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Blue boxes

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Jack Barry

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Hope someone can help, I noticed on the NB at Piccadilly Circus Bakerloo a blue box it said clips and scotches. so if there was a need to secure the points, can anyone tell me where they are located at Elephant/Lambeth/Baker Street/Paddington/Queens Park. I have not seen the blue boxes before on my travels. TIA
 
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edwin_m

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IIRC Piccadilly Circus is the only deep tube station where there are switches and crossings actually in the platform. So I guess for the others the clips and scotches are somewhere closer to the actual pointwork where they are needed.
 

Jack Barry

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IIRC Piccadilly Circus is the only deep tube station where there are switches and crossings actually in the platform. So I guess for the others the clips and scotches are somewhere closer to the actual pointwork where they are needed.
The switches are closer than normal well one end is but I don't see the difference unless someone knows why. Thinking about it staff would secure the end closer to the station first and then do the other end of the points, so there must be similar boxes at the other sites but which ones. Elephant I suspect there must be a box each end? I think nowdays they rely on route securing from the control room but that is for certain failures as far as I know.
 

bramling

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Hope someone can help, I noticed on the NB at Piccadilly Circus Bakerloo a blue box it said clips and scotches. so if there was a need to secure the points, can anyone tell me where they are located at Elephant/Lambeth/Baker Street/Paddington/Queens Park. I have not seen the blue boxes before on my travels. TIA

Every set of points will have means to be manually secured. Traditionally in the tunnels they would be housed in a small grey box on the tunnel wall as close to the points as possible normally one box per set of points, whilst in the open they would be in larger bin-type containers somewhere nearby.

This may sound lovely and simple, however there’s always been a perennial issue of the clips and scotches going missing. These are supposed to be used by operating staff only, however the culprits for the disappearances are always suspected to be the p-way, who frequently need to secure points when carrying out work, or other overnight staff when running certain forms of engineers train. In reality the clips and scotches get “borrowed” and then simply dumped on the track somewhere. A variation on the theme is the boxes being broken open.

To counter all this, there’s been moves to provide more conspicuous boxes, in more conspicuous locations, where they can be checked easily - so a move to put them on platforms where conveniently possible, and with a glass front so missing equipment can be more readily identified. Likewise more secure locks. Needless to say now less convenient for the staff who are actually supposed to use them, but avoids the problem of turning up in the middle of a major failure to find an empty box!

Remote securing is the preferred means, however this isn’t universally fitted, and can only be used if the points have full detection and indication reported by the signalling system.
 

Jack Barry

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Joined
2 Mar 2018
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161
Every set of points will have means to be manually secured. Traditionally in the tunnels they would be housed in a small grey box on the tunnel wall as close to the points as possible normally one box per set of points, whilst in the open they would be in larger bin-type containers somewhere nearby.

This may sound lovely and simple, however there’s always been a perennial issue of the clips and scotches going missing. These are supposed to be used by operating staff only, however the culprits for the disappearances are always suspected to be the p-way, who frequently need to secure points when carrying out work, or other overnight staff when running certain forms of engineers train. In reality the clips and scotches get “borrowed” and then simply dumped on the track somewhere. A variation on the theme is the boxes being broken open.

To counter all this, there’s been moves to provide more conspicuous boxes, in more conspicuous locations, where they can be checked easily - so a move to put them on platforms where conveniently possible, and with a glass front so missing equipment can be more readily identified. Likewise more secure locks. Needless to say now less convenient for the staff who are actually supposed to use them, but avoids the problem of turning up in the middle of a major failure to find an empty box!

Remote securing is the preferred means, however this isn’t universally fitted, and can only be used if the points have full detection and indication reported by the signalling system.
Thanks although I thought route secure was more or less everywhere. I thought that the only people who could remove the clips etc would be track or possession people.
 

bramling

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Thanks although I thought route secure was more or less everywhere. I thought that the only people who could remove the clips etc would be track or possession people.

RS definitely not universal. The Central, Vic, Jubilee and Northern have it as it’s a standard feature of new schemes. From memory I think the Bakerloo has it too. Definitely little on the sub surface lines, and I can’t remember about the Picc. The sub surface lines will get it as part of their resignalling.
 

Jack Barry

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RS definitely not universal. The Central, Vic, Jubilee and Northern have it as it’s a standard feature of new schemes. From memory I think the Bakerloo has it too. Definitely little on the sub surface lines, and I can’t remember about the Picc. The sub surface lines will get it as part of their resignalling.
Forgot that the sub surface don't have RS at the moment, I was thinking of route proving which I believe they have.
 

Dstock7080

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Forgot that the sub surface don't have RS at the moment, I was thinking of route proving which I believe they have.
Route Proving can only be used at certain specific locations, not all controlled areas.
Route Card operation is also available at Edgware Road (for a few months more) and Whitechapel
 

bluegoblin7

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Forgot that the sub surface don't have RS at the moment, I was thinking of route proving which I believe they have.

RS is not currently available anywhere on the SSR.

RP is available at a number of controlled locations, but not for all signals or indeed all routes.

Sites retaining conventional lever frame cabins have Route Card procedure available, except Harrow-on-the-Hill due to its push/pull route setting levers. Cabins with push button desks may have route proving available. Amersham cabin can use remote route card for the Chalfont site (not all signals/routes).

Where these procedures cannot be used, or are not provided, manually securing pointwork remains the norm.

Assuming all goes well, the SSR will have its first RS in 9 day's time.
 
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