Chiltern Railways - Project Evergreen 3

[Chafford1]

Chiltern's latest upgrade plans are as follows (from the Marlow-Maidenhead Passengers Association):

"Line speed increases between Ruislip and Aynho Junction: for example raising from 75mph to 85mph the linespeed between West Ruislip and High Wycombe. Linespeeds will not exceed 100mph;

Revisions to track layouts at stations where speeds are currently constrained: particularly at Bicester North and Princes Risborough;

Building in capability to the route so that it can continue to perform highly whilst carrying a greater number of trains: for example by providing passing loops at key locations, improving turnback facilities at others, and creating a track layout suitable for bi-directional operation;

Constructing a new chord at Bicester and upgrading the Bicester-Oxford line to be predominantly double track with 90mph linespeeds and 5 minute signalling headways; with an independent access to Oxford station to avoid congestion and performance issues on the existing route there;

A recast timetable to reduce the number of stops made by long distance trains, whilst sustaining frequencies at key locations;

A programme to upgrade all trains with modern low weight engines and transmissions which accelerate more quickly and use less fuel than currently.

Subject to early sign off by stakeholders and the Government completion of the works required to deliver faster services on the existing network should be achieved from the December 2011 timetable change and Bicester-Oxford works completed to enable Chiltern trains to operate from the December 2012 timetable."

 

[Phoenix]

Not a bad plan overall with some good but realistic point's indeed.
It's quite funny how they say there aim is to get modern low weight engined trains with quicker acceleration.
Isn't that just about everyones goal.

 

[xc170]

Yes not a bad plan. Are Chiltern still planning some Loco hauled services or was that idea scrapped?

Adam

 

[Metroland]

Chiltern leading the way, once again.

 

[The_Rail_WAy]

Yes not a bad plan. Are Chiltern still planning some Loco hauled services or was that idea scrapped?

Adam

I would'nt think so, they do plan to aquire a fleet of 172/1 Turbostars in the future and thats about it.

 

[87015]

I would'nt think so, they do plan to aquire a fleet of 172/1 Turbostars in the future and thats about it.

What about the 165 re-engineing mentioned in the press release above?

DB Regio have certainly been buying up Mk3s by many accounts and Chiltern remains the most logical place to use them.

 

[The_Rail_WAy]

What about the 165 re-engineing mentioned in the press release above?

DB Regio have certainly been buying up Mk3s by many accounts and Chiltern remains the most logical place to use them.

I was'nt aware of this, certainly worth keeping an eye on.

 

[xc170]

I was'nt aware of this, certainly worth keeping an eye on.

Certainly is, I wouldnt mid seeing a few Mk3s and a 67 in chiltern livery

Adam

 

[The Planner]

Chiltern are still planning the 67 and coach set for Brum Marylebone runs.

 

[Metroland]

The Chiltern proposals for Oxford - Bicester are part of the East -West scheme, which is looking like a 100mph interregional route with 1/2 hourly services from Oxford - MK and onto Bedford, including the link from Aylesbury.

http://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/reports/documents/GRIP3FinalReport.pdf

 

[Chafford1]

Does this upgrade include the 4 tracking at Beaconsfield?

 

[The Planner]

Does this upgrade include the 4 tracking at Beaconsfield?

Last i heard it did.

 

[Mojo]

Last i heard it did.

So does that mean that after having just adjusted the track to allow higher speeds through the station (useful for non-stop services) they are basically going to put it back again?

 

[Chafford1]

Presumably they'll reinstate the 2 through tracks and station loops.

 

[Chafford1]

Chiltern's latest upgrade plans are as follows (from the Marlow-Maidenhead Passengers Association):

"Line speed increases between Ruislip and Aynho Junction: for example raising from 75mph to 85mph the linespeed between West Ruislip and High Wycombe. Linespeeds will not exceed 100mph;

Revisions to track layouts at stations where speeds are currently constrained: particularly at Bicester North and Princes Risborough;

Building in capability to the route so that it can continue to perform highly whilst carrying a greater number of trains: for example by providing passing loops at key locations, improving turnback facilities at others, and creating a track layout suitable for bi-directional operation;

Constructing a new chord at Bicester and upgrading the Bicester-Oxford line to be predominantly double track with 90mph linespeeds and 5 minute signalling headways; with an independent access to Oxford station to avoid congestion and performance issues on the existing route there;

A recast timetable to reduce the number of stops made by long distance trains, whilst sustaining frequencies at key locations;

A programme to upgrade all trains with modern low weight engines and transmissions which accelerate more quickly and use less fuel than currently.

Subject to early sign off by stakeholders and the Government completion of the works required to deliver faster services on the existing network should be achieved from the December 2011 timetable change and Bicester-Oxford works completed to enable Chiltern trains to operate from the December 2012 timetable."

