Buxton stone trains

[high camera]

Hi all.
Do all the stone trains exit the Derbyshire quarries via Chinley junctions ? including the ones using the extended runaround at Buxton. Reason I ask is that on google maps there appears to be a line that runs south from Tunstead and loops around back to Buxton.

Were these lines ever connected to the Buxton passenger line ?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Hi all.
Do all the stone trains exit the Derbyshire quarries via Chinley junctions ? including the ones using the extended runaround at Buxton. Reason I ask is that on google maps there appears to be a line that runs south from Tunstead and loops around back to Buxton.
Were these lines ever connected to the Buxton passenger line ?

Most of them run via Chinley, but a few do run via Whaley Bridge.
Chinley is preferred for trains heading west as they run on the quiet route (part freight-only) via Cheadle Heath, Altrincham, the mid-Cheshire line and Middlewich to reach Crewe.
The line into Buxton from the south used to be part of the Midland route via Millers Dale to their half of the twin station at Buxton.
There was a link from this line round to the Peak Forest main line (was used by Midland trains heading from Buxton for Manchester Central), and this was retained when the line via Matlock was closed.
The stone line south and uphill out of Buxton to Dowlow which is heavily used was an LNWR route (originally to Ashbourne with a connection to the Cromford and High Peak).
The sidings outside Buxton are used to position stone trains for the three routes out of town.

 

[furnessvale]

Hi all.
Do all the stone trains exit the Derbyshire quarries via Chinley junctions ? including the ones using the extended runaround at Buxton. Reason I ask is that on google maps there appears to be a line that runs south from Tunstead and loops around back to Buxton.

Were these lines ever connected to the Buxton passenger line ?

All regular stone trains from the Peak district quarries exit via Chinley, either north or east.

Very occasionally trains exit via Buxton-Whaley Bridge-Hazel Grove, but the condition of the road bridge in Whaley precludes the use of this route on a regular basis.

 

[high camera]

Many thanks for the info.

So if a train was to enter / exit via the passenger line at Buxton is it straight forward or does it involve a reversal from the new siding.?

Ta

 

[furnessvale]

Many thanks for the info.

So if a train was to enter / exit via the passenger line at Buxton is it straight forward or does it involve a reversal from the new siding.?

Ta

I stand to be corrected (and probably will be) but I understand trains from Dowlow and Ashwood Dale have to enter the sidings and reverse into the passenger station to gain the LNWR route via Bibbington summit as there is no direct crossover for that move.

The only booked freight on that route is a daily return empty from Ashburys to Dowlow. As I mentioned in #3, the condition of the road bridge in Whaley precludes more regular freight use. If/when that bridge is renewed there could then be a case for altering the track layout at Buxton to permit easier use.

 

[high camera]

Many thanks for that, all makes sense.

Obviously accessing the passenger line would only be of use for trains going to Stockport / Manchester Piccadilly.

Reason for my question was I was thinking "what if" the Chinley link was U/S, all manner of issues, snow, landslip in cuttings, tunnel collapse etc etc.

The stone, construction, chemical and power industries are really vunerable to disruption to the supply chain without a second way out of Derbyshire for trains.

Regards

 

[furnessvale]

Many thanks for that, all makes sense.

Obviously accessing the passenger line would only be of use for trains going to Stockport / Manchester Piccadilly.

Reason for my question was I was thinking "what if" the Chinley link was U/S, all manner of issues, snow, landslip in cuttings, tunnel collapse etc etc.

The stone, construction, chemical and power industries are really vunerable to disruption to the supply chain without a second way out of Derbyshire for trains.

Regards

Yes. I don't know how much hammer that bridge in Whaley could really take if the issue was forced. It currently has 1 x 66 + 20 empty box wagons over it daily (I think at 5mph). In the days of 37s and old ICI hoppers, it was quite a common sight on Sundays to see 2 x 37 + 18 hoppers + 1 x 37 over that line when they were working on Doveholes (Midland) Tunnel.

 

[high camera]

With the disruption caused by the Whaley Bridge incident is stone getting out if Derbyshire by rail at the moment ?

If not I appear to have given the operation the kiss of death on post 6

 

[furnessvale]

With the disruption caused by the Whaley Bridge incident is stone getting out if Derbyshire by rail at the moment ?

If not I appear to have given the operation the kiss of death on post 6

Stone "can" move from the quarries eastwards but I believe only one train so far has made that trip. If the disruption carries on into next week perhaps more will move but for Manchester/Northwich etc traffic it is a long way round.

