Can one get discounts on 1st class apex fares with a Family railcard

[furryfeet]

I thought that one of the changes to "simplify" the system was to give all railcards the discount on apex fares, whether 1st or 2nd class.

Has this been done, or will it
a) occur in September
b) never ?

Each time i attempt to get a railcard discount on the trainline.com the fare INCREASES above what it would have cost without using a railcard !

please advise.

 

[John @ home]

Can one get discounts on 1st class apex fares with a Family railcard

No.

http://www.familyandfriends-railcard.co.uk/terms-and-conditions
"Discounted tickets are not valid for travel in First Class, except for Upgrades to First Class at weekends (subject to availability) upon payment of the appropriate supplement."

Has this been done, or will it
a) occur in September
b) never ?

I have not heard of any plans to do this.

Each time i attempt to get a railcard discount on the trainline.com the fare INCREASES above what it would have cost without using a railcard !

Do you have a child under 5 in the family group who is free without the card but has to be paid for with it?

John

 

[furryfeet]

group consists of
one adult ( cardholder )
one child, aged 7
two children aged 3

part of my confusion is that, for a student railcard, then CAN now get discount on 1st class apex and i thought that this was being made common across all of the railcards, as part of the "simplification" of the fares structure.

Sadly, i fear that you are correct, since i have read the terms on the railcards web site.

 

[Mojo]

part of my confusion is that, for a student railcard, then CAN now get discount on 1st class apex and i thought that this was being made common across all of the railcards, as part of the "simplification" of the fares structure.

Even with the 16-25 Railcard, the 1st Class Advance purchace discount is not for all such Advance tickets.

 

[yorkie]

FC is not for 'riff-raff' () so they don't let railcard holders in except disabled (because if they didn't they'd be in trouble over discrimination, it's OK to discriminate against people by age though! and positive discrimination is OK too!) and senior (as anyone aged 60 never misbehaves) :neutral:

Some TOCs allow Y-Ps in FC. Virgin used to be the only one, but have now been joined by others.

Another way round it is to upgrade to Weekend First, but some TOCs do not allow this, although even if the TOC does not permit it some guards show common sense.

Simplification has not simplified Weekend First or Y-P Advance discounts for FC tickets.

Upgrading costs anything from £6 to £25 per person although the 3 year olds should not need to pay an upgrade if they do not occupy a seat. I think the rule is that under 5s need not pay anything if not occupying a seat, but you can get them a family railcard discounted ticket in order to book them a seat if you prefer. Indeed, if travelling with only 1 child under 5 it is cheaper to book 1 adult + 1 child than just the adult and the child travelling free.

 

[John @ home]

Each time i attempt to get a railcard discount on the trainline.com the fare INCREASES above what it would have cost without using a railcard !

group consists of
one adult ( cardholder )
one child, aged 7
two children aged 3

I don't understand why this should be the case. Try using http://www.nationalexpresseastcoast.com/
instead. This has the additional advantage that they don't charge for delivery or using a credit card, which trainline do.

If the problem persists, tell us date, time and journey, and someone on this group will be able to say what's going on.

One of the advantages of the new "simplified" fares is that child discounts are now offered on all Advance tickets. Until May 2008, some TOCs charged the same for adults and for children. NXEC, for example, had 5 prices of advance tickets but only gave child and railcard discounts on ADV4 and ADV5, the highest two. Now discounts apply in Standard Class on all tickets and in First Class for a wider range of railcards (but not, unfortunately, a Friends and Family Railcard).

Now you should be able to take your family group first class for one and a half times the adult First Advance fare. I would aim for a weekday lunchtime train for the best chance of finding a vacant table of four for your group.

John

 

[furryfeet]

Many thanks for clearing this up.

As to the trainline behaving strangely, it seems to be okay today, following the rules that you have stated above. If i see any funnies in the future, then i will let you know.

I am pleased that children now get 50% off on apex tickets now - the NXEC trait of not giving them was a real deterrent !

Roll on the day when one can discount of 1st class tickets with a family railcard full stop !

The TOC's may find that this generates some extra revenue.
I always look for 1st class, since the adult in the group has a permanent spinal defect and hence needs the extra comfort in order to travel.

Unfortunately this spinal defect does not qualify for a disabled railcard, but that is another story ...