Caledonian Sleeper

[louis97]

View attachment 59770
almost all trains on the WHL seem to disappear from RTT for huge stretches of the line at a time. Is the reason for this known?

No means of automatic reporting, all reports north of Helensburgh Upper are entered by the signaller and generally occur, but are not strictly limited to, where exchange of tokens take place.

 

[ajrm]

Anybody know if you sit in the lounge car on the sofas and don't buy a drink you can be asked to leave? I was travelling last week on the Euston to Aberdeen when i was told by a particularly unwelcoming member of crew i had to buy a drink to stay in the lounge. Would have thought travelling first class i could at least sit in a comfortable chair for a little while rather than the pokey cabin!

On most of my recent northbound journeys the Aberdeen/ Fort William lounge car has been so busy that they could easily have done two complete sittings. If your journey was really quiet then I don't see the problem, but why not just buy a drink? After all that's what the lounge car is there for.

 

[MrEd]

Anybody know if you sit in the lounge car on the sofas and don't buy a drink you can be asked to leave? I was travelling last week on the Euston to Aberdeen when i was told by a particularly unwelcoming member of crew i had to buy a drink to stay in the lounge. Would have thought travelling first class i could at least sit in a comfortable chair for a little while rather than the pokey cabin!

Whilst there's no excuse for rudeness from staff, the team leader in charge of the lounge is entitled to use his/her discretion when the lounge is busy, so as to ensure that as many people can get food/drink as possible. This could include restricting it to First Class customers entirely, or (as I've seen on a number of occasions) directing passengers who just want drinks and light snacks (in either class) to the sofa seats, to free up space at tables for passengers requiring cooked meals. Last time I was on the Fort William northbound, on a Friday night at the end of January, the lounge was so busy that the team leader actually had a waiting list for First Class passengers wanting dinner. I rather suspect (unless the staff member was just being obtuse, which seems out of character for CS staff) that you were travelling at a very busy time when the staff needed all the space they could find for passengers requiring meals/refreshments. Unfortunately, the lounge car is not intended as a generic seating/waiting area. It might be worth a try asking whether you could sit at one of the unreserved seats in the seated coach (if there is one), I don't see how they could stop you doing this?

 

[47271]

Whilst there's no excuse for rudeness from staff, the team leader in charge of the lounge is entitled to use his/her discretion when the lounge is busy, so as to ensure that as many people can get food/drink as possible. This could include restricting it to First Class customers entirely, or (as I've seen on a number of occasions) directing passengers who just want drinks and light snacks (in either class) to the sofa seats, to free up space at tables for passengers requiring cooked meals. Last time I was on the Fort William northbound, on a Friday night at the end of January, the lounge was so busy that the team leader actually had a waiting list for First Class passengers wanting dinner. I rather suspect (unless the staff member was just being obtuse, which seems out of character for CS staff) that you were travelling at a very busy time when the staff needed all the space they could find for passengers requiring meals/refreshments. Unfortunately, the lounge car is not intended as a generic seating/waiting area. It might be worth a try asking whether you could sit at one of the unreserved seats in the seated coach (if there is one), I don't see how they could stop you doing this?

Pretty much bang on.

If I came into a full lounge for my dinner and someone was sitting reading the paper and spending nothing I wouldn't be too pleased.

At least spend a couple of quid on a pot of tea for goodness sake.

 

[37047]

Does anyone have any experience of delay repay claims if the sleeper is so late that you miss a journey you had planned for the following day? Hoping tonight's EUS-INV won't be so delayed that I miss the 1041 to Wick tomorrow (have Advance Singles INV-WCK and WCK-INV)...

 

[Bald Rick]

Does anyone have any experience of delay repay claims if the sleeper is so late that you miss a journey you had planned for the following day? Hoping tonight's EUS-INV won't be so delayed that I miss the 1041 to Wick tomorrow (have Advance Singles INV-WCK and WCK-INV)...