One thing is certain, the HGVs are having a field day.

 

[Chris Butler]

The sidings outside Buxton are used to position stone trains for the three routes out of town.

I used to live at Dowlow a long, long time ago, in the days when you often changed at Miller's Dale to get to London. 50 years+ have passed since.

Can I just confirm that the sidings just outside Buxton are for crew change/breaks, minor maintenance (?) and where trains wait for a path. There's no splitting/combining or shunting (in normal operations). Is that correct ?

 

[Chris Butler]

Hi all.
Reason I ask is that on google maps there appears to be a line that runs south from Tunstead and loops around back to Buxton

Haven't lived round there for over half a century, but that line (via Tunstead) is the (only) line to Chinley junctions. It crosses under the (now) passenger route to Manchester (via Whaley Bridge and Hazel Grove) twice so the two lines are intertwined as they proceed north(ish) from Buxton, but they are not connected. Dove Holes station is pretty much on top of the freight line which tunnels underneath. The tunnels are invisible on Google maps so you may have the impression that the line terminated at Tunstead.

Sorry if I got the wrong end of thee stick. Also very happy to get corrections from those who know the area better.

 

[furnessvale]

I used to live at Dowlow a long, long time ago, in the days when you often changed at Miller's Dale to get to London. 50 years+ have passed since.

Can I just confirm that the sidings just outside Buxton are for crew change/breaks, minor maintenance (?) and where trains wait for a path. There's no splitting/combining or shunting (in normal operations). Is that correct ?

If you mean Peak Forest sidings, crews changeon the main line and there are a couple of loops where trains can wait for a path. There are also about 4 sidings for hold spare wagons, locos etc.

If you mean the newly lengthened run round loop immediately north of Buxton station, that is simply for locos to run round trains to/from Dowlow and has recently been lengthened to allow 26 wagons on a train instead of the previous 18/20.

 

[Chris Butler]

If you mean Peak Forest sidings,

I meant the extended sidings right next to the passenger line approaching Buxton (do they have an official name?). I was under the impression that they were a tad grander than just a run-around loop so thanks for the clarification.

 

[oddiesjack]

The unofficial name for the former Up sidings is Donaroo, or maybe Donahue. Its one of those words one hears in speech, but rarely see it written down

 

[oddiesjack]

Also, Chinley signal box is open today, and there appears to be both up and down freights off the Peak Forest line for points east running this evening.

 

[Chris Butler]

The unofficial name for the former Up sidings is Donaroo, or maybe Donahue. Its one of those words one hears in speech, but rarely see it written down

Thanks. Yes, I have seen it used a few times now.

 

[ElectroSoldier]

The Up & Down Great Rocks line loops back onto itself and passes under the passenger line near Chapel en le Frith.

Once your unlocked from Hindlow or Downlow you go down to the sidings just north of Buxton.
At that point you can do one of two things to go out short of going back up the hill.

Propel into Buxton station and use the left hand facing cross over the get access to the Down Main to Dove Holes and ultimately Hazel Grove (no its not a normal operation)
What with the length of the trains these days its not often we do that. especially considering the weight restrictions on the fore mentioned bridge. and that hill out of Buxton is long!

What we normally do is run around in the now extended sidings and go out over the Up & Down Great rocks line, it comes out of Buxton slowly turning left into Peak dale, on towards Chapel en le frith under the Down Main I could have taken from Buxton and on to Chinley.

It isnt common and when considering the amount of traffic wasnt ever common to get freight moves over the Up or Down Main. Arriving on the Up most common as you arrive light and the hills manageable.
The diesel depot at Buxton used to be very busy with refueling and light maintenance but that was in the days when we double and triple headed 37s to get the stone out, usually double, as the run around sidings didnt allow for trains over 21. I remember about 15-20 years ago we were given a rank that was to long for the sidings, they had to send a light loco to head the train back down to Great rocks jn.
Another time we come from Hindlow into the sidings, couldnt get the clearing point in the headshunt so we couldnt run around, there was enough room for the whole train in the sidings but now access to the run around road as the train was longer than the run around. So a light loco in the diesel depot was put into platform 2, we propelled into the platform, hooked up to the loco top n tail then back onto the sidings unhooked the lead loco and the whole train went down to Great rocks with the new loco.
That was because the train that went to Hindlow arrived over the Up Main, they didnt realise it was to long for the sidings and you can guess the rest.

Some right good days up in the high peak back then. Not been there in a long time now. but looking at RTT its not changed much apart from the new extended sidings which hjust allows longer trains but the moves look the same.