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BTP Officer Dismissed For Use Of Excessive Force

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AntoniC

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A BTP Officer has been dismissed for use of excessive force against a drunk and uncooperative male passenger at Doncaster Station on 24/01/17

I support the work the emergency services do, but all that hard work is let down by actions such as this.
I also commend the courage of another attending officer who came forward to day he thought the use of force was excessive.

https://policeconduct.gov.uk/recomm...e-force-british-transport-police-january-2017
On 14 January 2017 British Transport Police officers on duty at Doncaster railway station became concerned for the safety of a man who appeared unsteady on his feet. They tried to stop him to speak with him, but the man left quickly saying he had a train to catch. The man then got on a train, and locked himself in one of the toilets.

Officers followed the man onto the train and began to search for him. Having knocked on a locked toilet cubicle door with no response, they asked a train guard to open the door for them. They found the man in the toilet and asked him to step off the train on to the platform due to concerns about his welfare. The man refused to leave the train and a physical altercation began between the man and the officers. Officers used force and restraint on the man.

The man complained that, during the altercation, he was punched to the back of the head. The man’s mother subsequently made a complaint that one of the officers had struck him several times with their knee and fist. One of the officers who was present at the incident also expressed concerns that that officer had used excessive force.

During the investigation, investigators interviewed the officer under criminal caution on suspicion of assault, as there was an indication that they may have behaved in a manner which would justify the bringing of disciplinary proceedings. Investigators also spoke to the man, and to other police witnesses to ascertain what force was used on the man; they viewed CCTV footage of the incident.

The Investigator formed the opinion that there was sufficient evidence upon which a reasonable tribunal, properly directed, could find gross misconduct.

Having reviewed our report, British Transport Police agreed that the officer had a case to answer for gross misconduct in respect of use of force. They arranged a hearing at which the allegations were proven. The officer was dismissed immediately without notice.
 
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MG11

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So, it seems like it is likely that un-acceptable force was used, and an officer doing the same job admits that. One punch to the head can kill in some unfortunate cases and it sounds as though the drunk male didn't have the balance or alertness to put up a fight that would require that level of force. The issue is, when police officers start punching people in the head, it could, in some cases blur the line between doing their job and carrying out assault.
 

skyhigh

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The issue is, when police officers start punching people in the head, it could, in some cases blur the line between doing their job and carrying out assault.
Please enlighten me - when is it acceptable for an officer to punch someone in the head?
 

380101

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Please enlighten me - when is it acceptable for an officer to punch someone in the head?

Us of force must be propotionate to the force being used against you. So if a 15stone 6'6" man is punching hell out of yoi then it is reasonable to use similar force to defend yourself and stop the aggressor attacking you. It all comes down to the circumstances of the event in question. In relation to the OP it seems the officer in question went over the top and has been correctly dismissed for his actions.

All use of force against a person by police must be justified and accountable. No officer will be disciplined if they can show the use of force was justified; be it a punch, kick or elbow or something as simple as putting handcuffs on a suspect.
 

skyhigh

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Us of force must be propotionate to the force being used against you. So if a 15stone 6'6" man is punching hell out of yoi then it is reasonable to use similar force to defend yourself and stop the aggressor attacking you. It all comes down to the circumstances of the event in question. In relation to the OP it seems the officer in question went over the top and has been correctly dismissed for his actions.

All use of force against a person by police must be justified and accountable. No officer will be disciplined if they can show the use of force was justified; be it a punch, kick or elbow or something as simple as putting handcuffs on a suspect.
I completely accept that - in training I was told never to strike someone on the head, and I would have thought very carefully before ever doing that.
 

AlterEgo

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Please enlighten me - when is it acceptable for an officer to punch someone in the head?

If they are involved in a fist fight for example. Or trying to subdue a knifeman.

The police can even shoot people, so I’m not sure why an officer being able, in certain circumstances, to punch someone is such a surprise.
 

juliet_papa

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I completely accept that - in training I was told never to strike someone on the head, and I would have thought very carefully before ever doing that.

If striking someone on the head is the only option available and it is reasonable, then yes. If you are ever in a situation where striking someone in their head is your only option, you won't have a lot of time to think. Think Wayne Marques and London Bridge.

During our training we had a really good conversation conversation about fatal strikes, I won't go into details in a public forum. But like 380101 said, is all about proportionate use of force and justification.
 

MG11

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Please enlighten me - when is it acceptable for an officer to punch someone in the head?
PACE Act states that reasonable force can be used by anyone to defend themselves if they are geing harmed, if someone grabbed hold of me and pulled a knife out on me, I could legally kick them in the groin to escape.
 

Butts

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If they are involved in a fist fight for example. Or trying to subdue a knifeman.

The police can even shoot people, so I’m not sure why an officer being able, in certain circumstances, to punch someone is such a surprise.

Anyone remember "The SPG" - I think they had a different Training Manual !!
 

al78

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Please enlighten me - when is it acceptable for an officer to punch someone in the head?

Self defence. If someone was threatening my life and I had no escape route, then anything goes to stop them as far as I'm concerned, the perpetrator had better be prepared to die if they insist on trying to take my life.
 

Gemz91

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Please enlighten me - when is it acceptable for an officer to punch someone in the head?

When the police officer is feeling threatened by you they can. Or at least that's what they told me after I got punched three times in the face when I was stood in the wrong place at the wrong time.
 

Butts

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A BTP Officer has been dismissed for use of excessive force against a drunk and uncooperative male passenger at Doncaster Station on 24/01/17

I support the work the emergency services do, but all that hard work is let down by actions such as this.
I also commend the courage of another attending officer who came forward to day he thought the use of force was excessive.

https://policeconduct.gov.uk/recomm...e-force-british-transport-police-january-2017

I imagine a situation like this - one Officer "bubbling" another would create quite a bit of tension within the cadre. I'm not sure if the other officers attending also were complicit in exposing one of their numbers use of excessive force.

I wouldn't like to be the "bubbler" stuck in a serious incident on their own requesting back up.

If they were mob handed they should have just dragged him out physically (without hitting him) and chucked him in a cell to sober up.
 

Bromley boy

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When the police officer is feeling threatened by you they can. Or at least that's what they told me after I got punched three times in the face when I was stood in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Out of interest, how did this situation come about?
 

MG11

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Out of interest, how did this situation come about?
I'm really curious about this too, if you want to post it as a seperate topic in the general discussions section, I'd like to know more about the possible misconduct.
 

HSTEd

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Striking someone in the head is often just a good way of breaking the bones in your hand
 
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