Bus services only listed as public in order to claim BSOG

[Busaholic]

I think we should all be aware, whatever the govt. ,traffic commissioners or companies say, the driver will be in the wrong. This is why so many drivers appear to just suit themselves.

I think this is a valid point, I've never used or tried to use a service primarily provided for school or college, but would have been wary of doing so anyway. What alternatives would I have had if I'd been refused/ignored? As a bus enthusiast who doesn't make his interest obvious i.e. not making a note of numbers or, as a general rule, taking photos I'd not like to be regarded as 'a dirty old man' with nefarious reasons for wanting to get on the bus. This is still my feeling now I have become an old man on a stick with shuffling gait, and utterly incapable of climbing bus stairs while the bus is moving without breaking my neck. Might some bus drivers be thinking that men (in particular) trying to board these services should be placed under suspicion?

 

[johnnychips]

No. In the morning I can get a ‘normal’ service bus or one beginning 4xx from Doncaster which has a school as its destination. I have never been questioned about getting on the ‘school’ bus and the ‘normal’ buses are full of kids anyway.

 

[Busaholic]

No. In the morning I can get a ‘normal’ service bus or one beginning 4xx from Doncaster which has a school as its destination. I have never been questioned about getting on the ‘school’ bus and the ‘normal’ buses are full of kids anyway.

I realise the 'normal' buses are full of kids at school times, and I'm not talking about those, but the 'special' routes which may never normally see any other passenger who's not at school/college, where some drivers (maybe of a more suspicious nature) wouldn't be happy about carrying a civilian, as it were.

 

[6Gman]

No, of course not, it was the way he asked me though.

Why did he even need to ask?

 

[RT4038]

As the discussion title suggests, are there any services listed in your area at any bus stop timetables for example, where if you attempt to flag it down, 9 times out of 10, the driver will simply ignore you and pass you by? As I mentioned in the thread about being stranded due to issues with the last bus, there is a special college days only service running in the afternoon where if you attempt to flag it down, even with it being listed on the timetables at the bus stops, a lot of the time, you'll just be ignored. There are actually three of the same number 360, one going only as far as Winterton, one as far as Barton and one that goes beyond Barton to a village called East Halton. I suppose if you're only going anywhere upto as far as Barton, it's not so much of an issue as you can catch the 350 bus to Hull instead which serves Winterton and Barton, but I suppose if you wanted East Halton, it would be extremely irritating to have it go past you.

They of course allow boarding the buses at the colleges and also at the bus station, but it's pot luck as to whether or not they'll allow you to board the buses at the stops in between, despite them listing the service.

As the discussion title suggests - how do you know whether BSOG is being claimed on any of these services?

 

[RT4038]

It's a major issue that my taxes are potentially going on fraudulent BSOG claims, yes.

It's also a major issue if timetabled bus services are wilfully not being operated as timetabled.

How do you know whether BSOG is being claimed on a particular service? Just because it is registered does not automatically mean BSOG is being claimed.

 

[Man of Kent]

While school services may be registered - because they charge separate fares - they do not necessarily qualify for BSOG. The BSOG claim forms have been beefed up in recent years, and any route serving a school has to be listed individually, including the name of the school, and the "Name & telephone number of person, local authority or other organisation procuring service". Of course, if that is a local transport authority, then the operator doesn't get any BSOG, unless the route was procured under the de minimis rules.

The "20% rule" mentioned earlier does not seem to be current - the form now states that routes are only eligible for BSOG "if they are open to and regularly used by members of the general public". We have successfully argued that this includes pupils paying their own fares, whether daily, weekly or a longer period.

 

[Geordie driver]

I think this is a valid point, I've never used or tried to use a service primarily provided for school or college, but would have been wary of doing so anyway. What alternatives would I have had if I'd been refused/ignored? As a bus enthusiast who doesn't make his interest obvious i.e. not making a note of numbers or, as a general rule, taking photos I'd not like to be regarded as 'a dirty old man' with nefarious reasons for wanting to get on the bus. This is still my feeling now I have become an old man on a stick with shuffling gait, and utterly incapable of climbing bus stairs while the bus is moving without breaking my neck. Might some bus drivers be thinking that men (in particular) trying to board these services should be placed under suspicion?

It was very rare for a normal punter to venture on to a school service but I wouldn't have refused them thinking they might be up to something, that would never have occurred to me.

 

[Mwanesh]

Anything that runs for schools lets just consider it a school bus. With the world we live in these days.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Anything that runs for schools lets just consider it a school bus. With the world we live in these days.

Which is fine (if paranoid), but BSOG cannot be claimed.

 

[carlberry]

Anything that runs for schools lets just consider it a school bus. With the world we live in these days.

The 'world we live in today' is one where school journeys are the only buses that councils have to fund and, consequentially, are sometimes the only means of transport in an area.

 

[RT4038]

Which is fine (if paranoid), but BSOG cannot be claimed.

And to go back to the thread title, via, inter alia, accusations of fraud and nonsense about Orcats raiding, how do you or any other poster know whether a particular service has a BSOG claim? Answer - you don't. The DfT have a team of people checking on BSOG claims; it certainly isn't necessary for members of the public to be speculating on fraudulent claims.
How much will BSOG be worth on a school bus route of about 5 miles? £1 or so per trip? Can we get a bit of perspective here please.

 

[carlberry]

And to go back to the thread title, via, inter alia, accusations of fraud and nonsense about Orcats raiding, how do you or any other poster know whether a particular service has a BSOG claim? Answer - you don't. The DfT have a team of people checking on BSOG claims; it certainly isn't necessary for members of the public to be speculating on fraudulent claims.
How much will BSOG be worth on a school bus route of about 5 miles? £1 or so per trip? Can we get a bit of perspective here please.

I think the main point of the original post wasn't the suggestion about claiming BSOG or not but the effect that listing a service as available to the public when it isn't has on intending passengers.
Traveline is the main information provider nowadays however it dosent have any easy way of indicating if a service is school days only or school children only. There is some benefit from having school children only services on there in that it makes the availability of the service more widely know however if it cant differentiate then services that are intended for school children only shouldn't appear on it.