the "can't put your life on hold" ethos...).
 
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Stigy

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Congrats for making it to the talent pool! I’m currently applying for a trainee driver role with Northern.

As part of my application I had to give details of someone to provide a future reference. Do you know at which point this will be used? I’m concerned it will alert my current employer to the face I’ve applied to Northern, so I’ll have to hand my notice in, but then could sit in the talent pool longer than my notice period! How does it work in practice please?
Most companies will by default only contact references once an offer has been made. Others will ask if it's okay to contact your references before an offer is made. The best was to find out definitely, is to contact recruitment.
 

richfoz84

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13 Oct 2018
Messages
344
Thanks for the reply, how did you find your two experiences and what do plan on doing next in terms of driving?

My first application with TFW I didn’t pass the papersift. A month later re applied and had a telephone interview, never had one before! Lots of research on the company and the role, with notes in front of me to prompt me during it. Then invited to a face to face interview in a Chester. This was very relaxed and as I had done lots of prep o was confident. Passed this; then within 4 weeks went to Cardiff for an assessment. I had 8 days to prepare with the material they sent out. As I work 6 days a week it was tough to find the time. I had to catch them train straight from work, 3 hours later arrived at the hotel they pay for. Ended up with a crap nights sleep so didn’t fee 100%, failed 2 parts of the assessment.. gutted!

With northern; I applied Sept ‘19, email Jan ‘20 with 6 days notice inviting me to interview in Manchester. On paternity leave so plenty of time to prepare. Again went in confident. 3 days later found out I passed.. same day they invite me to assessment a week later in Doncaster. Fortunately I found out that the parts I passed with TFW would count, so focused on the bits I failed on. 4 started the day, only I passed. The MMI was so tough!! I drove home which was 2hrs 30 mins and as I pulled up on the drive I got a call, which was HR asking me could I do a medical in a weeks time then start in 5 weeks time! I did the medical but couldn’t start the end of March as a holiday in a June so they placed me in a talent pool.
 

richfoz84

Member
Joined
13 Oct 2018
Messages
344
Congrats for making it to the talent pool! I’m currently applying for a trainee driver role with Northern.

As part of my application I had to give details of someone to provide a future reference. Do you know at which point this will be used? I’m concerned it will alert my current employer to the face I’ve applied to Northern, so I’ll have to hand my notice in, but then could sit in the talent pool longer than my notice period! How does it work in practice please?

They still haven’t contacted my employer and they will know once I hand my notice in, whenever that will be!
 

MartinSmyth

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Joined
4 May 2020
Messages
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Location
Welwyn Garden City
Hi guys. First post here. I have been signed up to a few mailing lists including GTR, but i have never received any alerts for trainee opportunities, therefore i assumed nothing was ever going in my area. Especially with the economy as it is now I don’t hold out much hope for opportunities, but for a couple of years now i have been thinking more and more of leaving my current employer if i was able to get a job as a train driver. So a few questions.

1) Is there a site i should be signed up to and does anybody have any insight as to how often these vacancies may arise?

2)I live in Welwyn Garden City, where is the nearest place i would need to commute to to start a shift? I only wonder out of curiosity how i would start or finish a shift if its the first train of the day or last.

3) How long is the training, would i need to remain employed with my current company while i undertake the aptitude tests etc, or are you salaried once you pass the interview?

4) From the moment i apply for a vacancy to the moment i would require a medical, how long could this period be? Do you require one straight away upon being interviewed? Or once you begin training? Or only once you have passed all of your tests and been offered a role as a train driver?

5) Is there anything i can do in the meanwhile to make my application look favourable should an opportunity be listed? I have considered a train simulator program on the PS4 for example.

Thanks for your time. Apologies if any of the answers to these questions are posted elsewhere.
 

387star

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Hi guys. First post here. I have been signed up to a few mailing lists including GTR, but i have never received any alerts for trainee opportunities, therefore i assumed nothing was ever going in my area. Especially with the economy as it is now I don’t hold out much hope for opportunities, but for a couple of years now i have been thinking more and more of leaving my current employer if i was able to get a job as a train driver. So a few questions.

