Class 315 Withdrawals

[JaJaWa]

Considering all TfL Rail services will be branded as Elizabeth line from 24 May, they will have to stick Elizabeth line roundels on the Class 315s if any are staying!

 

[fat_boy_pete]

Considering all TfL Rail services will be branded as Elizabeth line from 24 May, they will have to stick Elizabeth line roundels on the Class 315s if any are staying!

For one diagram and six units? I think the last revenue run will almost certainly be in the week before.

 

[XCTurbostar]

For one diagram and six units? I think the last revenue run will almost certainly be in the week before.

Unlikely. All three areas of the Elizabeth Line are treated as separate operating units. As @JonathanH said, there is no reason to suspect they are linked. Its quite possible that they are retired on the last week of seperate operations in 2023!

 

[fat_boy_pete]

Unlikely. All three areas of the Elizabeth Line are treated as separate operating units. As @JonathanH said, there is no reason to suspect they are linked. Its quite possible that they are retired on the last week of seperate operations in 2023!

But just from a brand and image perspective, they won't want the old trains on the newly rebranded and publicised Lizzie line. Yes they may be kept in reserve in Aldersbook sidings, but the diagram itself will be allocated to a 345. They have enough units now the dedicated testing units are no more and the 9 car conversions mostly complete.

 

[adc82140]

Is there still a plan in the interim period to keep a handful of 7 cars for the ex GWR Paddington platform 14 peak terminators, or is there going to be some platform jiggery-pokery after the May timetable change?

 

[JonathanH]

Considering all TfL Rail services will be branded as Elizabeth line from 24 May, they will have to stick Elizabeth line roundels on the Class 315s if any are staying!

The pair of 315s I just passed on their way into Liverpool Street didn't have any branding on at all.

But just from a brand and image perspective, they won't want the old trains on the newly rebranded and publicised Lizzie line.

They will want whatever works from an operational point of view. It isn't as if one is going to turn up in the tunnel.

Yes they may be kept in reserve in Aldersbook sidings, but the diagram itself will be allocated to a 345.

Haven't the 315s been working nominally 345 diagrams for the last year already?

They have enough units now the dedicated testing units are no more and the 9 car conversions mostly complete.

70 units yes but 345016/17/38 are still in the conversion and acceptance phase, 345011 seems to have been held back for something, 345042/56/64 are still 7-car units and needed for specific services on the Paddington side. That suggests they might still be in operation after 24 May.

Is there still a plan in the interim period to keep a handful of 7 cars for the ex GWR Paddington platform 14 peak terminators, or is there going to be some platform jiggery-pokery after the May timetable change?

The services are still scheduled to use platform 14 after the timetable change.

 

[fat_boy_pete]

Haven't the 315s been working nominally 345 diagrams for the last year already

Six units left for one diagram I believe. Hence as soon as the 3 converted units have been accepted, which I would be surprised if that takes another 3 weeks, I think that diagram will switch.

 

[33021]

Be round a little while longer, run 2 M-F passenger diagrams and one ECS

 

[XCTurbostar]

Should be noted that Eversholt lists the withdrawal as "30 Sep 22 to 1 Apr 23"

https://eversholtrail.co.uk/app/uploads/2022/04/Rolling-stock-available-for-lease-and-or-disposal-27-Apr-2022.pdf

 

[345 050]

But just from a brand and image perspective, they won't want the old trains on the newly rebranded and publicised Lizzie line. Yes they may be kept in reserve in Aldersbook sidings, but the diagram itself will be allocated to a 345. They have enough units now the dedicated testing units are no more and the 9 car conversions mostly complete.

Agreed. Given the availability of 345 9-car units, and the new Elizabeth Line branding, surely they will pull out all the stops to move to full 345 operation from next Monday.

 

[prod_pep]

Agreed. Given the availability of 345 9-car units, and the new Elizabeth Line branding, surely they will pull out all the stops to move to full 345 operation from next Monday.

They're planning to keep the 315s until at least September. They will definitely still be in service beyond next Monday.

 

[fat_boy_pete]

They're planning to keep the 315s until at least September. They will definitely still be in service beyond next Monday.

As cover, I am not surprised. But will there still be two regular diagrams for 315's?

 

[Bikeman78]

As cover, I am not surprised. But will there still be two regular diagrams for 315's?

Ideally they need to run almost every day to keep up train crew traction knowledge. Otherwise it's pointless having them.

 

[Gulf1159]

Ideally they need to run almost every day to keep up train crew traction knowledge. Otherwise it's pointless having them.

Only Shenfield and Ilford drivers cover the two remaining diagrams

 

[345 050]

Still out this evening.

 

[XCTurbostar]

We someone please list the current XR 315 diagrams?

