Caledonian Sleeper discussion

[Mag_seven]

That's what I was thinking. I know you could probably squeeze in another coach or loco on P1, after that you'd probably be beyond the signal.

I believe you're right about P11 being the longest. I'm sure that was the platform used when the Class 50s came up with 13 (?) coaches + 2 leading locos and I believe it just fit, with the 90 used for ECS being beyond the end of the platform.

It was indeed the platform used when the Class 50's came up in October - it only just fitted!

 

[marks87]

1S26 runs into Glasgow tonight with no split at Carstairs due to the brake van on the edinburgh portion being removed at Wembley due to wheel flats.

Is it always the case the whole train goes to Glasgow when there's a problem with one of the brake coaches, or do they make the decision based on loadings? So if the Edinburgh portion was rammed and the Glasgow portion half-empty, would they run to Edinburgh instead?

(Edinburgh would also solve the platform length issue (in as much as it is an issue)).

 

[najaB]

Is it always the case the whole train goes to Glasgow when there's a problem with one of the brake coaches, or do they make the decision based on loadings? So if the Edinburgh portion was rammed and the Glasgow portion half-empty, would they run to Edinburgh instead?an issue)).

Going to Edinburgh first would reverse the set, though.

 

[marks87]

Going to Edinburgh first would reverse the set, though.

I don't mean Edinburgh "first"; I mean terminate at Edinburgh instead of Glasgow.

That would still reverse the set of course. But going into Carstairs first then back out (using the normal Edinburgh loco) would work.

Brake coach problems do thankfully seem to be rare, but it would be nice to think that if such a problem coincided with a loading skewed towards Edinburgh, Edinburgh would be the terminus.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Going to Edinburgh first would reverse the set, though.

Only if it didn't go back via Edinburgh.

 

[najaB]

Only if it didn't go back via Edinburgh.

You'd expect that the whole set would go to Polmaide - the end that should have been closest to Glasgow would now be closest to Edinburgh. That may or may not be a problem depending on what maintenance was scheduled.

 

[TimboM]

I don't mean Edinburgh "first"; I mean terminate at Edinburgh instead of Glasgow.

That would still reverse the set of course. But going into Carstairs first then back out (using the normal Edinburgh loco) would work.

Brake coach problems do thankfully seem to be rare, but it would be nice to think that if such a problem coincided with a loading skewed towards Edinburgh, Edinburgh would be the terminus.

I've never seen it happen - always been the full set goes to Glasgow in such circumstances. Operationally, Glasgow is a lot more straightforward - no attaching/reattaching locos at Carstairs, no further running round of the loco at Edinburgh, the (one) set ends up near Polmadie, Edinburgh passengers can connect from either Motherwell or Glasgow (wheras if the set goes to Edinburgh I believe realistically they'd have to wait to get to Edinburgh and go to Glasgow)...

I don't know whether this would be a factor, but you'd also be technically terminating/cancelling the whole of 1S26 short, which could be more "black marks" against the PPM than cancelling the shorter 1B26.

I think the loadings would have to be very heavily skewed to Edinburgh (to an extent it's unlikely to ever happen) for these various operational hurdles to be outweighed.

 

[ScottDarg]

90042 away in with 5S95, so may also be tonights 1S26 loco.

5S95 followed in by 0A25, which was a CS 92. No ID on that at the moment, I'm guessing it's 014 as the info I have had it at Willesden an hour ago, with 018 reported at Wembley.

 

[ScottDarg]

86101 away in with 5S96, again, 90042 should be leading 1S26 again.

1S25 away on time with the 92. Still don't have a solid ID on it, unfortunately.

EDIT: It was 92018

 

[GW43125]

1S25 has just come north through Berko and is approaching the back of the stack related to the trespasser at Leighton Buzzard stopping the job.

[EDIT 21:54} it's now at the back of the queue

[EDIT 22:02] Lines reopened

 

[bb21]

I don't know whether this would be a factor, but you'd also be technically terminating/cancelling the whole of 1S26 short, which could be more "black marks" against the PPM than cancelling the shorter 1B26.

It is in fact worse cancelling the Edinburgh portion from a pure figures p.o.v. I don't know if Serco have alternative arrangements but cancelling 1S26 at Carstairs is a part cancellation. Cancellation of 1B26 would be a full cancellation. Saying that the latter may be treated also as a part cape depending on what exact regime Serco operate under, which I'm not party to.

Either way there would be a PPM failure in there, assuming the other portion runs on time.

I digress...

 

[GW43125]

1S25 has made most of its time up.
1M11 however is currently 15 overdue and counting for departing Carstairs.

 

[Scotrail84]

1S25 has made most of its time up.
1M11 however is currently 15 overdue and counting for departing Carstairs.

1M11 is currently 3 minutes early and is near Symington.