38 mins recovery time, plus 20 mins at Edinburgh, you could leave now and still be almost on time

 

[37047]

38 mins recovery time, plus 20 mins at Edinburgh, you could leave now and still be almost on time

Leaving now would be great... I realise I'm getting ahead of myself with the what-ifs here

 

[Bald Rick]

Leaving now would be great... I realise I'm getting ahead of myself with the what-ifs here

I don’t know what the problem is, but if you left now it’s green signals to Leighton Buzzard.

 

[MrEd]

Does anyone have any experience of delay repay claims if the sleeper is so late that you miss a journey you had planned for the following day? Hoping tonight's EUS-INV won't be so delayed that I miss the 1041 to Wick tomorrow (have Advance Singles INV-WCK and WCK-INV)...

If the sleeper arrives in Inverness between 30 and 59 minutes late, you'll get half the fare back, and if it arrives 60 or more minutes late, the full fare back (for your journey on the sleeper between London and Inverness), without question. Generally if you've got an advance ticket for a connecting service to Kyle or Wick, the sleeper staff are very good at endorsing this for the next available service (usually they'll scribble on the back that the sleeper was late, which will entitle you to travel on the next available train); if there is no convenient connecting train, they may even arrange for a taxi to take you to your final destination (or so far along the route that you'll catch up with the train- bear in mind that the Kyle and Far North are not fast routes). I have never been to Wick, but twice when I've had connections to Plockton on the Kyle line, and the sleeper has arrived so late that I've missed the connection, the staff have arranged for a taxi to take me there. On the first occasion, the sleeper arrived 40 late and I was put in a taxi; we caught up with the Kyle train at Achnasheen; on the next occasion, the sleeper was about 110 late, and the taxi took me all the way to Plockton. This was presumably all at CS' expense. What I would suggest is that you advise one of the sleeper hosts in person tonight that you have an onward connection and get them to make a note of it; that way they'll be in a good position to help you in the morning.

 

[Glenn1969]

RTT states EUS-INV left 90 minutes down and will still be 90 minutes down at Crewe but will only be 13 minutes late at Inverness. Is that actually likely?

 

[mirodo]

RTT states EUS-INV left 90 minutes down and will still be 90 minutes down at Crewe but will only be 13 minutes late at Inverness. Is that actually likely?

I was on the northbound Glasgow Sleeper a few months ago. We were 90 minutes down leaving Preston, arrived Glasgow just a shade over 30 down (just enough to claim 50% back under delay repay). There’s plenty of slack in the timetable to make up a good proportion of any delay incurred along the way.

 

[Highlandspring]

The sleepers are slackly timed and can run at 100mph when necessary (they’re usually limited to 80mph for comfort) so yes it’s entirely possible to make up a significant amount of delay.

 

[Bald Rick]

RTT states EUS-INV left 90 minutes down and will still be 90 minutes down at Crewe but will only be 13 minutes late at Inverness. Is that actually likely?

It has missed the Watford stop (it’s so late punters were presumably sent south to meet it at London), and it is running at 100mph rather than 80. Assuming it keeps the road - and the signallers appear to be giving it a good run - it will be only about 50L by Crewe.

Edit: Euston to Rugby in under an hour - I hope no one is trying to sleep on board!

 

[MrEd]

It has missed the Watford stop (it’s so late punters were presumably sent south to meet it at London), and it is running at 100mph rather than 80. Assuming it keeps the road - and the signallers appear to be giving it a good run - it will be only about 50L by Crewe.

Edit: Euston to Rugby in under an hour - I hope no one is trying to sleep on board!

Presumably it's Class 90 hauled? That sounds like a bit of a hair raising ride, particularly if you're in a berth above the bogies...

 

[37047]

Edit: Euston to Rugby in under an hour - I hope no one is trying to sleep on board!

Trying and failing

More to do with the excessive heat and the fact that they don't dim/turn off the lights than the noise or bumpiness.