 

[hwl]

Agreed. Given the availability of 345 9-car units, and the new Elizabeth Line branding, surely they will pull out all the stops to move to full 345 operation from next Monday.

But what happens when they need to convert the last 3 7car units and start GEML through running? ...which happens to be the real capacity crunch point.

 

[345 050]

But what happens when they need to convert the last 3 7car units and start GEML through running? ...which happens to be the real capacity crunch point.

Given that we will see a 22 tph intermediate step in 'Autumn' I'm not sure there will be as much of a crunch as initially expected. So maybe that won't be an issue now?

 

[507020]

We someone please list the current XR 315 diagrams?

Please see my thread titled Class 315 diagrams following Elizabeth Line core section opening

Guess again. In theory nothing changes just because the core is opening to passengers, so still look out for the 15.38 Shenfield to Liverpool St etc, but of course they are on borrowed time.
The 15:38 Shenfield - Liverpool St then forms the 16:30 departure etc
The three sets cycle round Ilford Depot, Aldersbrook CS and Shenfield. The 07.51 SNF-LST is the morning working, together with a standby train at Gidea Park.
Unless something goes wrong it is just the 16.30 LST-SNF to look for, which returns for the 18.15 LST-SNF. You can follow the diagram on Real Time Trains.

I am planning to go on the 16:30 off Liverpool St following the core section opening on Tuesday.

 

[33021]

Please see my thread titled Class 315 diagrams following Elizabeth Line core section opening

I am planning to go on the 16:30 off Liverpool St following the core section opening on Tuesday.

Post 1328

 

[507020]

Post 1328

Which itself is just a quote of post 7 in a thread called Class 315 Diagrams (Jan 2022)

 

[iphone76]

Only Shenfield and Ilford drivers cover the two remaining diagrams

Plus Gidea Park

 

[Gulf1159]

Plus Gidea Park

Nope Gidea Park depot doesn’t have any 315 diagrams. Some of the drivers haven’t driven them since last Decembers timetable change, So require a traction refresher but as the 315’s are on borrowed time they aren’t getting them

 

[iphone76]

Nope Gidea Park depot doesn’t have any 315 diagrams. Some of the drivers haven’t driven them since last Decembers timetable change, So require a traction refresher but as the 315’s are on borrowed time they aren’t getting them

That's odd as I'm a GP driver and one of our afternoon jobs is still booked a 315 (and run this week). Plus they are still on our licences.

 

[DanNCL]

In any case it's 6 months traction competency lasts before expiring, so even if a driver hadn't driven a 315 since last December, they still wouldn't need to remove them from their licenses for another month yet. Even just one working of any traction extends a driver's competency on it by 6 months, even when that driver's depot no longer has booked work on that traction - as an example the last Newcastle based LNER drivers didn't have to remove 91+Mark 4 sets from their licenses until nearly a year after they lost booked work on them.

How long ago did Old Oak Common, Abbey Wood and Plumstead drivers lose booked work on the 315s?

 

[Gulf1159]

That's odd as I'm a GP driver and one of our afternoon jobs is still booked a 315 (and run this week). Plus they are still on our licences.

Oops stand corrected missed that GP712 diagram working 1903 2W63 Shen to Liv st and 2W62 return

 

[iphone76]

Oops stand corrected missed that GP712 diagram working 1903 2W63 Shen to Liv st and 2W62 return

That's the one! Lol.

In any case it's 6 months traction competency lasts before expiring, so even if a driver hadn't driven a 315 since last December, they still wouldn't need to remove them from their licenses for another month yet. Even just one working of any traction extends a driver's competency on it by 6 months, even when that driver's depot no longer has booked work on that traction - as an example the last Newcastle based LNER drivers didn't have to remove 91+Mark 4 sets from their licenses until nearly a year after they lost booked work on them.

How long ago did Old Oak Common, Abbey Wood and Plumstead drivers lose booked work on the 315s?

As far as I can remember those depots never had any booked 315 work. Although some drivers were trained on them, and some transfered from the East depots with them on, all the old retention diagrams on the East were booked only to be 345s.

 

[ACBest]

Can confirm 315’s still out - travelled on a pair of 315853 and one other (can’t remember what the second one was, sorry!) earlier on, working the aforementioned 1630 ex Liverpool Street.

 

[Wivenswold]

I saw a pair in Shenfield sidings this afternoon and forgot to check to see if some wag at Ilford Depot had stuck some Liz Line roundels on them. I think it's likely forbidden lest they taint the brand.

 

[bluegoblin7]

Can confirm 315’s still out - travelled on a pair of 315853 and one other (can’t remember what the second one was, sorry!) earlier on, working the aforementioned 1630 ex Liverpool Street.

838.

No external branding (just the removal of TfL Rail roundels), but they have received Elizabeth line maps internally.