1) Is there a site i should be signed up to and does anybody have any insight as to how often these vacancies may arise?

2)I live in Welwyn Garden City, where is the nearest place i would need to commute to to start a shift? I only wonder out of curiosity how i would start or finish a shift if its the first train of the day or last.

3) How long is the training, would i need to remain employed with my current company while i undertake the aptitude tests etc, or are you salaried once you pass the interview?

4) From the moment i apply for a vacancy to the moment i would require a medical, how long could this period be? Do you require one straight away upon being interviewed? Or once you begin training? Or only once you have passed all of your tests and been offered a role as a train driver?

5) Is there anything i can do in the meanwhile to make my application look favourable should an opportunity be listed? I have considered a train simulator program on the PS4 for example.

Thanks for your time. Apologies if any of the answers to these questions are posted elsewhere.
Welwyn has a depot now so it's the perfect location for you
Hitchin just up the road has a depot . Other nearby depots are Hornsey and I guess Cambridge
 

Stigy

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6 Nov 2009
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4,881
Hi guys. First post here. I have been signed up to a few mailing lists including GTR, but i have never received any alerts for trainee opportunities, therefore i assumed nothing was ever going in my area. Especially with the economy as it is now I don’t hold out much hope for opportunities, but for a couple of years now i have been thinking more and more of leaving my current employer if i was able to get a job as a train driver. So a few questions.

1) Is there a site i should be signed up to and does anybody have any insight as to how often these vacancies may arise?

2)I live in Welwyn Garden City, where is the nearest place i would need to commute to to start a shift? I only wonder out of curiosity how i would start or finish a shift if its the first train of the day or last.

3) How long is the training, would i need to remain employed with my current company while i undertake the aptitude tests etc, or are you salaried once you pass the interview?

4) From the moment i apply for a vacancy to the moment i would require a medical, how long could this period be? Do you require one straight away upon being interviewed? Or once you begin training? Or only once you have passed all of your tests and been offered a role as a train driver?

5) Is there anything i can do in the meanwhile to make my application look favourable should an opportunity be listed? I have considered a train simulator program on the PS4 for example.

Thanks for your time. Apologies if any of the answers to these questions are posted elsewhere.
Hi Martin, welcome to the forum.

I’ll answer as best I can in order;

1) Being signed up to alerts is good, but I’d still be inclined to check the train operators or Freight operator websites once a week anyway as not all alerts work very well. Be prepared to drop everything to apply as adverts are seldom up for more than a few hours.

2) I’ll leave someone else to answer that one.

3) Training varies between company, but from start to finish you should factor in a training salary for at least a year. Classroom training is around 15 weeks usually. Again. This varies.

4) How long is a piece of string? Unfortunately it could be a couple of months, to several long months. In terms of the medical, this won’t be straight after an interview, as a job offer alone can take a fair few weeks to materialise, even if told you’ll hear in a few days.

5) The best advice I could give would be to make sure your CV is in tip top condition and try and tailor it to safety critical roles suck as driving if possible. Also try and jot down some examples from work or personal life that you could use at interview. Train Sim isn’t a waste of money necessarily (depending on your outlook on gaming etc), but it won’t do you much good in terms of preparing for recruitment campaigns etc. Even once driving, it’s not lifelike in that it’ll help you understand how to drive a train, as there’s far more to it than the basic driving controls and it’s more about rules and regulations than the actual physical driving.

Finally, don’t give up. It’s unlikely you’ll be successful first time and will fail papersifts etc. If you get there first time you’re lucky and you’ve done very well. This is a very competitive job to get, with hundreds if not thousands of applicants each time (hence why they close the adverts quickly). I don’t know what industry you’re in, but anyone can become a trainee driver as long as they have the aptitude and attitude to pass the tests and be trained. Some backgrounds will help you in terms of experiences, but don’t be put off if your current role is office based etc, loads of trainees come from this background. As the stages go by, it becomes easier after each hurdle. The main hurdle is the initial sift.

Hope this helps. Good luck.
 

MartinSmyth

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Joined
4 May 2020
Messages
10
Location
Welwyn Garden City
Hi Martin, welcome to the forum.