 

[37047]

If the sleeper arrives in Inverness between 30 and 59 minutes late, you'll get half the fare back, and if it arrives 60 or more minutes late, the full fare back (for your journey on the sleeper between London and Inverness), without question. Generally if you've got an advance ticket for a connecting service to Kyle or Wick, the sleeper staff are very good at endorsing this for the next available service (usually they'll scribble on the back that the sleeper was late, which will entitle you to travel on the next available train); if there is no convenient connecting train, they may even arrange for a taxi to take you to your final destination (or so far along the route that you'll catch up with the train- bear in mind that the Kyle and Far North are not fast routes). I have never been to Wick, but twice when I've had connections to Plockton on the Kyle line, and the sleeper has arrived so late that I've missed the connection, the staff have arranged for a taxi to take me there. On the first occasion, the sleeper arrived 40 late and I was put in a taxi; we caught up with the Kyle train at Achnasheen; on the next occasion, the sleeper was about 110 late, and the taxi took me all the way to Plockton. This was presumably all at CS' expense. What I would suggest is that you advise one of the sleeper hosts in person tonight that you have an onward connection and get them to make a note of it; that way they'll be in a good position to help you in the morning.

Cheers - very helpful, good to know.

 

[Bald Rick]

Trying and failing

More to do with the excessive heat and the fact that they don't dim/turn off the lights than the noise or bumpiness.

All being well, you’ll be about 55L off Crewe, 45L off Preston, and about 30L into Edinburgh. Good chance you will be RT at Inverness. Sleep well!

 

[37047]

We've caught up very impressively overnight - only 3L at Kingussie.

First CS experience and one of the worst nights sleep I've had in a long while - the fluctuations in temperature were extreme, and I really don't get why they can't dim the lights if not switch them off, both toilets in our coach locked out of use by Crewe... but a beautiful sunrise over stunning snowy Highland scenery. Looking forward to a good breakfast in Inverness, then onwards to Wick.

Edit: 5 early into INV - didn't expect that starting 91 late! Very impressed.

 

[tsr]

Edit: 5 early into INV - didn't expect that starting 91 late! Very impressed.

You were very fortunate - the other 2 portions were well behind schedule at Aberdeen and Fort William!

I don't know for certain, but from RTT it would appear they carried on skipping "set down only" stops throughout the early morning hours, to attempt to claw back some time.

 

[JohnMcL7]

We've caught up very impressively overnight - only 3L at Kingussie.

First CS experience and one of the worst nights sleep I've had in a long while - the fluctuations in temperature were extreme, and I really don't get why they can't dim the lights if not switch them off, both toilets in our coach locked out of use by Crewe... but a beautiful sunrise over stunning snowy Highland scenery. Looking forward to a good breakfast in Inverness, then onwards to Wick.

Edit: 5 early into INV - didn't expect that starting 91 late! Very impressed.

Welcome to the Highlands

Were you seated or in a cabin?

 

[VT 390]

On the Highland sleeper I believe you can board from 20:30, after what time can you have an evening meal on board is it at this time or when the train departs?

 

[37047]

Welcome to the Highlands

Were you seated or in a cabin?

Seated. I have a trip booked later in the year where I have a cabin - I imagine that this will make a huge difference to the quality and quantity of sleep - I've never been able to sleep without horizontality, darkness and quiet. All were in short supply last night. The sunrise over the snowy Cairngorms did go a fair way towards making up for it...

 

[IKB]

Speaking of trying to sleep, anyone got any tips? Done three trips now and have a fourth booked (Euston to Fort William) plus I also have a booking on the GWR Night Riviera. Whilst I do love the sleeper, I've found I have a terrible time actually falling and staying asleep when the train is in motion. Didn't find the earplugs and eyemask much help. Anyone had any experience with something like Nytol?

Zimovane sleeping pills! (no joke)

The Mk3's are bad for underfloor noise - I don't know what it is - some auxiliary equipment or other. Last time whatever was under my cabin was vibrating my bunk so much is was like sitting ontop a washing machine on full spin, it actually made me feel sick. I'm hoping the new carriages - having been purpose built as sleepers rather than a bastardised general carriage - will have much improved sound insulation.