I've requested a copy of the Evergreen 3 upgrade from Chiltern. Hopefully, they'll oblige!

 

[Chafford1]

This is a recent presentation that Chiltern have given on their Oxford service proposals:

http://www.southeast-ra.gov.uk/documents/events/52/rtb_160109_chiltern_railways_pres.pdf

 

[The Planner]

Interesting report, looks like they have pushed it back a bit. Last I heard was the Dec 12 timetable, now appears to be May 13.

Also, no mention of the Bicester Village station that was on the cards. 1 freight path an hour is a little odd aswell, Id expect and would put money on there being more. 5 minute headways on a 90mph line seems like a penny pinching move, thats either 3 or 4 signals in 7½ miles.

They stand to make a killing though, Bicester in 14 minutes and Wycombe in 38, both hideously served by public transport from Oxford.

 

[paul1609]

Im not surprised that they cant justify a seperate station for bicester village is must be all of 400 yards from Bicester Town!

 

[Chafford1]

Interesting report, looks like they have pushed it back a bit. Last I heard was the Dec 12 timetable, now appears to be May 13.

Also, no mention of the Bicester Village station that was on the cards. 1 freight path an hour is a little odd aswell, Id expect and would put money on there being more. 5 minute headways on a 90mph line seems like a penny pinching move, thats either 3 or 4 signals in 7½ miles.

They stand to make a killing though, Bicester in 14 minutes and Wycombe in 38, both hideously served by public transport from Oxford.

If they are going to use 168s on the Oxford services, what will be used on the accelerated Birmingham services - class 67s and mk3s?

 

[The Planner]

If they are going to use 168s on the Oxford services, what will be used on the accelerated Birmingham services - class 67s and mk3s?

Not sure, they are trying their hardest to get the 67 differentials as close to the 168 speeds as they can at the moment, there are improvements at Princes Risborough and Aynho - Bicester coming in around May.

 

[route:oxford]

Looking at the average journey time for a FGW service to London - it's about 1h03m. The average journey time quoted for a Chiltern Service to Marylebone is 1h06m.

It takes about 3 minutes to get from Paddington to Marylebone - so nothing in it timewise. If I was in Oxford Station I could not think of any reason why I'd want to choose a FGW service over a Chiltern Service.

I wonder if Chiltern will sell a cheap ticket to Brum with a walk at Bicester. The fares via Cross Country are pretty high.

 

[Metroland]

1 freight path an hour is a little odd aswell, Id expect and would put money on there being more. 5 minute headways on a 90mph line seems like a penny pinching move, thats either 3 or 4 signals in 7½ miles.

Perhaps, but with the line through Wolvercote tunnel single track (because there is a ring road roundabout on top) I would guess that the 'bottleneck' really stops you practically adding much more. Besides, the Banbury line is still two-aspect signalling, with a heavy mix of Voyagers, freight, stoppers, and other stuff - although admittedly this is likely to get resignalled when Saltley take over in the future.

 

[The Planner]

Besides, the Banbury line is still two-aspect signalling, with a heavy mix of Voyagers, freight, stoppers, and other stuff - although admittedly this is likely to get resignalled when Saltley take over in the future.

Banbury is 6 minute headways at the moment, Banbury is scheduled for re-signalling around 2013-2014, but I dont know if that takes it down past Heyford. Wolvercote roundabout isnt that much of an issue, you could use junction margins of 3 before and 2 after if the signals are spaced in good places.

 

[route:oxford]

Perhaps, but with the line through Wolvercote tunnel single track (because there is a ring road roundabout on top) I would guess that the 'bottleneck' really stops you practically adding much more.

According to some documents additional funding is being sought to improve the Wolvercote tunnel. Which would only be sensible, there's no point engineering a bottleneck into a overall upgrade.

Just need to look at the Alloa line. Users/usage is demanding additional services to Stirling or east to Dunfermline yet the single tracking is rumoured to be inhibiting growth.

Out of interest. Has the Wolvercote tunnel always been singled? Or was it rebuilt during road improvements?

 

[Chafford1]

Not sure, they are trying their hardest to get the 67 differentials as close to the 168 speeds as they can at the moment, there are improvements at Princes Risborough and Aynho - Bicester coming in around May.

Which will,no doubt, facilitate an the extra WSMR service which is mentioned in the May 2009 consultation timetable proposal document - see the link below and scroll down to the bottom to upload the Word document.

It looks as if WSMR plan to run an extra train out of Marylebone around 18:30 from May 2009.

http://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/plan-your-journey/download-our-timetable/

 

[Bill EWS]

Routexford, the Oxford-Cambridge was double track too and from Bedford St Johns. As far as I remember, working over the route, it was double when the road over Wolvercot Tunnel was built and shouldn't be a problem during any upgrading today. It would be nice to see the route double-tracked once again. It was a really nice route to work over when all the stations and signalboxes were in place.