I’ll answer as best I can in order;

1) Being signed up to alerts is good, but I’d still be inclined to check the train operators or Freight operator websites once a week anyway as not all alerts work very well. Be prepared to drop everything to apply as adverts are seldom up for more than a few hours.

2) I’ll leave someone else to answer that one.

3) Training varies between company, but from start to finish you should factor in a training salary for at least a year. Classroom training is around 15 weeks usually. Again. This varies.

4) How long is a piece of string? Unfortunately it could be a couple of months, to several long months. In terms of the medical, this won’t be straight after an interview, as a job offer alone can take a fair few weeks to materialise, even if told you’ll hear in a few days.

5) The best advice I could give would be to make sure your CV is in tip top condition and try and tailor it to safety critical roles suck as driving if possible. Also try and jot down some examples from work or personal life that you could use at interview. Train Sim isn’t a waste of money necessarily (depending on your outlook on gaming etc), but it won’t do you much good in terms of preparing for recruitment campaigns etc. Even once driving, it’s not lifelike in that it’ll help you understand how to drive a train, as there’s far more to it than the basic driving controls and it’s more about rules and regulations than the actual physical driving.

Finally, don’t give up. It’s unlikely you’ll be successful first time and will fail papersifts etc. If you get there first time you’re lucky and you’ve done very well. This is a very competitive job to get, with hundreds if not thousands of applicants each time (hence why they close the adverts quickly). I don’t know what industry you’re in, but anyone can become a trainee driver as long as they have the aptitude and attitude to pass the tests and be trained. Some backgrounds will help you in terms of experiences, but don’t be put off if your current role is office based etc, loads of trainees come from this background. As the stages go by, it becomes easier after each hurdle. The main hurdle is the initial sift.

Hope this helps. Good luck.
I really appreciate your reply. I don’t want to sound arrogant but interview wise i feel confident because my current line of work has a few transferable qualities, like working to and meeting specific times and i feel like i come across quite well in an interview, so it would more depend on the tests i would have to do where i might get found out :rolleyes:.

On point one, do you have some suggestions of companies i should look out for? And is there a term used to describe a a hub where train drivers start work? Like a hub or depot? Like I don’t expect a shift to begin at my local station, would they all start at large stations like Kings Cross? Sorry if I’m coming across quite naively:D.
 

MartinSmyth

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Welwyn Garden City
Welwyn has a depot now so it's the perfect location for you
Hitchin just up the road has a depot . Other nearby depots are Hornsey and I guess Cambridge
Hello mate. Appreciate the response. What would be the best way to approach a role at welwyn depot? Should i show my face and say im really interested in joining the team and if they were able to forward me towards a department who looks after the recruitment there?
 

387star

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Hello mate. Appreciate the response. What would be the best way to approach a role at welwyn depot? Should i show my face and say im really interested in joining the team and if they were able to forward me towards a department who looks after the recruitment there?
Best thing to do is wait for vacancies to arise. I believe Hitchin and Kings Cross were downsized with many moving thrre so it might take a while for vacancies. Check GTR careers for Great Northern and Thameslink and check Greater Anglia as well for Cambridge.
 

Class2ldn

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Hello mate. Appreciate the response. What would be the best way to approach a role at welwyn depot? Should i show my face and say im really interested in joining the team and if they were able to forward me towards a department who looks after the recruitment there?
Doesn't work like that on the railway, you'll need to apply the same as everyone else.
Its a structured process.
 

S-Car-Go

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19 Mar 2019
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check Greater Anglia as well for Cambridge.
With Greater Anglia, they also have a depot at Bishops Stortford , which is near to WGC. Would mean a car commute all the time though.

Juat have to keep checking GTR & Greater Anglia recruitment sites on a regular basis. Don't rely on job alerts. Vacancies with a 2 week expiry WILL be pulled within a day or 2 max.
 

MartinSmyth

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Location
Welwyn Garden City
With Greater Anglia, they also have a depot at Bishops Stortford , which is near to WGC. Would mean a car commute all the time though.