 

[185143]

On the Highland sleeper I believe you can board from 20:30, after what time can you have an evening meal on board is it at this time or when the train departs?

I was eating before departure from Inverness, not sure about the London end.

 

[Mag_seven]

Zimovane sleeping pills! (no joke)

The Mk3's are bad for underfloor noise - I don't know what it is - some auxiliary equipment or other. Last time whatever was under my cabin was vibrating my bunk so much is was like sitting ontop a washing machine on full spin, it actually made me feel sick. I'm hoping the new carriages - having been purpose built as sleepers rather than a bastardised general carriage - will have much improved sound insulation.

I remember the old mark 1 sleepers where you could open the window into the berth!

 

[Bald Rick]

Seated. I have a trip booked later in the year where I have a cabin - I imagine that this will make a huge difference to the quality and quantity of sleep - I've never been able to sleep without horizontality, darkness and quiet. All were in short supply last night. The sunrise over the snowy Cairngorms did go a fair way towards making up for it...

Good grief. Having done a few seated overnighters in Europe on trains, and on planes around the world, I have no idea how anyone can possibly sleep on any of them. I barely sleep in a cabin in the MkIII sleepers, hoping for a better result on the Mark Vs. Does anyone know if the beds are longer in the new vs the old?

 

[JohnMcL7]

Seated. I have a trip booked later in the year where I have a cabin - I imagine that this will make a huge difference to the quality and quantity of sleep - I've never been able to sleep without horizontality, darkness and quiet. All were in short supply last night. The sunrise over the snowy Cairngorms did go a fair way towards making up for it...

Your trip sounds similar to my last time on the seated sleeper as it was very cold overnight and and roasting as the sun came up, the carriage I was on had no curtains and a damaged seat as well.

Good grief. Having done a few seated overnighters in Europe on trains, and on planes around the world, I have no idea how anyone can possibly sleep on any of them. I barely sleep in a cabin in the MkIII sleepers, hoping for a better result on the Mark Vs. Does anyone know if the beds are longer in the new vs the old?

That is a good point although I'd still say the seated sleeper was the worst experience I've had.

 

[37047]

Your trip sounds similar to my last time on the seated sleeper as it was very cold overnight and and roasting as the sun came up, the carriage I was on had no curtains and a damaged seat as well.

Yeah, I wasn't expecting a lot of sleep but it was significantly less comfortable than I imagined. It was roasting by Crewe (several people commented), then all the heating went off, temperature plummeted, cue everyone putting layers of clothing back on ~1h later. Heat was back on at some point after Edinburgh, boiling again, etc.

I wouldn't rule out doing it again but I think the only way I'd sleep seated is if I resorted to Nytol.

 

[185143]

Yeah, I wasn't expecting a lot of sleep but it was significantly less comfortable than I imagined. It was roasting by Crewe (several people commented), then all the heating went off, temperature plummeted, cue everyone putting layers of clothing back on ~1h later. Heat was back on at some point after Edinburgh, boiling again, etc.

I wouldn't rule out doing it again but I think the only way I'd sleep seated is if I resorted to Nytol.

Try being awake for 22 hours, a lot of alcohol, only boarding the train at 03:50 and lying across 2 seats. Worked a treat for me!

 

[47271]

I can't help with the seats, don't do it would be my main advice, but there are two schools of thought on the mk3 sleeper. Rooms 1-3 and 9-12 are pretty much over the wheels. They suffer from extra movement and noise from the gangways. 4-8 are central and suffer from less in the way of sharp movement but some people complain about aircon buzz.

I'd take the middle every time, but if you can't sleep on it you can't sleep on it.

Don't think about it too much. The worst thing you can do is lie there saying to yourself 'this is ridiculous, I'm in bed and going sideways at 80 miles per hour'.