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Birmingham - Northampton Ticket Help

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Any help on this one please - SVR LM only BHM - NMP is £20. But there is a Super Off Peak Rtn BHM-MKC for £14.

As the majority of LM services call at NMP am I safe to assume the super off peak is valid for exit at Northampton please?
 
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Bletchleyite

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It doesn't appear to prohibit break of journey (unlike some of LM's other supercheapo tickets) so I don't see why not. Be aware though that this one has weekend time restrictions and as such may not suit you.
 
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It doesn't appear to prohibit break of journey (unlike some of LM's other supercheapo tickets) so I don't see why not. Be aware though that this one has weekend time restrictions and as such may not suit you.

Thanks for your help. I only noticed Monday - Saturday restrictions to/from EUS?
 

mattdickinson

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It doesn't appear to prohibit break of journey (unlike some of LM's other supercheapo tickets) so I don't see why not. Be aware though that this one has weekend time restrictions and as such may not suit you.

Break of journey on the outward journey is not allowed.

From Brfares:
Break of journey is not permitted on the outward portion except to change trains at an intermediate station or to access station facilities. Normal break of journey rules apply to the return portion.
 

Bletchleyite

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Break of journey on the outward journey is not allowed.

From Brfares:

Ah, I had erroneously selected the interavailable ticket which has no such restriction (but is no use for going to Northampton on the cheap).

In that case, it is technically not permitted to alight at Northampton on the outward. However, it has long been the case that "no break of journey" on a walk-up just means "once you've stopped you can't resume". I suppose you risk being required to pay an excess. Or would LM prosecute for this kind of thing as it is a deliberate avoidance of the published fare?

Or is it the case that because you haven't broken your journey until you leave the station (you can change trains as many times as you feel like), you would only be liable for prosecution if you were denied permission to pass the barrier but did so anyway?
 
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Hadders

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However, it has long been the case that "no break of journey" on a walk-up just means "once you've stopped you can't resume".

Where is this documented? I've not heard of it before.
 

miami

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Where is this documented? I've not heard of it before.

Quite. It may be that the media has not picked up on anyone being procescuted, however that doesn't mean it's allowed, or won't be picked up on.

Asserting your undeniable rights (like break of journey on a ticket which does not forbid it) is hard work at time. Attempting to stop short on a ticket that does not allow BOJ, especially in a case where you're saving money? I wouldn't risk it, YMMV.
 

Bletchleyite

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Where is this documented? I've not heard of it before.

It isn't, it's just how it conventionally worked in BR days with things like Savers, and is largely my experience[0]. But BR was never quite so prosecution-happy as the present-day operators, nor were there quite so many fares anomalies that might make you want to do it, nor were most stations barriered in the days when this sort of thing came up in that way.

However, with a walk-up ticket you near enough always have a get-out that will prevent prosecution unless you are on the last train or similar. If stopped and told you can't break your journey, simply return to the platform and continue it to the ticketed destination on the next valid train. This might be inconvenient, but as Break of Journey has not occurred until you have left railway premises, there would only be a chance of issues (legally[1]) were an inspector waiting at the building's exit, which while it does occasionally happen I have never witnessed myself.

With an Advance, of course, you do not have that option, as the second the train leaves without you on it you are stuck. And starting short is of course a whole different ball game.

[0] I have often broken journeys where BoJ was not technically permitted, e.g. to go to the shops between trains, and I have never, ever been even slightly questioned about it.

[1] I'm not saying you might not end up with something against you, but you would win in court because Break of Journey is very clearly defined as leaving Railway property with certain specific exceptions.
 
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miami

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With the last train you can of course continue the next morning.
 

Bletchleyite

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With the last train you can of course continue the next morning.

Indeed, though that'd be a long time to sit in the cold on Northampton's platform, assuming you'd even be allowed to do so.

MKC you'd be OK, as the station doesn't close on a weekday, only on a Saturday night (the last arrival from Euston goes back south as the first departure).
 

miami

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Indeed, though that'd be a long time to sit in the cold on Northampton's platform, assuming you'd even be allowed to do so.

MKC you'd be OK, as the station doesn't close on a weekday, only on a Saturday night (the last arrival from Euston goes back south as the first departure).

You can leave and stay overnight

"you will be treated
as breaking your journey if you leave a Train Company’s or Rail Service Company’s stations after you start your journey other than to:
...
(ii) stay in overnight accommodation when you cannot reasonably complete your journey within one day"
 

bb21

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It isn't, it's just how it conventionally worked in BR days with things like Savers, and is largely my experience[0]. But BR was never quite so prosecution-happy as the present-day operators, nor were there quite so many fares anomalies that might make you want to do it, nor were most stations barriered in the days when this sort of thing came up in that way.

In BR days, AIUI, if the fare to the intermediate station were higher, as in the OP's case, it would not simply be a case of not being allowed to continue the journey, but that an additional fare would be due to make up for the difference, as Savers and SuperSavers forbid break of journey on the outward.

I pretty much agree with the rest of your post.
 

kieron

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In reference to the original post:

Any help on this one please - SVR LM only BHM - NMP is £20. But there is a Super Off Peak Rtn BHM-MKC for £14.

As the majority of LM services call at NMP am I safe to assume the super off peak is valid for exit at Northampton please?
Break of journey is only allowed on the return part of your ticket. If your schedule allows, you could buy the £14 ticket to Milton Keynes (or Wolverton), travel there with it, and then catch the first train back to Northampton from there using the return part of your ticket.

If you explain your situation to a member of staff when you are on the first train (or waiting around in Northampton for a train which actually stops in Wolverton), you may be told to leave railway premises at Northampton without going all the way to the destination on your ticket first.

If not, you'll need a different ticket.
 
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