c2c sold by National Express to Trenitalia

Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by 87015, 11 Jan 2017.

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  1. 87015

    87015 Established Member

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    Rail Division closing, c2c sold to Italians...
     
  2. PR1Berske

    PR1Berske Established Member

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    Can't find this on any news site, what's the source?
     
  3. SpacePhoenix

    SpacePhoenix Established Member

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    Where did you read that? Not seen anything about it in the news
     
  4. Expression357

    Expression357 Member

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    UK Rail. No indication of sale of German Rail
     
  5. yorkie

    yorkie Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    87015 is an informed source, so I expect it will be in the news soon....
     
  6. Expression357

    Expression357 Member

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    Just here:
    http://www.nationalexpressgroup.com...7/acquisition-of-c2c-franchise-by-trenitalia/

     
    Last edited by a moderator: 11 Jan 2017
  7. Clarence Yard

    Clarence Yard Member

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    Press release today in time for opening of the Stock Market this morning, apparently.
     
  8. fredk

    fredk Member

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    Yet another foreign state railway operator with a UK franchise...
     
  9. dk1

    dk1 Established Member

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    Apparently not ruling out the UK in future but sees major growth in N.America & other parts of Europe.
     
  10. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    Whoever posted the link on twitter posted a spam link to a fake antivirus download page
     
  11. class 9

    class 9 Member

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    The link on post #6 works ok.
     
  12. LNW-GW Joint

    LNW-GW Joint Established Member

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    And is now as well qualified as DB and SNCF to bid for the West Coast Partnership franchise (ICWC+HS2)...
     
  13. Chester1

    Chester1 Member

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    I would still put my money on Virgin Group + a foreign HS opperator.

    Does this mean Stagecoach, First and Go Ahead are the only british opperators left?
     
  14. theironroad

    theironroad Established Member

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    Sorry to mention the B word, but is Brexit going to change the ability of European rail companies and government bodies to buy up uk rail franchises?

    Even with a hard brexit, global companies will still be able to buy up uk companies even if there is more paperwork.

    So will we see any difference to the current trend of overseas ownership of the uk rail operating companies?
     
  15. LNW-GW Joint

    LNW-GW Joint Established Member

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    I didn't know Virgin was "foreign"?
    A Virgin consortium may well win WCP, but they'll have to fight for it.
    Arriva is based in Sunderland, not Berlin.
     
  16. Chester1

    Chester1 Member

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    Its already had an affect. DB dopped its plans sell 45% of Arriva on the Stock Exchange in November due to brexit and now this takeover. The pound has fallen significantly against the Euro meaning it is a bad time to sell UK assets and convert the money to Euros but its a good time to convert Euros into pounds and buy british assets.
     
  17. SpacePhoenix

    SpacePhoenix Established Member

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    Will the new company be allowed to run the c2c franchise until whenever the c2c franchise is due for renewal?
     
  18. MK Tom

    MK Tom Established Member

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    Isn't there usually some wrangling with the DfT when this happens? I'm thinking back to when First bought out Great Western Trains and made a bunch of new franchise commitments to get it through.
     
  19. jcollins

    jcollins Veteran Member

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    Indeed. Some people (RMT included) are quick to label Arriva as a foreign company because they are a UK registered company with a German parent but try to label Bombardier Derby as British despite being a plant belonging to a German registered company with a Canadian parent.
     
  20. pdeaves

    pdeaves Member

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    Expected to, I venture. They are just buying out an existing contract that must still be honoured.
     
  21. Bletchleyite

    Bletchleyite Veteran Member

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    Quite. Think it might be because if you mispronounce Bombardier as Bombardeer it sounds terribly British, whereas in fact you want a pint of Bom-bard-y-ay (!) :)
     
  22. jcollins

    jcollins Veteran Member

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    I suspect we could see more foreign bidders as a result of Brexit. For instance, Keolis is 70% French (SNCF) and 30% Canadian (CDPQ) but if a mainly EU company has no advantage over a non-EU company then could we see CDPQ making a sole bid?
     
  23. Simon11

    Simon11 Member Jobs & Careers Assistant

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    This is rather a shock to everyone in the business, however I am surprised that Trenitalia wants to move into the UK rail market considering the low margins and crazy bids that have won the last few franchises.
     
  24. 87015

    87015 Established Member

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    They've been talking about not bidding for a fair time. The c2c bid hasn't been particulary successful in delivery because of some ridiculous requirements and ideas placed by said bid on the operators themselves. The sale of c2c is a surprise buts its classic NX to shuffle the rail division around shortly before binning in.
     
  25. jcollins

    jcollins Veteran Member

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    Both Trenitalia and Renfe have been saying for a while they want to get in to the UK market. I get the impression both really want the more lucrative Intercity franchises rather than the local franchises but possibly Trenitalia see getting 1 local franchise as a stepping stone towards getting an Intercity franchise.
     
  26. Simon11

    Simon11 Member Jobs & Careers Assistant

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    I wouldn't use the term "Lucrative" more suicidal! Great example is Stagecoach were struggling from day one with East Coast and there are likely to be a few more TOC's struggling with poor growth at the moment.
     
  27. ChathillMan

    ChathillMan Member

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    C2C is relatively simple franchise to operate (compared to the others), if they cock that up never mind the RMT brigade querying foreign operators, I can see rail expert types starting to question it all.
     
  28. LNW-GW Joint

    LNW-GW Joint Established Member

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    There will probably be a"consideration" for buying out c2c.
    DB eventually had to cough up an LHCS set for buying Arriva.
    But DfT will welcome a new competitor for upcoming franchises.
    From an Italian perspective, FS is under considerable competitive pressure at home and is being readied for partial privatisation.
    Trenitalia also took over Arriva's routes in Germany when DB bought them.
    I just hope they don't inflict their domestic web site on us!
     
  29. Bletchleyite

    Bletchleyite Veteran Member

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    From what I've read no train franchise is "lucrative" compared with bus operation.
     
  30. Alfie1014

    Alfie1014 Member

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    Some detail now published in Railway Gazette.

    http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/...nitalia-buys-c2c-to-enter-uk-rail-market.html

     
    Last edited by a moderator: 22 Jan 2017
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