Class 28: Metro-Vick Type 2 Co-Bo

[GRALISTAIR]

Not a hydraulic. It's full name is a Metropolitan Vickers Diesel Electric Type 2, or Metrovick for short.

Yes we always called them Metrovicks.

 

[Revaulx]

I’ve just read the Co-Bo’s Wonkypedia entry. I hadn’t realised Metrovick and Beyer Peacock had a joint venture works in Stockton, where the Co-Bos were built; they were the only locos to be built there for BR.

The Metrovick Class 82 AC electrics were built at the main Beyer Peacock works in Gorton. I don’t think they had any reliability issues; it was the sainted English Electric Class 83s with their mercury arc rectifiers that were prone to going pop.

 

[Ash Bridge]

D6300-05 were built with 1000 bhp; the remainder were 1100 bhp

Ah yes, so they were - thanks for pointing this out.

 

[peteb]

Was the powered bogie on the Hornby Dublo Co-Bo identical to that used on the Hornby Dublo Deltic model ?? If so, it would be an easy option to choose 2 models requiring only a single basic bogie design.

I'm not sure, I now only have the class 20, that has one powered and one trailing bogie with bogie sides in metal that screw on and off. I cant recall whether the deltic power bogie is the same as the class 28. Maybe someone who owns one could clarify?

 

[WesternLancer]

I'm not sure, I now only have the class 20, that has one powered and one trailing bogie with bogie sides in metal that screw on and off. I cant recall whether the deltic power bogie is the same as the class 28. Maybe someone who owns one could clarify?

I'm not sure myself - it may be that the basic bogie is the same but the side frames are different in order to match the look of the prototype bogies to the viewer.
I think they all require rubber tyros though to aid grip (the Dublo class 20 Bo Bo, the class 28 Co Bo and the class 55 Co Co)

 

[edwin_m]

The Metrovick Class 82 AC electrics were built at the main Beyer Peacock works in Gorton. I don’t think they had any reliability issues; it was the sainted English Electric Class 83s with their mercury arc rectifiers that were prone to going pop.

Didn't all of Class 81-14 (maybe 85 too?) have mercury arc rectifiers, which were replaced by semiconductors pretty much as soon as adequate devices became available?

 

[Richard Scott]

Didn't all of Class 81-14 (maybe 85 too?) have mercury arc rectifiers, which were replaced by semiconductors pretty much as soon as adequate devices became available?

85 were semiconductor from new, I believe.

 

[Bevan Price]

I’ve just read the Co-Bo’s Wonkypedia entry. I hadn’t realised Metrovick and Beyer Peacock had a joint venture works in Stockton, where the Co-Bos were built; they were the only locos to be built there for BR.

The Metrovick Class 82 AC electrics were built at the main Beyer Peacock works in Gorton. I don’t think they had any reliability issues; it was the sainted English Electric Class 83s with their mercury arc rectifiers that were prone to going pop.

From memory, none of Clases 82-84 were particularly reliable.

 

[simonw]

If, back in the day, you had had a Hornby Dublo train set you may have had one (or seen it in the catalogue) however!

Hornby Dublo 2233 Co-Bo Diesel loco 2 rail | Dublo For Sale

Loco is in superb condition and does not appear to have had much use. Body is virtually unmarked Box is in very good condition but has been taped at one end. Original packing parts, instructions, guarantee, test tag and tube of oil. R

www.dubloforsale.co.uk

Quite why they decided to tool up to model this 'dud' design is no doubt a question for another thread / forum - but it probably helps shed light on the deciosion making processes at Meccano Ltd that resulted in Hornby going bankrupt.

maybe the chaps Hornby Dublo were seduced by Mr Cuneo's superb painting of the loco hauling the Condor named express freight train?

Terence Cuneo | Night Freight (Condor) (1960) | MutualArt

View Night Freight (Condor) (1960) By Cuneo Terence; oil on canvas; 38 x 48 in. (97 x 122 cm.); Signed; . Access more artwork lots and estimated & realized auction prices on MutualArt.

www.mutualart.com

A video of Me Cuneo at work on the painting.

 

[Cowley]

A video of Me Cuneo at work on the painting.

Wonderful.

 

[Revaulx]

Didn't all of Class 81-14 (maybe 85 too?) have mercury arc rectifiers, which were replaced by semiconductors pretty much as soon as adequate devices became available?

Yikes - you’re quite right.

As far as I can remember, the only ones that gave trouble were the NBL/GEC 84s and (surprisingly) the EE 83s.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Yikes - you’re quite right.

As far as I can remember, the only ones that gave trouble were the NBL/GEC 84s and (surprisingly) the EE 83s.

I seem to recall it was the 83 & 84s that were actually taken out of front line service and stored OOU from the late 60s until they were refurbished/rebuilt at some point during the mid 70s?

 

[WesternLancer]

A video of Me Cuneo at work on the painting.

Thanks - wonderful clip! Remarkable that the next line was a running line...
Where was the mouse?

 

[Revaulx]

I seem to recall it was the 83 & 84s that were actually taken out of front line service and stored OOU from the late 60s until they were refurbished/rebuilt at some point during the mid 70s?

Yup. When the 87s were being ordered for the Weaver Jn- Glasgow electrification someone remembered that there were 25 83s and 84s that had been in store for years. They got done up and fitted with silicon rectifiers, and the 87 order was reduced.

 

[Bungle158]

The Thomas character was BoCo, not CoBo (not that it makes much difference!).

Your recall skills are obviously better than mine

 

[D841 Roebuck]

Also in the "Thomas" books, there is a picture in "Enterprising Engines" which shows a Class 28 in blue livery with Full Yellow ends. This must represent D5701, the only one to get this livery in service.