 

[TimboM]

It is in fact worse cancelling the Edinburgh portion from a pure figures p.o.v. I don't know if Serco have alternative arrangements but cancelling 1S26 at Carstairs is a part cancellation. Cancellation of 1B26 would be a full cancellation. Saying that the latter may be treated also as a part cape depending on what exact regime Serco operate under, which I'm not party to.

Either way there would be a PPM failure in there, assuming the other portion runs on time.

I digress...

I believe Serco have a different way in which PPM is calculated due to the limited number of trains / train splits etc. How that may impact 1S26/1B26 I don't know. Either way I suspect the operational practicalities/challenges would be the main factor in sending the whole train to Glasgow if only one brake coach.

 

[Carntyne]

I believe Serco have a different way in which PPM is calculated due to the limited number of trains / train splits etc. How that may impact 1S26/1B26 I don't know. Either way I suspect the operational practicalities/challenges would be the main factor in sending the whole train to Glasgow if only one brake coach.

I think the PPM is still measured the same way, 7 trains IIRC. They are measured by Right Time arrival in their franchise agreement though.

 

[ScottDarg]

Obviously this is all subject to swaps and the like, but here's what it's looking like tonight:

90042 away in with 5S95 so should be tonights 1S26 loco again.

92018 is tonights 1S25.

92014 came up last night with 1S26 so should be tonights 1M11 loco.

92033 came up last night too, but with 1S25 and so should be tonights 1M16.

92010 should be the 1C11 loco.

87002 & 86101 should be on 5M11 & 5S96 respectively.

73971, 73967 & 67020 on Aberdeen, Fort William & Inverness respectively (all southbound to Edinburgh).

This is all based on which locos are where and what services they worked last night, if anyone has any differing or solid info then please correct me.

 

[MadCommuter]

90042 on the blocks at Glasgow Central, 87002 doing the ECS

 

[snakeeyes]

90042 on the blocks at Glasgow Central, 87002 doing the ECS

Last night's sleeper at Waverly waiting for the Inverness and Fortbill portion to arrive.

 

[ScottDarg]

Late info but 92028 came out of exam and straight to the beds. Now sat in the Klondyke siding at Edinburgh after bringing up 1S25.

92010 swapped with 90042 on 1M11 last night, meaning 90042 should be on Carstairs.

 

[ScottDarg]

1S26 - 92010

5S26 - 87002 Top-and-Tail 92010

 

[cf111]

Aboard 1M16 awaiting departure after enjoying some haggis. It was very nice but I am still mourning the loss of the Inverness sauce which was served under First and I have yet to find in any shops before, since or after despite living in Inverness!

Didn't get the loco but I think it's a red 67.

 

[47271]

Aboard 1M16 awaiting departure after enjoying some haggis. It was very nice but I am still mourning the loss of the Inverness sauce which was served under First and I have yet to find in any shops before, since or after despite living in Inverness!

Didn't get the loco but I think it's a red 67.

Yes, I remember the Inverness Sauce from First days, it did set off the haggis very nicely.

As I recall it was made by Moniack Winery which doesn't really exist any more - maybe Scotrail had a cupboard full of it left over from the 1990s.

Maybe Scotrail still has a cupboard full of it, look out for it in the buffet cars on the HSTs...

 

[BRX]

I too mourn the absence of that Inverness Sauce!

Something that despite growing up 20 miles from Inverness I never encountered except on the sleeper.

 

[Scotrail84]

Potential bad night for sleepers. Complete power failure including signals between oubeck and Lancaster. TBW will be used if they can't fix it.

 

[GusB]

TBW? I'm guessing this is "temporary block working"?

 

[paulcleaver]

Aboard 1M16 awaiting departure after enjoying some haggis. It was very nice but I am still mourning the loss of the Inverness sauce which was served under First and I have yet to find in any shops before, since or after despite living in Inverness!

Didn't get the loco but I think it's a red 67.

Let me know if you find any.

The last time I found any was in the Victorian Market at Hastie and Dyce, or Duncan Fraser. I cant remember which. But it was made by Moniak Castle in an octagonal jar. Looking at their website, it looks like theyve stopped manufacturing it. I used to love that stuff.

 

[Scotrail84]

TBW? I'm guessing this is "temporary block working"?

That's correct. S25 being held at Preston.

 

[cf111]

Potential bad night for sleepers. Complete power failure including signals between oubeck and Lancaster. TBW will be used if they can't fix it.

We've started moving at a greater rate of knots now but I'm braced for delays further on as we've lost our path by now I suppose. These things happen.

@paulcleaver will do!

 

[Scotrail84]

We've started moving at a greater rate of knots now but I'm braced for delays further on as we've lost our path by now I suppose. These things happen.

@paulcleaver will do!

You'll be lucky to be in inverness for midday.

 

[cf111]

You'll be lucky to be in inverness for midday.

That would worry me as I'm not expecting to be back until my flight gets in tonight

1M16 for me, 116ish late approaching (actually through as I type) Warrington.