Juat have to keep checking GTR & Greater Anglia recruitment sites on a regular basis. Don't rely on job alerts. Vacancies with a 2 week expiry WILL be pulled within a day or 2 max.
Yeh i have been checking daily thankyou. Out of interest, do these roles at depots include mainline driving? Or is just the role where you move the carridges around? (If i have read properly there are roles that offer this on substantially less pay so i was just wondering what i could potentially expect to see pop up opportunities wise. Thanks again.
 

Stigy

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Yeh i have been checking daily thankyou. Out of interest, do these roles at depots include mainline driving? Or is just the role where you move the carridges around? (If i have read properly there are roles that offer this on substantially less pay so i was just wondering what i could potentially expect to see pop up opportunities wise. Thanks again.
Unless you’re told otherwise or the question is specifically asked about depot driving, it’s usually all mainline driving roles at these depots. It’s merely a sign on point really.
 

S-Car-Go

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Unless you’re told otherwise or the question is specifically asked about depot driving, it’s usually all mainline driving roles at these depots. It’s merely a sign on point really.
Yup, when people think of railway depots, it's sidings and a big shed full of trains. That's a maintenance depot (or the posh modern term "Traincare facility centre"). Driver depots have signing on points, messroom facilities, maybe managers offices training rooms, lockers, etc. These are usually located at certain stations on the network.
 

baz962

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Yup, when people think of railway depots, it's sidings and a big shed full of trains. That's a maintenance depot (or the posh modern term "Traincare facility centre"). Driver depots have signing on points, messroom facilities, maybe managers offices training rooms, lockers, etc. These are usually located at certain stations on the network.
My depot is both a train maintenance depot and a driver's depot. We don't have depot driver's either , we have a shed turn on the rota and we get rostered on the depot.
 

Ell887

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22 Apr 2020
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Leeds
I’m planning on leaving my 12 year career in the RAF because I know I can walk into another job in the medical engineering sector. Mostly because I know once I move I can leave that much sooner than I could from the MOD. Would it look bad that I’ve left for another job (much better pay, much nearer a drivers wage than mine atm) because I’d only been there a couple of years. If I was honest in an interview and said I did it with driving in mind, would this look okay? I don’t want to be a driver for the money. After being in the RAF for my full career to date, I want structure, to learn, to be part of a strong organisation. I joined the military as a ‘career for life’ but I feel I’ve progressed there enough and I want a normal life. Driving might seem abnormal for many but for me it’d be far more normal that what I have now. Far too much politics, no union, pensions being altered every few years etc. That’s without the ‘you’re going here for 6 months’, working any hour they want with no reward, being at their back and call whenever they like. I know what I signed up for, but now I’m ready to leave that. It’s a young mans game and I don’t want it anymore. I’ve worked in situations I’ll never be able to forget, managed people that would be sacked in industry and had pressure that if things didn’t go to plan it’d have made the front pages. Yet I still think I’m vastly inexperienced to gain a trainees driver job. I don’t know if I’m giving up a good career to chase something that might never happen.

If anyone’s been in my situation, any advice would be much appreciated as I’m falling into the MOD pension trap and don’t want to become a victim of it.

Thanks in advance
 
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whoosh

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I’m planning on leaving my 12 year career in the RAF....

Plenty of ex-RAF, and other armed forces, police (constables and higher up) firefighters, paramedics, and prison officers. There's also insurance salesmen, McDonalds workers, a radio DJ, a carpet fitter, a supermarket manager, someone who worked in a scientific laboratory in Cambridge.... lots of people who now have a new career as a train driver.

I wouldn't worry too much about only being in a job for a short time - you'd have 12 years in the RAF previously, which would show you'd been stable in your employment. They'd look at the whole picture, and if you got an interview you'd be asked why you want to be a train driver and you'd be able to explain why.

On point one, do you have some suggestions of companies i should look out for? And is there a term used to describe a a hub where train drivers start work? Like a hub or depot? Like I don’t expect a shift to begin at my local station, would they all start at large stations like Kings Cross? Sorry if I’m coming across quite naively:D.

DB Cargo (a freight company) have 'hubs' which is a location where you are normally based but can be sent out to drive in your car or company van upto 60 minutes away before starting work.

All the TOCs (train operating companies - passenger trains) have you book on for work at the 'traincrew depot' you work at, and finish there at the end of your working day. If you have to pick up your train from another location, you will travel to it as a passenger during your working time.

