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can public transport ever recover from COVID-19

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Skimpot flyer

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Of course, one has to bear in mind that Ticket Sales figures being 40% of last year does not factor-in those journeys being made without purchasing a ticket, something that has been rife in areas where currently no revenue checks are / were being made.
 
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LowLevel

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Of course, one has to bear in mind that Ticket Sales figures being 40% of last year does not factor-in those journeys being made without purchasing a ticket, something that has been rife in areas where currently no revenue checks are / were being made.

As a guard working through mostly unbarreried areas I am taking far more money than I was pre lockdown, generally several times my daily wage, and colleagues say much the same. Areas where they still aren't doing revenue duties must be draining money like a sieve. Not just local fares either.

Not being a shy flower I also tend to hit the difficult trains head on and I've been raking it in on those without much difficulty too.
 

yorksrob

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As a guard working through mostly unbarreried areas I am taking far more money than I was pre lockdown, generally several times my daily wage, and colleagues say much the same. Areas where they still aren't doing revenue duties must be draining money like a sieve. Not just local fares either.

Not being a shy flower I also tend to hit the difficult trains head on and I've been raking it in on those without much difficulty too.

Excellent stuff.

I've seen plenty of ticket checks over the past couple of days - and my orange card tickets seem to be so much quicker to check than these hi-tec things with guards examining peoples phones etc.
 

bramling

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As a guard working through mostly unbarreried areas I am taking far more money than I was pre lockdown, generally several times my daily wage, and colleagues say much the same. Areas where they still aren't doing revenue duties must be draining money like a sieve. Not just local fares either.

Not being a shy flower I also tend to hit the difficult trains head on and I've been raking it in on those without much difficulty too.

When you say you’re taking more money, is that because off-peak trains are busier due to more leisure use?
 

317 forever

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I don't entirely understand the Welsh obsession with keeping people in their neat little regional boxes. There is almost nothing to be lost by allowing people to travel around between areas of similar case prevalence.

And can you imagine being stuck in Merthyr Tydfil? :D

From my last visit to the area in 2015 they at least get cheap coffee at Wetherspoons. :D
 

LowLevel

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When you say you’re taking more money, is that because off-peak trains are busier due to more leisure use?

Off peak trains are busier but there are more "pay if asked" chancers floating about still. Even on the peak time trains the same applies - taking hundreds in local fares at the minute isn't hard as people have got used to not being checked and times are hard, as they say.
 

theironroad

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Excellent stuff.

I've seen plenty of ticket checks over the past couple of days - and my orange card tickets seem to be so much quicker to check than these hi-tec things with guards examining peoples phones etc.

I think if the person has the ticket ready on screen and it has a qr code and the guard has a reader then then actual check is possibly more accurate than a quick glance at a paper ticket. However, it seems to take people longer to load tickets onto screen and I've witnessed some electronic checks taking forever.

Overall, the little orange card is quicker though shame they reduced the print size on parts of it a few years ago.
 

Markdvdman

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I had a Swansea to Cardiff ticket for £5.30 last Sunday morning for the 9:22am train. Due to engineering works over running and the 8:40am train delayed I jumped on that one as I was worried the 9:22am would have been delayed for he 10:36am train from Cardiff to Merthyr. I could not believe it when a guard came around to check the ticket! He was fine about it due to delays but as I am good with tech I got it up very quickly and he was quick. However, I agree the orange tickets are the best as you do not have to worry about failing tech in any way!
 

route101

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I had a Swansea to Cardiff ticket for £5.30 last Sunday morning for the 9:22am train. Due to engineering works over running and the 8:40am train delayed I jumped on that one as I was worried the 9:22am would have been delayed for he 10:36am train from Cardiff to Merthyr. I could not believe it when a guard came around to check the ticket! He was fine about it due to delays but as I am good with tech I got it up very quickly and he was quick. However, I agree the orange tickets are the best as you do not have to worry about failing tech in any way!

