Class 350/1 refurbishment

[NoMorePacers]

To be honest (bearing in mind I’ve only used a 350/1 once, which was last weekend) I think the new refurbishment, at least in the pictures, looks WORSE than the old seating. Especially Third Class. You can’t call that First Class, since the seats are both a) worse than standard and b) have a much worse moquette than standard.

 

[Bletchleyite]

No, they weren't, but I'm mainly talking about suitcases.

Suitcases quite happily fit in the overheads of Class 350s, they are very large and square. Only the new CAF DMUs/EMUs and 80x have bigger racks.

 

[Bletchleyite]

To be honest (bearing in mind I’ve only used a 350/1 once, which was last weekend) I think the new refurbishment, at least in the pictures, looks WORSE than the old seating. Especially Third Class. You can’t call that First Class, since the seats are both a) worse than standard and b) have a much worse moquette than standard.

Class 350 First (Third) Class is a joke. Even if I held a First Class ticket I would sit in Standard.

They really should have forked out for some Grammer IC3000s or FISA LEANs (as SWR did), even at 2+2 that might have been worth a few quid extra.

 

[BucksBones]

Suitcases quite happily fit in the overheads of Class 350s, they are very large and square. Only the new CAF DMUs/EMUs and 80x have bigger racks.

They’re good, big racks and I always use them for suitcases. However I think many people are wary of using them for heavy items as, firstly, some may be worried that things could fall out and cause damage; secondly, many TOCs past and present have encouraged passengers to use them only for small, light items; and thirdly, people may assume they can’t fit much up there after having become accustomed to the tiny racks on many trains. (And of course many people can’t lift heavy things that high).

However, 350s are particularly afflicted by bag-on-seat syndrome and I find it surprising that most guards don’t encourage people to use the racks when they walk through the train. Perhaps they are trying to avoid a volley of abuse.

Hopefully people will find the new vertical rack; it will certainly help in the carriage that contains it at least!

 

[BucksBones]

Class 350 First (Third) Class is a joke. Even if I held a First Class ticket I would sit in Standard.

They really should have forked out for some Grammer IC3000s or FISA LEANs (as SWR did), even at 2+2 that might have been worth a few quid extra.

The thought of LNR forking out for anything more than is absolutely necessary is frankly laughable!

 

[RealTrains07]

Class 350 First (Third) Class is a joke. Even if I held a First Class ticket I would sit in Standard.

They really should have forked out for some Grammer IC3000s or FISA LEANs (as SWR did), even at 2+2 that might have been worth a few quid extra.

Then again not all SWR desiros are getting the new first class seats. Some refurbished 450s certainly dont have them

 

[Bletchleyite]

The thought of LNR forking out for anything more than is absolutely necessary is frankly laughable!

Fair point, though Abellio does seem to be the only owning group that doesn't go for the cheapest option on seating - for instance the Aventras are not getting ironing boards.

 

[swt_passenger]

Then again not all SWR desiros are getting the new first class seats. Some refurbished 450s certainly dont have them

Is that the 450s where first class hasn’t been resited yet? All the refurbed 444s must be re-seated.

 

[SWRtrain_fan]

Is that the 450s where first class hasn’t been resited yet? All the refurbed 444s must be re-seated.

Then again not all SWR desiros are getting the new first class seats. Some refurbished 450s certainly dont have them

Yes that's right.

 

[RealTrains07]

Is that the 450s where first class hasn’t been resited yet? All the refurbed 444s must be re-seated.

I saw at northam, relocated first class on a 450 with the old first class seats

 

[Bletchleyite]

I saw at northam, relocated first class on a 450 with the old first class seats

I don't think any of the 450s are getting the FISA LEANs, just the 444s, which were downgraded from 2+1 to 2+2 so might as well get an upgraded seat.

 

[RealTrains07]

I don't think any of the 450s are getting the FISA LEANs, just the 444s, which were downgraded from 2+1 to 2+2 so might as well get an upgraded seat.

Why not though? Doesnt make sense if you ask me. You wouldnt see that if LNR bring in new first class seats

 

[swt_passenger]

Why not though? Doesnt make sense if you ask me. You wouldnt see that if LNR bring in new first class seats

Thinking about it again, why would they actually need any new first class seats for 450s if they had 127 sets of 24 to reduce to 16 per unit? It makes little sense to use different seats.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Thinking about it again, why would they actually need any new first class seats for 450s if they had 127 sets of 24 to reduce to 16 per unit? It makes little sense to use different seats.

And to be fair 2+2 is better than 3+2, even if the seats are not the best (not the worst either).

 

[RailWonderer]

Very nice pictures, if you're too tall I can imagine bonking your head on that metal screen frame. I'm surprised they didn't get rid of the blue panels, doesn't suit the rest of the trains mute colors. Anyway a large improvement. Is the new moquette less comfortable? Also will the 350/4s get a similar refurb?
Makes a 360 look very barebones in comparison.

 

[RealTrains07]

Very nice pictures, if you're too tall I can imagine bonking your head on that metal screen frame. I'm surprised they didn't get rid of the blue panels, doesn't suit the rest of the trains mute colors. Anyway a large improvement. Is the new moquette less comfortable? Also will the 350/4s get a similar refurb?
Makes a 360 look very barebones in comparison.