 

[Cowley]

Also in the "Thomas" books, there is a picture in "Enterprising Engines" which shows a Class 28 in blue livery with Full Yellow ends. This must represent D5701, the only one to get this livery in service.

Is that the picture where Oliver, Toad and the autocoach are hiding?

 

[Richard Scott]

Is that the picture where Oliver, Toad and the autocoach are hiding?

If one of those written by Rev Awdry would be true to original, he hated later editions as didn't follow correct railway practice. All of the stories were based on real railway operations. My father did Rev Awdry's accounts and used to relay a lot of his tales to us.

 

[Cowley]

If one of those written by Rev Awdry would be true to original, he hated later editions as didn't follow correct railway practice. All of the stories were based on real railway operations. My father did Rev Awdry's accounts and used to relay a lot of his tales to us.

At the risk of dragging this off topic, lord only knows what he’d have made of the pseudo Warship with the weird crane thing on the roof in that Hollywood Thomas movie.

 

[Richard Scott]

At the risk of dragging this off topic, lord only knows what he’d have made of the pseudo Warship with the weird crane thing on the roof in that Hollywood Thomas movie.

He wouldn't have liked it one bit! Yes, slightly off topic but think we can link it through the BoCo character?!!!

 

[Cowley]

He wouldn't have liked it one bit! Yes, slightly off topic but think we can link it through the BoCo character?!!!

Yeah why not.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Yup. When the 87s were being ordered for the Weaver Jn- Glasgow electrification someone remembered that there were 25 83s and 84s that had been in store for years. They got done up and fitted with silicon rectifiers, and the 87 order was reduced.

Weren’t they stored at Bury? Or some of them at least. I am sure I have a color slide from 1971 ish.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Weren’t they stored at Bury? Or some of them at least. I am sure I have a color slide from 1971 ish.

Definitely were, I visited Bury with a school mate a bit later perhaps during springtime of 1972 and there were several stored inside the shed along with E26000 Tommy.

 

[Helvellyn]

Yes, definitely Bury as this photo would show. Seems a number were stored in the open.

https://www.google.co.uk/imgres?img...hUKEwjArouO5OfuAhUVkp4KHW3EAEMQMygBegUIARCbAQ

 

[6Gman]

On the 81-85 issue I think the general view was that they went (in declining order of reliability)

85
81
82
83
84

 

[Gloster]

Recollection from my reading is that the 85 were the best of the early designs, while the 84 were clearly the worst.

EDIT: To be clear, the 85 were much better than the other four designs, although nothing like as good as the 86. The 84 were clearly much worse than any of the other four early designs.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Recollection from my reading is that the 85 were the best of the early designs, while the 84 were clearly the worst.

Agreed totally.

 

[36270k]

On the 81-85 issue I think the general view was that they went (in declining order of reliability)

85
81
82
83
84

Class 85 were fitted with germanium or silicon rectifiers from new.
Others were fitted with MercuryArc rectifiers.
The GEC rectifiers in the Class 84 were a particularly poor design.
When Class 81-84 were designed solid state rectifiers had only just been introduced.

Class 304 were the first to be fitted with germanium rectifiers

Link for report on rectifier failures

Failures of Multiple-unit Electric Trains on British Railways: Final Report :: The Railways Archive

Archive of UK railways documents

www.railwaysarchive.co.uk

 

[Revaulx]

Definitely were, I visited Bury with a school mate a bit later perhaps during springtime of 1972 and there were several stored inside the shed along with E26000 Tommy.

I saw them on my first trip to Bury, which was to travel on the last train from Rawtenstall. That must have been 1972 also.

Yes, definitely Bury as this photo would show. Seems a number were stored in the open.

https://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=https://railphotoprints.uk/img/s/v-10/p2195930307-4.jpg&imgrefurl=https://railphotoprints.uk/p274052502/h82E33CC3&tbnid=dSl86e2J0PY1vM&vet=12ahUKEwjArouO5OfuAhUVkp4KHW3EAEMQMygBegUIARCbAQ..i&docid=KoLZc_5CtGu42M&w=800&h=566&q=stored class 84 locomotives&ved=2ahUKEwjArouO5OfuAhUVkp4KHW3EAEMQMygBegUIARCbAQ

They’re still in Electric Blue, which goes to show how long they’d been out of service!

 

[Inversnecky]

A video of Me Cuneo at work on the painting.

Great video!

If, back in the day, you had had a Hornby Dublo train set you may have had one (or seen it in the catalogue) however!

Hornby Dublo 2233 Co-Bo Diesel loco 2 rail | Dublo For Sale

Loco is in superb condition and does not appear to have had much use. Body is virtually unmarked Box is in very good condition but has been taped at one end. Original packing parts, instructions, guarantee, test tag and tube of oil. R

www.dubloforsale.co.uk

Quite why they decided to tool up to model this 'dud' design is no doubt a question for another thread / forum - but it probably helps shed light on the deciosion making processes at Meccano Ltd that resulted in Hornby going bankrupt.

maybe the chaps Hornby Dublo were seduced by Mr Cuneo's superb painting of the loco hauling the Condor named express freight train?

Terence Cuneo | Night Freight (Condor) (1960) | MutualArt

View Night Freight (Condor) (1960) By Cuneo Terence; oil on canvas; 38 x 48 in. (97 x 122 cm.); Signed; . Access more artwork lots and estimated & realized auction prices on MutualArt.

www.mutualart.com

I wonder how much this sold for, you can’t see unless you register.