I also worked at Marylebone and walked between the and Paddington many times over the six years I was there. I could walk it in 12 minutes withouit having to run, as I had to to do on ocassions. However, I decided to walk it rather than wait for underground trains that often made me late arriving at Marylebone Depot or missing a train at Paddington on the way home. While it may just be 3-4 minutes on the Underground I wouldn't bet on it ever being the 'norm', so perhaps the new link at Bicester may well prove worthwhile.

However I find it a bit sad that they are planning to spend so much making the Bicester link, rather than reopening the Oxford-Princess Riceborough branch. It is 8 miles shorter to Paddington over that route and with increased speeds and enough passing loops it could well prove worth the money and effort and which M arylebone could also benefit .

However, after many attempts by ASLE&F trying to get the Marylebone services extended to Thame and beyond Banbury numerous times during the 70's and always being tuned down by H.Q. it is nice to see Marylebone having these new services and with plans for even more.

 

[Metroland]

Out of interest. Has the Wolvercote tunnel always been singled? Or was it rebuilt during road improvements?

Good question. There always looks to have been a tunnel there, and I assume double track as the route was double track throughout. Looking at 1900 maps, there was a road over the top. Looking at 1920s maps the road system in the area had been improved (as they were around England a lot in this period) and a roundabout was built over the top. Looking at maps from 1939, there was definitely 2 tracks through the tunnel

The situation appeared to be the same in the 1950s, shown here

http://www.npemap.org.uk/tiles/map.html#450,210,1

I shall guess that during the late 60s/1970/1980s the ring round system was improved round Oxford, and when the roundabout was improved with dual carriageways the tunnel had to be strengthened, in which case the line was singled. The single line tokenless block system worked on the current like dates from the late 70s/80s, so I guess it was about then.

The current situation is shown here

http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=51.788263&lon=-1.280655&z=17.2&r=0&src=msl

I guess a double track through out 90/100mph with 3 aspect signalling would make more sense and give a certain amount of future proofing as well as opportunities for diversions.

Interestingly much of the line remained open till 1993, as was used by freight and ECS. The occasional Xmas special to MK was run from Aylesbury.

 

[The Planner]

However I find it a bit sad that they are planning to spend so much making the Bicester link, rather than reopening the Oxford-Princess Riceborough branch. It is 8 miles shorter to Paddington over that route and with increased speeds and enough passing loops it could well prove worth the money and effort and which Marylebone could also benefit .

Could never happen now, I think part of the alignment in Thame has been built on at the Oil terminal, the services on the M40 at Wheatley have also decimated the alignment, the bridge over the A40 just past there would need some serious work as they knocked down the central pier, and the old station site at Wheatley and beyond at Littleworth is all built upon. A sizable chunk of the emabankment at Horspath is all gone aswell with houses in its place.

The best you could hope for is some sort of Parkway station at the M40 services, but with Haddenham and Thame there, what would be the point ?
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I shall guess that during the late 60s/1970/1980s the ring round system was improved round Oxford, and when the roundabout was improved with dual carriageways the tunnel had to be strengthened, in which case the line was singled. The single line tokenless block system worked on the current like dates from the late 70s/80s, so I guess it was about then.

Most of the Western bypass of Oxford is early 60s vintage, so the current tunnel would have been built then. Sunderland Ave and the A40 out to Witney was all built in the late 20s/early 30s.

 

[Chafford1]

Chiltern are developing a new website for Evergreen 3:

http://www.chiltern-evergreen3.co.uk/

 

[gmiller]

Hi, I would dearly love the Princes Risborough - Thame - Oxford branch to reopen, and I believe Chiltern hold this view too as a long term aspiration but due to cost have gone for the Bicester chord option for the time being, The Thame/Oxford branch would be quicker than the existing Oxford-Paddington service and trains could continue on to the Cotswold line to Worcester, also a Parkway station could be developed on the ring road near Cowley,Oxford taking pressure off the hugely congested Oxford roads.

The route from Princes Risborough to Thame exists completely as it is used as a public footpath called the Phoenix Trail, the oil terminal does not obstruct the line but a level crossing there would need to be rebuilt, the line also exists at the Oxford end as it is used as a freight line by the BMW Mini works, the expensive bit is the crossing of the M40 motorway which has cut the old line in two, there are neighbouring fields to miss out the service station which has taken some of the lines route so that isnt so much an issue.

The cost of re establishing this link was estimated at £250 Million in 2002 prices, clearly Project Evergreen 3 is going to be nowhere near this amount. I do see the Thame/Oxford link being rebuilt but the Bicester chord is a good interim option, plus the East-West link, Aylesburys connection to Milton Keynes and Watford and a Chiltern Metro Service are higher in the priority order.