350/4s as well as 350/3s will be given the same treatment

all they need is to change the panel and wall colours so they are not blue and replace the stickers with new ones (SWR managed to do that for the most part)

 

[NoMorePacers]

Very nice pictures, if you're too tall I can imagine bonking your head on that metal screen frame. I'm surprised they didn't get rid of the blue panels, doesn't suit the rest of the trains mute colors. Anyway a large improvement. Is the new moquette less comfortable? Also will the 350/4s get a similar refurb?
Makes a 360 look very barebones in comparison.

I’d hope they wouldn’t change the First Class seats on the 350/4s. That is more of a proper first class, at least that I’m aware of.

 

[RealTrains07]

I’d hope they wouldn’t change the First Class seats on the 350/4s. That is more of a proper first class, at least that I’m aware of.

Maybe at least replace the covers

 

[Ladder23]

what's the circumstances with the plain grey ones? are they getting a livery in time or not

 

[pt_mad]

I'm surprised they didn't get rid of the blue panels, doesn't suit the rest of the trains mute colors. Anyway a large improvement.

Would the blue door panels have to have been spray painted? If there would be any chance of scuffing chipping or peeling probably best left as is.

350/4s as well as 350/3s will be given the same treatment

all they need is to change the panel and wall colours so they are not blue and replace the stickers with new ones (SWR managed to do that for the most part)

Perhaps the stickers could possibly be replaced at the same time the train is revinyled on the outside? It's all vinyl after all?

 

[NewSt]

what's the circumstances with the plain grey ones? are they getting a livery in time or not

Yes, they are.

 

[RealTrains07]

1 year since northampton open day. At least LNR has come a long way since then

 

[Bletchleyite]

1 year since northampton open day. At least LNR has come a long way since then

If you count getting a lot worse....?

 

[Flinn Reed]

350/4s as well as 350/3s will be given the same treatment

all they need is to change the panel and wall colours so they are not blue and replace the stickers with new ones (SWR managed to do that for the most part)

Can't be too difficult to do - GWR repainted all blue interior panels in 150s/158s etc to grey and it makes a big difference.

Not too impressed by LNR's 350 refurbishment - would look much better if the main moquette was applied to the entire seat (instead of the plain grey sections), and with blue panels repainted to green or grey, London Midland vinyls removed, and possibly with fewer of the new screens. West Midlands Trains did a much better job refurbishing the ex-Overground 172s in my opinion, as did SWR with their similar 450s.

There seems to be a slight lack of consistency with LNR's refurbishments - for example, the 230s have a white-based livery instead of silver, and with mint green interior poles instead of the dark green in the 350s/730s.

 

[Bletchleyite]

would look much better if the main moquette was applied to the entire seat (instead of the plain grey sections)

I don't agree. A leather headrest looks the best (see the SWR refurbs), and is easiest to keep clean, but if that's not an option having it a different colour does give that effect.

 

[RealTrains07]

Can't be too difficult to do - GWR repainted all blue interior panels in 150s/158s etc to grey and it makes a big difference.

Not too impressed by LNR's 350 refurbishment - would look much better if the main moquette was applied to the entire seat (instead of the plain grey sections), and with blue panels repainted to green or grey, London Midland vinyls removed, and possibly with fewer of the new screens. West Midlands Trains did a much better job refurbishing the ex-Overground 172s in my opinion, as did SWR with their similar 450s.

There seems to be a slight lack of consistency with LNR's refurbishments - for example, the 230s have a white-based livery instead of silver, and with mint green interior poles instead of the dark green in the 350s/730s.

Technically SWR doesnt need to change the blue panels since they work with the colour scheme of the brand

 

[Bletchleyite]

There seems to be a slight lack of consistency with LNR's refurbishments - for example, the 230s have a white-based livery instead of silver, and with mint green interior poles instead of the dark green in the 350s/730s.

TBH I'd just put that down to sloppiness, a lack of attention to detail and a lack of general competence, something which pervades the TOC as a whole, not just the question of what colour the trains should be painted.

 

[Pumbaa]

It’s on the 0534 Euston to Liverpool this morning if anyone needs it.

Second time on it. Thoughts the same - poor quality of finish overall, fabric covers are loose and not flush to the cushion. The remaining dark blue panelling jars somewhat. And the half arsed removal of the Guards office is poor, if SWR could manage the full removal there’s no reason WMT couldn’t either other than £££. I remain unconvinced of the benefit of a large luggage rack in only one place when 75% of the rest of the train has nothing. And the new digital screens are just a little too low so they become a second headrest if you’re over 6’.

Credit where due though, the plug sockets on the back of the seat facing you rather than underneath your own seat are far preferable and the overall refresh looks quite classy.

 

[Grumpy Git]

I used the LM 06:34 LIV to Euston yesterday which was unfortunately a 350/2. Is there any plan to convert these to 2+2 seating like 350/1's, because they are horrible for a 4 hour journey (despite otherwise being very good trains). The window seats are particularly bad due to the big heating duct at floor level.

 

[TH172341]

I used the LM 06:34 LIV to Euston yesterday which was unfortunately a 350/2. Is there any plan to convert these to 2+2 seating like 350/1's, because they are horrible for a 4 hour journey (despite otherwise being very good trains). The window seats are particularly bad due to the big heating duct at floor level.

No plans in place to reduce them to 2+2 as they will be leaving London Northwestern once the new Bombardier Aventra fleet for them start to enter operational service.