With GTR, Hitchin depot was downsized and work moved to a new traincrew depot at Welwyn Garden City. There is a waiting list of drivers to move back to Hitchin, so you won't have any luck at the moment for Hitchin I'm afraid.
There is a waiting list for Welwyn Garden City as well, but some of the people on it haven't been productive for two years so can't move depots yet, so there may be recruitment that leapfrogs these.

Hornsey depot is more likely to have vacancies when there are any. The earliest start is something like 03:45, so you might have to drive for that duties like that one.
Sometimes though, drivers book on at Hornsey and travel to Finsbury Park to pick up a train. If you had a duty like that, you could arrange to book on at Welwyn traincrew depot and travel straight to Finsbury Park which would save you time.

GTR also have depots on another route (so perhaps more difficult to get to) at St Albans and Cricklewood.

Arriva Trains London (London Overground) have a traincrew depot at Chingford - don't know if that's too far for you?

Greater Anglia has a traincrew depot at Bishops Stortford as mentioned above - and also the point was made that advertised vacancies often close early.
 

387star

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Plenty of ex-RAF, and other armed forces, police (constables and higher up) firefighters, paramedics, and prison officers. There's also insurance salesmen, McDonalds workers, a radio DJ, a carpet fitter, a supermarket manager, someone who worked in a scientific laboratory in Cambridge.... lots of people who now have a new career as a train driver.

I wouldn't worry too much about only being in a job for a short time - you'd have 12 years in the RAF previously, which would show you'd been stable in your employment. They'd look at the whole picture, and if you got an interview you'd be asked why you want to be a train driver and you'd be able to explain why.



DB Cargo (a freight company) have 'hubs' which is a location where you are normally based but can be sent out to drive in your car or company van upto 60 minutes away before starting work.

All the TOCs (train operating companies - passenger trains) have you book on for work at the 'traincrew depot' you work at, and finish there at the end of your working day. If you have to pick up your train from another location, you will travel to it as a passenger during your working time.

With GTR, Hitchin depot was downsized and work moved to a new traincrew depot at Welwyn Garden City. There is a waiting list of drivers to move back to Hitchin, so you won't have any luck at the moment for Hitchin I'm afraid.
There is a waiting list for Welwyn Garden City as well, but some of the people on it haven't been productive for two years so can't move depots yet, so there may be recruitment that leapfrogs these.

Hornsey depot is more likely to have vacancies when there are any. The earliest start is something like 03:45, so you might have to drive for that duties like that one.
Sometimes though, drivers book on at Hornsey and travel to Finsbury Park to pick up a train. If you had a duty like that, you could arrange to book on at Welwyn traincrew depot and travel straight to Finsbury Park which would save you time.

GTR also have depots on another route (so perhaps more difficult to get to) at St Albans and Cricklewood.

Arriva Trains London (London Overground) have a traincrew depot at Chingford - don't know if that's too far for you?

Greater Anglia has a traincrew depot at Bishops Stortford as mentioned above - and also the point was made that advertised vacancies often close early.

I must have been lucky because I got the green light to move depot after having been qualified only seven months with TL whilst even a few trainees had their moves granted during the big depot shuffle

What do Hitchin sign? Is it more mainline than Welwyn?
 

whoosh

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What do Hitchin sign? Is it more mainline than Welwyn?

Yes, Hitchin sign to Peterborough which Welwyn don't, although they don't sign Nene Sidings or the shunt north of Peterborough anymore. They don't sign 700s though, so very few trips.

You used to be able to put in for a transfer as soon as you were productive - although sometimes people got moves in when still training. Now it's two years productive at your original depot before you join the transfer list.

Having said that, I know of trainees who have mutually swapped to both be at a closer depot to home, or one of them is closer and it makes no difference to the other one.
 
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MartinSmyth

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4 May 2020
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Welwyn Garden City
Plenty of ex-RAF, and other armed forces, police (constables and higher up) firefighters, paramedics, and prison officers. There's also insurance salesmen, McDonalds workers, a radio DJ, a carpet fitter, a supermarket manager, someone who worked in a scientific laboratory in Cambridge.... lots of people who now have a new career as a train driver.