Thats why i stick to Paper Tickets, no need worry apart from Losing it .
 

birchesgreen

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I went back to paper tickets as i found the barriers at New Street never seemed to like the QR codes on e-tickets and it was a PITA having to show my phone to the barrier attendant every time!
 

Mikey C

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It's also irritating that there isn't a standard "National Rail" e-ticket phone App, I'm not cluttering my phone up with operator Apps for an operator I hardly ever use!
 

Bikeman78

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Areas where they still aren't doing revenue duties must be draining money like a sieve. Not just local fares either.
That'll be the whole TFW network then. I don't think any guards have taken a penny of revenue since March 16th.
 

Bletchleyite

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It's also irritating that there isn't a standard "National Rail" e-ticket phone App, I'm not cluttering my phone up with operator Apps for an operator I hardly ever use!

Any operator's app can be used for any other operator's e-tickets. Or just use the PDFs from your email client in Acrobat Reader.
 

route101

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I went back to paper tickets as i found the barriers at New Street never seemed to like the QR codes on e-tickets and it was a PITA having to show my phone to the barrier attendant every time!

Ive never had a QR code work on a barrier.
 

trainophile

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I went back to paper tickets as i found the barriers at New Street never seemed to like the QR codes on e-tickets and it was a PITA having to show my phone to the barrier attendant every time!

Likewise, and not just New Street. My main problem though is having to hold an open phone in one hand while negotiating my way through a narrow barrier gate with a couple of carrier bags and a handbag. Sure I'm going to drop it and smash it one day.
 

sd0733

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That'll be the whole TFW network then. I don't think any guards have taken a penny of revenue since March 16th.
Thats correct. Just from people asking on platforms/knocking on doors for tickets, easily hundreds of pounds gone over that time, some very long distance ones. There must be huge areas of the network where barely any local journeys have been officially undertaken for months going by sales.
 

Bletchleyite

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Thats correct. Just from people asking on platforms/knocking on doors for tickets, easily hundreds of pounds gone over that time, some very long distance ones. There must be huge areas of the network where barely any local journeys have been officially undertaken for months going by sales.

The challenge TfW has is that the Welsh Government made 2m distancing mandatory in the workplace by law. I challenge anyone to sell a ticket without coming within 2m of the customer. Therefore, ticket sales on board are illegal.
 

Bikeman78

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The challenge TfW has is that the Welsh Government made 2m distancing mandatory in the workplace by law. I challenge anyone to sell a ticket without coming within 2m of the customer. Therefore, ticket sales on board are illegal.
Staff in a restaurant can't serve food without getting within two metres of me. Serving a table of four easily takes as long as selling a ticket on the valleys. And I'm not wearing a mask in a restaurant. Another example, I frequently get within 2m of people in Sainsburys including staff. They can make it law as much as they want. In the real world it isn't happening.
 

david1212

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I've seen plenty of ticket checks over the past couple of days - and my orange card tickets seem to be so much quicker to check than these hi-tec things with guards examining peoples phones etc.
... I could not believe it when a guard came around to check the ticket! ... as I am good with tech I got it up very quickly and he was quick. However, I agree the orange tickets are the best as you do not have to worry about failing tech in any way!
Thats why i stick to Paper Tickets, no need worry apart from Losing it .
It's also irritating that there isn't a standard "National Rail" e-ticket phone App, I'm not cluttering my phone up with operator Apps for an operator I hardly ever use!
Likewise, and not just New Street. My main problem though is having to hold an open phone in one hand while negotiating my way through a narrow barrier gate with a couple of carrier bags and a handbag. Sure I'm going to drop it and smash it one day.