I wouldn't worry too much about only being in a job for a short time - you'd have 12 years in the RAF previously, which would show you'd been stable in your employment. They'd look at the whole picture, and if you got an interview you'd be asked why you want to be a train driver and you'd be able to explain why.



DB Cargo (a freight company) have 'hubs' which is a location where you are normally based but can be sent out to drive in your car or company van upto 60 minutes away before starting work.

All the TOCs (train operating companies - passenger trains) have you book on for work at the 'traincrew depot' you work at, and finish there at the end of your working day. If you have to pick up your train from another location, you will travel to it as a passenger during your working time.

With GTR, Hitchin depot was downsized and work moved to a new traincrew depot at Welwyn Garden City. There is a waiting list of drivers to move back to Hitchin, so you won't have any luck at the moment for Hitchin I'm afraid.
There is a waiting list for Welwyn Garden City as well, but some of the people on it haven't been productive for two years so can't move depots yet, so there may be recruitment that leapfrogs these.

Hornsey depot is more likely to have vacancies when there are any. The earliest start is something like 03:45, so you might have to drive for that duties like that one.
Sometimes though, drivers book on at Hornsey and travel to Finsbury Park to pick up a train. If you had a duty like that, you could arrange to book on at Welwyn traincrew depot and travel straight to Finsbury Park which would save you time.

GTR also have depots on another route (so perhaps more difficult to get to) at St Albans and Cricklewood.

Arriva Trains London (London Overground) have a traincrew depot at Chingford - don't know if that's too far for you?

Greater Anglia has a traincrew depot at Bishops Stortford as mentioned above - and also the point was made that advertised vacancies often close early.
Maybe that's really good information, thankyou very much. I currently work in St Albans anyway so would be open to anywhere near to Welwyn Garden really. I also have started work at 3.30am a few times in the past too so that wouldn't concern me too much either. Anything to get my foot in the door would be awesome. Ill look at that DB Cargo place too as I'm already checking the GTR and Anglia websites daily.
 

baz962

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Maybe that's really good information, thankyou very much. I currently work in St Albans anyway so would be open to anywhere near to Welwyn Garden really. I also have started work at 3.30am a few times in the past too so that wouldn't concern me too much either. Anything to get my foot in the door would be awesome. Ill look at that DB Cargo place too as I'm already checking the GTR and Anglia websites daily.
London Overground don't recruit for Chingford.
 

Busandrail

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30 May 2018
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Out of interest, is it possible to fail during training? If so what any idea on the pass out / failure rate?
Definitely possible. Usually get 2 attempts at an exam and then extra training if its available but if deemed your just not upto it, its bye bye. We got told of a trainee who made it all the way to 200hr sim which is all but the last of your exams and failed and was let go

EDIT: We got told the pass rate is still very high. They give you everything you need to pass and its just generally a case of retaining information.
 

ComUtoR

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Out of interest, is it possible to fail during training? If so what any idea on the pass out / failure rate?

Very much possible to fail. Thankfully the failure rates drop off the further you go into each course. Its difficult to state specifically how many fail at each level and it will be different between each TOC. Some TOCs will also offer a second attempt, some are much more ruthless. For my TOC :

In a Rules class of about 10 I'd say losing 4/5 is not unheard of but easily 2/3 on a regular basis. Failing Traction happens regularly too and if your behind on rules I'd expect that person to not make it through. Losing another at Traction is common. During Manual Handling most will pass out. You still get people who don't but the failure rates are small. It's also a stage where people tend to quit. The reality of driving hits home quite hard and fast some some will walk away at this point.

Worst is after you pass. Not everyone makes their first year :( Again, its low but it happens enough to be significant.
 

Loonylefty

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Well that’s something to certainly ponder should I get to the point of a job offer. Training wage will be a significant pay cut which I can sustain but to potentially end up with no job could sway things
 

ComUtoR

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UK
Are you talking about those who have multiple incidents?

In a nutshell yes. However, sometimes it just takes one. I knew a Driver who jacked it in after a week of passing out. Rare as rocking horse poo but that also happens.
 

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