IMO what is needed is a National Travel Ticket card that works in the same way as a contactless debit card. It can be loaded with rail and bus tickets bought either in advance online, at a ticket office, at a ticket machine, on a bus etc. I've never used Oyster but presume at the barriers it is reliable. I have had bus cards for Brighton area, Isle of Wight and Stagecoach Devon which have been reliable. Maybe there should be a nominal charge with paper / card tickets as the reserve for very occasional travellers.
The card would be linked to an account accessible on a website and a phone app to show what tickets are bought and loaded. For ' proof of purchase ' from a machine or ticket office the basic details would be on a paper receipt as now for a debit or credit card purchase. For online purchases there would be an email with a PDF attachment.

With the decline in season tickets as journey history would be recorded discounts would be given on a sliding scale depending on the number of journeys made over a month and a year. This could be in both for a specific route and different routes.
For the former blocks of say 10 or 20 tickets could be bought at a discount to the single ticket price. Further purchases of the same blocks would automatically get an additional discount. The major shortcoming is where neither the joining or alighting station has barriers and on train ticket checking does not take place for 99.9% of journeys.

If the card is lost from the linked account it can be replaced while since not used for anything else no issue like Oyster when a debit card is used rather than a separate Oyster card. Any phone / tablet is kept safe from both damage and ' snatch and run ' theft.
 

crablab

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IMO what is needed is a National Travel Ticket card that works in the same way as a contactless debit card. It can be loaded with rail and bus tickets bought either in advance online, at a ticket office, at a ticket machine, on a bus etc. I've never used Oyster but presume at the barriers it is reliable. I have had bus cards for Brighton area, Isle of Wight and Stagecoach Devon which have been reliable. Maybe there should be a nominal charge with paper / card tickets as the reserve for very occasional travellers.
The card would be linked to an account accessible on a website and a phone app to show what tickets are bought and loaded. For ' proof of purchase ' from a machine or ticket office the basic details would be on a paper receipt as now for a debit or credit card purchase. For online purchases there would be an email with a PDF attachment.

With the decline in season tickets as journey history would be recorded discounts would be given on a sliding scale depending on the number of journeys made over a month and a year. This could be in both for a specific route and different routes.
For the former blocks of say 10 or 20 tickets could be bought at a discount to the single ticket price. Further purchases of the same blocks would automatically get an additional discount. The major shortcoming is where neither the joining or alighting station has barriers and on train ticket checking does not take place for 99.9% of journeys.

If the card is lost from the linked account it can be replaced while since not used for anything else no issue like Oyster when a debit card is used rather than a separate Oyster card. Any phone / tablet is kept safe from both damage and ' snatch and run ' theft.

I hate to keep saying it, but what you describe exists and is called ITSO.

Your season ticket discounts are called carnets and exist on SWR and GTR.

The thread on ITSO is here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/posts/4810501/
 

yorksrob

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I see in the latest edition of Rail Magazine, Steve Montgomery, UK Rail Managing Director of First Group has confirmed that TPE has recovered more strongly than the companies other three frannchises, driven by the leisure, rather than the commuter market, thus confirming what most of us have noticed anecdotally over the past three months.

Those who view the Whitby branches of this world as an optional extra, better think again.
 

yorksrob

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I keep meaning to do my Whitby line plus fish and chips.
When I was up there for a few days in September there was reasonable usage.

Indeed. Done it about three times myself since lockdown, and always well patronised.
 

yorksrob

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It's probably considered by many as a day trip to do for mental wellbeing as much as anything else.

Undoubtedly yes. Daytrips have always been important to my personal wellbeing, but moreso now that home is "the office".

In the same article, Mr Montgomery confirms that the Cornish branches are experiencing overcrowding, which is encouraging in many ways.
 

route101

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Undoubtedly yes. Daytrips have always been important to my personal wellbeing, but moreso now that home is "the office".

In the same article, Mr Montgomery confirms that the Cornish branches are experiencing overcrowding, which is encouraging in many ways.

I try and go away for the day once week or once a fortnight, does wonders!
 

Class195

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It'll be years before we see growth again.

I fear that the railways have lost the peak commuters forever.
 

Geeves

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I'm not so sure I would say lost forever. In the bright new future of Boris's green Britain I could see fuel tax being hiked up.
 
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